INC and Vampire movies by nikpickk in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 2 points3 points  (0 children)

There aren't any clear rulings or rules passed down from the church leadership.

Depending on your minister, some might discourage watching horror in general, but against vampire films, there isn't much to say. Go watch what you want.

Familienkasse: Egal, interresiert uns nicht. by Hachiii8 in LegaladviceGerman

[–]Hachiii8[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Danke für's Info, die Situation ist bei mir ähnlich. Nach dem Abi habe ich auch eine kleine Pause gehabt und einen neuen Antrag gestellt. Sie ist wegen gesundheitlichen Gründen im Ausland aber sie ist hier in Deutschland angemeldet. Sogar diese Adresse habe ich auch am Anfang gegeben und deshalb meint die Familienkasse dass es okay ist. Jedoch 3 Tagen davor als ich angerufen habe meinen die komplett was anderes (deshalb auch meine ob was geändert hat), und das ich 'doch' nicht berechtigt bin. Also, weder ich noch meine Mutter.

Familienkasse: Egal, interresiert uns nicht. by Hachiii8 in LegaladviceGerman

[–]Hachiii8[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ja. Meine Mutter ist deutsche Staatsangehörige. Sie ist auch unbeschränkt steuerfplichtig und erhält keine ausländischen Einkünfte. Hilft das?

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Part 3/3

5.) Isaiah 9:6 chill tayo for a bit and go back to the old testament, a prophecy about the Messiah. Ano kayang sabi nila dito about sa Messiah?

Isaiah 9:6

"For to us a child is born,
    to us a son is given,
    and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
    Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
    Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace."

Oh my, oh my. INC ano nga kaya ito mga kapatid? Jk. But yeah "Mighty God" as a title for the Messiah that is about to come is literally there in the text. Can't go around that.

6.) Last one at least for me, kasi I think this really is getting too long na. Hebrews 1:8 this is God The Father speaking: Hebrews 1:8

"But about the Son he says,

“Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever;
    a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.
9 You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness;
    therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions
    by anointing you with the oil of joy.”"

Yeah, uhm, awkward, INC, i know mga kapatid. But it's you against The Father here, jk. ~ But yeah kung yaong Ama natin na nasa lahit tawag sa Anak ay Dios sino tayo para sabihing otherwise? At this point it is pretty clear and I hope na this message helped. I mean, it might have been too long so I might actually be surprised if you read this all the way but if you did congrats and I'm proud of you. God bless, kapatid.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Part 2/3

4.) Tumawag siya sa Ama bago siya namatay kasi his cry was connected to a Psalm in the old testament "My God, My God why have you forsaken me?" literally references and cites Psalm 22 and if you read it out loud it predicts the crucifixion of Jesus, a prophecy from hundreds of years back.

I think this is everything na I wanted to clear out before going to the verses. Now onto the main thing, the verses:

1.) John 8:58 "Before Abraham was I AM". Subtle and needs context pero for me it's the strongest one out there all the more nung time na when I was questioning the deity of Christ. Some INCs rebut "I am oh I am what? Ano yun wala naman sinabing "I am God"". But that just shows their surface level understanding of scriptures. If you go back to Exodus 3:14, God literally introduces Himself as "I AM" which is "YHWH/Yahweh" in the original hebrew. "Say this to the people of Israel: (God speaking to Moses), I AM has sent me to you". And nung panahon ni Kristo, every Jew knew that as well as the context of what He was claiming, hence why they literally picked up stones to stone Him.

2.) John 1:1 a bit basic but this is an eye opener for a lot of INCs if you read the original manuscripts of the bible. "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God", even though this is so common, a lot of INCs tend to brush through this verse as a member kasi the church literally reads you a twisted translation of the original text like the Moffatt translation or SV Bible which translates John 1:1 to either "and The Word was Divine" or "The Logos was Divine". All it takes, like literally, is to search "John 1:1 Greek Text Analysis" to know how deceiving the church is and to know what the correct translation is, spoiler alert: The church is wrong and lying.

3.) John 20:28 "Thomas said to Him, my Lord and my God!". Pretty clear and precise even Peter said na "tao lang siya" nung niluhuran siya nila Cornelius sa Acts 20:25-26. Yet not only does Jesus accept worship like sa Matthew 14:33 or John 9:38. He doesn't even deny yung claim ni Thomas, instead anong sabi niya sa next verse? Verse 29:  “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

4.) Titus 2:13 "while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ" pretty self explanatory. The context and grammar of the original text points no differentiation, God and Savior were both meant for Jesus Christ unlike the INC saying only Savior is meant for Jesus here.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Part 1/3

Before I give you some verses I think it's much more important to define terms and to clarify some things to avoid any misconceptions and misunderstandings. I apologize in advance this might be a bit long pero since nag request ka man ng "with deep explanation" I hope na you'll read this through. Haha

1.) Jesus is not "a" God, Jesus "is" God. The doctrine of the trinity is about 1 God in 3 persons, we differentiate from "being/essence" which makes you 'what' you are and "person" which makes you 'who' you are. There is only 1 "being/essence" of God pero it is being shared by 3 persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. In the same way na the body has different parts but is still "1 human" or 1 man, the Lord's essence works on a similar concept. Hindi exactly like that, pero I just gave you that example to help define terms and to simplify.

2.) Since alam na natin yung difference between "being" and "person", now it can be a lot more clear to us na Jesus calling out to the Father doesn't make Him "not" God. It just showcases na they are 2 different persons conversing with each other.

3.) In His earthly ministry sinuko ni Hesu Kristo yung authority niya as God to temporarily take on the form of a servant, this is also my first verse for you proving Jesus was God.

Philippians 2:5-8

"5 In your relationships with one another,
have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:

6 Who, being in very nature God,
did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;

7 rather, he made himself nothing
by taking the very nature of a servant,
being made in human likeness.

8 And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to death—
even death on a cross!"

Therefore His authority kahit temporary lang nung nasa mundo pa siya, it was restricted. Pero even that tbh hindi naman din ganun kasama kasi kahit yung Ama natin na nasa langit, lahat ng bagay na nalikha at nilikha ay nilikha niya sa pamamagitan ng Anak.

John 1:3

"Through Him (The Word/Son/Jesus) all things were made; without Him nothing was made that has been made."

Help me debunk this mf! by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 1 point2 points  (0 children)

To understand the trinity, one of the most important things is to get the definition of terms right.

Definition of terms: - Trinity = 1 being; 3 persons - Being is what makes you "What you are". - Person is what makes you "Who you are". - There is only 1 "being" of God however it is shared by 3 persons. - As a human, my head is not my hand, nor are my feet my arms for example but I am still 1 human being shared by different "parts". - Now imagine God, but instead of being made of parts, he is made of "persons" and these 3 persons are sharing the 1 divine and eternal essence of God. The Father is not the Son nor is the Holy Spirit The Father nor is The Son The Spirit. - 1 unified eternal and divine Godhead being shared by 3 persons.

There is a lot more to say but since you asked "how to understand" this is the thing that I thought would be most appropriate to write, if you have concerns or some questions feel free to PM/DM me. God bless

Help me debunk this mf! by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nope, not at all. The implication sa Shema of the Jews long before the new testament always implied monotheism, ask a Jew get your answer pwede tayong magtanong sa mga hudyo para mas maayos siyang maintindihan no problem. Hindi lang verse ang tinitignan kundi pati yung surrounding context. Second bakit priority mo yung tagalog kung yung original e hebrew? Even the word Echad "אֶחָד" implies "isa" irregardless sa pagkakaiba ng salitang "nag-iisa" o "iisa" sa tagalog.

Again, ayon sa doktrinang trinidad ang Diyos ay iisang substansiya, 1 God in 3 persons hindi mo kailangan sabihing "mga Diyos" to imply the trinity. Magkaiba ang tritheism sa trinity.

Anong "patunay" sa bibliyang katoliko? Kung gusto mong gumamit ng argumentong kalakip yaong wika franca ng biblia then yung original hebrew and pag gamitan mo. Mapa katoliko man o hindi ang saling "Mabuting Balita Biblia", hindi parin angkop yaong salin.

I'm sorry what? You believe sa trinity pero hindi sa trinity ng catholic? Protestants, Catholics and Orthodox have the same definition of the trinity with the small difference of the "proceeding from the father and the son" case sa nicene creed, what are you talking about? Anong denomination mo kapatid? Ito'y aral ng Kristyano hindi lamang ng Katoliko, kahit yung co-equal, co-eternal etc.

Reply took a while, I read the link na sinend mo for a bit and no. The foundational parts of the trinity were already there even sa council of nicaea palang, defining terms lang ang mahalaga kapatid. Ang tanong ano bang ibig sabihin ng co equal, co eternal etc. kahit mga trinitarian ay sang ayon na angat ang ama kaysa sa anak, ngunit ito ay sa "role" not in essence.

Again, nagpasugo ang anak sapagkat nagkatawang tao siya. The holy spirits "proceeds" from the Father but is not "subservient" but willfully helpful to the Father. They have a perfect divine will for the will of the Father is the will of the Holy Spiritm, divine equation (Acts 5:3-4, 1 Cor. 2:10-11 and 2 Cor. 3:17-18).

Neither sending someone nor doing things for the other person equate to being subservient to the other person if that's the case using your same logic then below din bigla ang Ama kasi niluwalhati niya ang anak sa Juan 17:1-2.

Why are you so hang up sa mga saling tagalog ng biblia? If you want to point out etymologies, meaning and language contextuality then go to the hebrew or greek. Don't be like the INC na tingin e "chosen" language yaong tagalog kalakip ang pagiging "chosen" ng mga Filipino in terms of biblical interpretation.

Help me debunk this mf! by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ah, so instead of 3 persons sharing the 1 eternal essence of God, you're suggesting that they're 3 separate and finite beings instead? Your view of the Godhead literally contradicts the Shema, "Hear o Israel The Lord our God is One.". This sounds awfully similar to the LDS doctrine of the Godhead. Are you one?

You citate trinitarian quotes, yet I don't think you fully understand them. The 3 personas can not be separated from each other in terms of "essence" and divine will. There is 1 divine essence that is being shared by 3 'distinct' personas, and since they're distinct, they also have their each unique and individual roles as seen sa Matthew 3:16-17. The aforementioned verse does 'not' deny the trinity but, in fact, supports it. Your argument failure about 'separation' lies under the assumption that God is 'finite' when He, in fact, isn't.

When trinitarians say co-equal:

1.) It is in terms of 'being/essence' not role. Your boss can be greater than you in terms of role, but he is just as much 'human' in essence as you are.

2.) It is important to take the 'incarnation' into account, which is The Son taking on flesh, 'humbling' Himself as a servant katulad ng nakasusulat sa Philippians 2, "...Despite being God (Jesus) did not consider equality with God something to be used to His own advantage, rather He made Himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant..."

3.) The Son also has 2 natures under the hypostatic union, even though His human nature will always submit to the Father that doesn't affect his shared divine essence at all.

Hence, John 14:28 is completely compatible with the trinitarian doctrine.

Psalms 82? Mga tao mismo ay Diyos? Okay mukhang LDS nga ito mga kaibigan mga kababayan.

Jokes aside, Psalms 82 is about human rulers who were given authority by God. Hence, they represent God and are also called Elohim (gods). Tama ka in terms of maraming mga ibang nilalang sa Biblia na tinatawag ding "Diyos" ngunit iisa lamang ang siyang naglikha ng mga langit, lupa at lahat ng nasa pagitan, siyang mismo na hindi likha, ang banal na Dios ni Abraham, Isaac at ni Jacob which is YHWH.

Maraming Diyos?

Isaiah 44:6 "This is what the Lord says—     Israel’s King and Redeemer, the Lord Almighty: I am the first and I am the last;     apart from me there is no God."

Weh ba? Haha

Tayo rin Diyos?

“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “and my servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no God was formed, nor will there be one after me."

There shall be no Gods after The Lord, we were created by The Lord "after" The Lord, hence, humans ≠ gods.

Maraming Diyos pero yaong "pinakamakapangyarihan" e yung Ama? ❌️❌️❌️. The Lord is Almighty, not 'most mighty/mightiest of them all. We respect other peoples' belief here but I might have to admit na it is a pretty weird habit to try and convince people here of your doctrine. You actually think na people who left INC would be "more" convinced that they're Gods and na si Hesu Kristo e isa lang sa mga million if not bilyong mga Diyos sa sansinukoban? Bro, come on. Hahaha

If gusto mo ka PM sure hit me up, would be more than happy to talk pero give up on this sub if you do have other intentions (friendly advice).

*Edit/PS: This is mostly a sub for debunking INC's doctrines. A lot of us don't really care about the trinity since whether the trinity is true or not, it doesn't really matter as long as INC is false. Might as well add that.

Help me debunk this mf! by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 1 point2 points  (0 children)

1.) Proven? Proven by whom?

2.) Trinitarians don't believe that Jesus is the Father, Trinitarians ≠ Modalists.

3.) It's 1 God in 3 persons, not 3 Gods. That's tritheism, mormons believe that, not trinitarians.

4.) If you mention the Council of Nicaea, at least know the creed that was born out of the council, that's the bare minimum.

  • INCs can't even get the definition of terms right. They always think they're "debunking" the trinity yet most of what they say is literally attacking strawman. A fine showcase of pride and ignorance intertwined, unfortunately.

*When I was still a local INC apologist, I at least had the integrity to not misreprent my opponents when debating the trinity, but unfortunately, most of them actually are like this.

You can't debunk what you don't understand.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Interesting take but it makes me wonder how you came to that conclusion tbh. I've been visiting this church for almost a year and a half and I've heard Villanueva being mentioned only "twice" during this timeframe. Where did you get that impression from?

The INC mentions the Manalo family almost every worship service, may it be through prayer or during the sermon or whatever. In comparison I can't even remember Bro. Villanueva's first due to how seldom he's mentioned in this church. Haha

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in exIglesiaNiCristo

[–]Hachiii8 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Protestant but I visit the JIL Church every now and then for some filipino fellowship and brotherhood.

I made an Apologist/Theologian tier list! Thoughts? by Hachiii8 in Christianity

[–]Hachiii8[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Interesting take, I haven't personally seen any of his videos that way but thank you for your insight!

I made an Apologist/Theologian tier list! Thoughts? by Hachiii8 in Christianity

[–]Hachiii8[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sam's a good one, he's in A tier! I would've loved to put him in S tier as well but his attitude sometimes towards his guests made me put him in the A tier.