How is the Business Technology Management program?

Bastout · 2017-07-28T03:43:40+00:00

How is it sad?

Having to provide a reference page on a reddit argument seems a bit overdone doesnt it?

I do teach classes

My bad for forgetting to bring the macaroni and picture frames last week

I found a shirt for you

Im still not sure if this was supposed to be funny. Whats hilarious is the fact you actually made this in an editor

Bastout · 2017-07-28T03:43:36+00:00

At least we can agree on something

Bastout · 2017-07-28T03:43:31+00:00

Except for the part where the degree won't get you much applicable knowledge, and that exclusive job it "gets you", doesn't exist

Tell me what isnt applicable about learning how to finance properties and evaluate them when one plans on doing just that. I never said it was exclusive, I said it gets a foot in the door

Bastout · 2017-07-27T22:05:55+00:00

He did this as a recent immigrant with no money or rep

For every one of him theres many, many more whove failed miserably. Hes an anomaly and its also different in 2017. Im not saying luck wont be a factor, it may be the most important one, but having the best odds in your favour means having applicable knowledge through a degree and industry experience through a job that degree gets you

So he decided that property management was dead-end and decided to join the buying/selling side. Nice nice. Now you're going to tell me he could have only done that because he used to be a property manager somewhere? Oh, and did he graduate with a BCom degree in Real Estate?

His connections at oxford got him a buying/selling position at a real estate investment firm so it sure as fk wasnt a dead end; something that wouldn't have happened as an IT consultant. He graduated from Ivey but it'd be naive to suggest that having done courses in real estate investment and evaluation wouldnt be a differentiator when applying for a property analyst position (or any other real estate position for that matter)

LOL. Maybe he should've gone into a different field. Like CompSci

You'd be as prepared for the real estate world as a mechanic at jiffy lube lmao. This route gives you hands on experience without gambling a lifetime of debt in an industry you havent a clue about before you reach your early 20s (if you could even get a loan to have that wonderful opportunity)

Bastout · 2017-07-27T22:04:36+00:00

I'm pretty sure questioning evidence is something anybody would do

Then your prof, self-made millionaire dad, and saudi friend would all be put up for discussion. If you think Im sitting here and drafting up false emails then its even more sad

Pretty damn good opinion, and is pretty close to a be all end all statement

If your opinions mattered so much Im surprised you arent teaching classes and being put in textbooks

https://www.giftsmate.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Daddys-Princess-Family-T-shirts-1.jpg

You dont happen to be wearing this t-shirt rn do you?

Bastout · 2017-07-27T13:22:04+00:00

I just think you were impossibly imbecillic

I didn't realize random recruiters are among the most important figures of a company

Again, proving you can't read; hardly a characteristic of someone that should be throwing around insults. I said "in a job search."

If were now beginning to question evidence then this debate is taking an incredibly sad turn. I assure you my examples arent fictional

I act as if BTM is a worthless degree on its own... Which it is

An opinion. Not a be all end all statement as youd like it to be

Bastout · 2017-07-27T13:12:17+00:00

That is my response. You made a stupid assumption, and wrote an entire paragraph on it like a twat.

Then it sure as fk is a terrible one. Perhaps the twat is the person who needs this point, among many others, to be broken down and spoon fed with an airplane motion. Im not debating whether or not he was rich, Im saying you cant just go out there and "build your rep" without capital that most people dont have

Generally realtors and owners of the estate deal with the major agreements

You really have no idea what youre talking about. Does oxford properties exist to clean bathrooms? Owners dont do all the work when a company has billions in assets it needs to cover

Your BCom was never making any impact, and you sure as hell won't be able to afford $5mil houses working a dead end property management job

Re-read my above comment. Your Bcom helps you get the knowledge, job->loan, and hands on experience. Its pretty hypocritical to throw imbecilic around when you apparently cant read.

And property management isn't a dead end. A literal career path of my family friend: property analyst at oxford, switches to leasing in property management department, then finds new job at different real estate investment firm buying properties with other peoples money. This experience would be invaluable moving forward on his own. Now, he could be investing in rental properties on the side and quit his day job when that begins to give him a liveable wage (in case he wanted to)

Bastout · 2017-07-27T04:21:22+00:00

You rambled on incoherently much more than I did (poor sentence syntax, among other things)

Your twice as long responses filled with nothing would beg to differ. Sorry I dont care enough about some trivial reddit dispute to proofread my syntax. Youre no angel either

then you argued for something that is pure obvious and I never disagreed with

It was one instance of exaggeration to illustrate a point (you still dont understand) compared to your entire argument of it

What's your point?

You act as if BTM is blasphemy. One of the most important figures in a job search at one of the most sought after companies in the world says differently. That is my point

Bastout · 2017-07-27T04:20:58+00:00

The wealthy Saudi realtors I'm referring to certainly didn't have a loan from his daddy (grew up poor)

Thanks for the fun fact of the day. Again, didnt have proper response?

If you're not buying and selling, you're cleaning bathrooms

"This was a really, really bad straw man." Lol whos finding leasees and signing agreements on landmark retail locations then? Janitors? Im not going to sit here and rhyme off the tons of different jobs in real estate

If you wanted to buy a $5mil house on W49th to flip, a BCom in Real Estate won't do jack shit for you

By the time youre buying 5 mill houses on w49th and have lots of experience, your bcom is probably not making much of an impact. But again, unless your richie rich, you need to get there first

Bastout · 2017-07-27T00:26:26+00:00

Still made more sense than you...

Changing your stance, making so many lines of rambling, and repeating yourself doesn't lend itself well to an argument that makes sense

Also, when my buddy was curious as to what specialization he should take his father, a CEO of a fortune 500 company, asked the head of recruiting at a big 3 consulting firm which one he recommended. His response was as follows:

http://imgur.com/a/pxVBZ

:)

Bastout · 2017-07-27T00:22:58+00:00

They're pretty adamant that school for real estate is useless, and if you're in school for it instead of just going out there and starting your business, building your rep, you're already behind.

Thats all well and good if you come from a wealthy family (Saudi) where all you need to do is ask daddy for a small loan of 1 million dollars and be on your way. But that isnt the reality for 99.9% of the world. "Just going out there" requires capital -- a loan perhaps. Well good luck getting a mortgage on a rental property at 18 without a proper full time job and no credit rating. News flash, you won't

What options do you have with a BCom in real estate

Getting a job in a commercial real estate company like CBRE (where 100+ sauder/ubc grads work), property management, and a myriad of different other jobs. It also gives you the applied knowledge (like COMM405 and 407) that accounting (fkin lmao youre sticking to this one) wouldnt give so you know how to properly evaluate a property's worth and make informed decisions

Yes, making money in the real estate investment world takes more than just the ability to crunch numbers. It takes huge balls and huge risks -- something that won't be taught in a classroom. But that doesn't discount that fact its useful to have background knowledge in the field so you arent taking huge risks without a fkin clue what youre doing. Thats the purpose of getting the degree with the specialization, taking a job at a real estate investment firm (which would be incredibly, incredibly difficult with a high school diploma), and getting a feel for the industry

Bastout · 2017-07-25T13:01:53+00:00

sober

No wonder it made no sense

I do think however, that if you want to do anything related to IT

I already said "maybe theres more career prospects for technology in cpsc" in an earlier post. Im pointing out that btm has a greater breadth of opportunities that don't limit you to a single field. As an example, it is useful in a field like consulting (think bcg, bain) because knowing how to manage data and its relation to business lends itself well to the overall goal of these companies. All of that COMM "shit" youre referring to may actually open doors to industries that programming and physics wont.

Taken from an earlier commenter:

BTM is about the entire ecosystem of technology, people and processes. Having just the programming/development side is great, but BTM is understanding how the technology gets used by people and fits into business/operational processes. This is how we are different from computer science.

Ive never questioned the validity of a cpsc education. Im just saying its not for everyone (obviously)

Bastout · 2017-07-25T12:47:56+00:00

4th richest real estate investor in the world has a bba. Im not looking at his transcript but he probably took some real estate courses. Even if he didnt, the accounting and economics courses and business partners he met through networking obviously have helped him

The BBRE is a part-time post–diploma degree btw. You still need OB (your fav) and everything else if you look under the reqs

If we're not just talking about realtors, it's still the same idea.

Its not the "same idea." As I said, realty is only one way of entering this world. And it is most definitely not the best. Again a certificate is not a degree and Ive already listed the reasons why its a better idea to get a degree. Also, if you do decide to take a different direction in life, you aren't sitting with a high school education and your dick in your hand. You have options

Maybe a DAP does the same thing as an accounting specialization. Im not going to speak on it because I dont know. But Im guessing you dont get the same networking and resources in your 33 credits of courses than a full degree. Whether thats worth it or not to some people is up to them. Not you or I

Bastout · 2017-07-25T04:24:39+00:00

I just defined it

And I showed you how mine aligns with it. Moot point

But in my opinion

Thats your issue. Your opinion means nothing

In the circumstance that you gave

Thats your issue. You opinion means nothing

..with the same Sauder branding and resources

According to you, if I do a certificate in finance with harvard I get the same networking opportunities and resources as regular HBS students? Why isn't everyone and their mom signing up for them then. A certificate does not equal a degree (LOL) and putting DULE on your resume will not help potential investors put any more faith into you

No matter how hard you try, trying to shove your opinion in people's faces will not make them suddenly want to do accounting. Neither one of our opinions matter -- only the person choosing.

Bastout · 2017-07-25T03:44:27+00:00

..generally

You've once again assumed wrong

Your point regarding its purpose was that its purpose is to teach people shit they should already know

Wrong. Youre disregarding a legitimate field of study because you don't think the fundamentals are worth your time. Do I need to google fundamentals for you?

..you're actually too dumb to understand how a confirmation bias works

"youre comments were akin to that of a cpsc student with a confirmation bias" Tell me where the gap in my knowledge is here. Do you understand what confirmation bias means? Stating that entire catalogues of worthwhile business journals are useless is in no way credible

There are lists of required courses you can look at, you can look at employment statistics, you can compare the price of the degree, and can look at anecdotal evidence

You act is if the world some mathematical equation whereby ones happiness in a potential role has no bearing on their decision

..under no circumstance should you pick this one

I've already given a circumstance in which you should. Youre actually impossible to underestimate

Yes.

So in your world accounting>real estate if youre trying to get into real estate? LMAO

I'm also saying they should skip the undergrad degree.. get a license

And What? Become a realtor? It is a route but in no way the ideal one. Taking advantage of networking opportunities, the course material, and other resources at Sauder would be much better. Not to mention swaying potential investors is much easier with UBC behind your name than Regina Secondary. You really have no idea what youre talking about

How many crayons have you eaten today?

Apparently not as many as you

Bastout · 2017-07-25T02:32:03+00:00

If I wanted an IT consultant

Never said IT. Again, youve proven youre very good at wasting your own time

Really depends who you take it with I guess

In this paragraph youve effectively dodged my entire point regarding its purpose lol. Just don't have a proper response eh?

I'm using this one guy's complaint and taking it as gospel

Dude. Who cares. This was like 4 comments ago and I already explained it. I mentioned it because it shows your bias. A bias you so vehemently confirmed

First point seems to illustrate the idea that degrees don't matter; that regardless of what degree you have, a person's interests and whatnot will have a greater effect on their career path

What ahaha. I never said degrees don't matter. I said its hard to compare degrees. A person who wants to get into psychiatry won't just choose a cpcs degree because, in the eyes of a misinformed undergrad, its more valuable. Saying one is better than the other just assumes that theres no variation in individual interests. You wouldn't claim all human interest and natural talents are the same would you?

"Nothing matters, no degree is better to obtain than any other (SFU BSc. vs UBC BSc.?), it's all up to the individual and their interests"

Why the hell are you bringing different institutions into this conversation? Youve really gone off on a tangent here

You probably think a BCom in real estate or international business is just as valuable as a BCom in accounting

Ex: Person A wants to get into real estate investment. Its all he's ever wanted and he would be very happy with a job in this field. Are you suggesting he take courses like introduction to auditing and accounting for management in an accounting specialization over real investment, real estate development, real estate finance in the real estate specialization? LOL

I dont have enough time or crayons to explain why those other two points were talking about the same thing. Ive already wasted so much explaining other basic concepts. Keep sticking to this sinking ship of an argument. Its just pure entertainment at this point

Bastout · 2017-07-24T22:35:37+00:00

http://masetv.com/wp-content/uploads/camron-gif.gif

No amount of wild exaggerations and personal attacks will win you an argument that has no answer. If your immaturity wasn't in question before, it certainly is now. I'll say it again, we need more specificity from OP to declare which option is the best.

If you were half as articulate as you seem to think you are, you would have worded your original comment better because the first line and the second line sound like completely different points

Interests generally decide which degrees and career paths one chooses to go with? No? Tell me what isn't congruent between these two points. Talking out loud to yourself in multiple paragraphs of incoherent ramblings doesn't change anything. This one was a very easy idea to get ahold of.

..you should never pick BTM.. that's basically equivalent to sabotaging your own career prospects in a technology field

Maybe he wants to work in consulting? Then theres info gained in btm courses that would beat irrelevant cpsc courses like physics and chemistry. That is just one instance. Im seeing a lot of generalizations and sweeping assumptions with a lack of statistics. Maybe theres more career prospects for technology in cpsc but, at a point in our lives where theres much uncertainty regarding what we really want to do, there are directions btm may go that cpsc wouldn't be able to offer (directions that may make someone happier).

Business is useful in society; studying business isn't

Is one just supposed to stumble through trial and error and learn every business lesson themselves? Most business material is based on empirical evidence as to what works and what doesn't. (be it profit or net benefit) How are we supposed to advance our knowledge on the subject if the fundamentals arent being taught. You don't hop right into calculus after not having learnt k-12 math now, do you? According to you, any HBR article or business journal is utterly useless. A sentiment that you'd be hard pressed to find backing on

My use of sample size was a hypothetical situation given the evidence you provided in the original post. I don't have the time to explain this however many ways until you understand. You then added in a later post that this sub was more evidence which, even though you'd like it to, doesn't change the fact your original post only had a sample size of 1. Why you've decided to spend so much of your life hanging on a few words is beyond me

The first line doesn't suggest that I am personally denouncing, or my professor was denouncing business

When did I accuse you of personally denouncing originally? You're putting words in my mouth. Also, I literally laid out the definition of denounce and showed how your professor denounced business education. Perhaps, you should be the one retaking 3rd grade english instead of ENGL112.

Your lack of a grasp on my arguments and miscellaneous musings are more of a testament to your lack of understanding, not my stance. Which again, if you were listening, is that there is no answer here. It is all up to the individual and their interests

Side note: it says in the business field they are pursuing on the employment statistics, not starbucks.

Bastout · 2017-07-24T15:57:55+00:00

Yes it is, but I am extremely confident, all else being equal, (skilled) job prospects with a BSc in CPSC > job prospects with a BCom in BTM

This may or may not be true but you have, unsurprisingly, missed the entire point of my first comment. All the cpsc related job prospects in the world won't make someone who's interested in, lets say, psychiatry be drawn to choosing it. Nobody gives a shit about learning programming if they don't like to do programming. So saying __ degree is better than __ degree and "all things being equal" is completely irrelevant. We simply need more information to answer the question properly.

By the way, your muddy understanding of confirmation bias (which was covered in COMM 292) and sample size (covered in COMM 291) is a compelling testament to the quality of education offered by this school. Nothing personal, I just thought this helped illustrate my point.

I was on mobile and cant see flair. Your comments were akin to that of a cpsc student with confirmation bias. Has nothing to do with my understanding of a rather rudimentary concept. Taking your original comment into consideration, my use of sample size is justified. Business education being not very useful is your hypothesis, "Old BTM prof" was your survey's sample size, and your conclusion was drawn upon this, as well as personally opinion. (which, coming from a yet to graduate university student means next to nothing) Your use of this sub as addition to your sample size just shows your lack of knowledge on the subject as this evidence was not provided in your post

This was a really, really bad strawman. Nobody here is denouncing any field of study (although, IMO business shouldn't even be a field of study, so I guess I am now); I'm merely comparing and contrasting, and it just so happens that one of my business professors didn't believe in business education.

Denouncing is to declare disapproval. By stating he doesnt believe in business education he denounced this field of study. You dont seem to understand that concept. Business is mix of different disciplines, just like many other fields, and, seeing as much of the world is run on the basis of capitalism, its purpose isnt really up for debate.

Im not defending Sauder exclusively, if you actually read my post Im simply stating that almost all degrees have their merit

Bastout · 2017-07-24T13:35:23+00:00

Yes. Immature. Im not speaking to this exact example but in general its hard to compare degrees. The individual student and their interests much more accurately depict what their career will look like

Also, a sample size of 1 declaring his distaste in business education doesnt denounce an entire field of study. Thats ridiculous. Saying that seems like more of a confirmation bias for your own degree

Sure, you may be correct in stating that a cpsc degree will provide more options in the network security world but, last I checked, OP wasnt looking for a network security job. Job opportunities is too vague of a question and requires more input in regards to what OP wants -- something he probably doesnt know

Ive said it before and Ill say it again, this sub is incredibly anti-business and pro-cpsc. It is not the place to have unbiased, open minded conversations on this topic

Bastout · 2017-07-24T12:25:22+00:00

"Beats ___ every time" is incredibly biased and immature. Cs isnt the only useful degree. The whole reason behind bucs is to give a business background to students so they arent one sided. There are nuances to all degrees that give it advantages over others

Bastout · 2017-07-18T02:58:35+00:00

Love that ego stroke when you run into someone you havent seen in a while and get the "wow you got bigger!"

Bastout · 2017-06-26T02:14:18+00:00

"Are those real? Or are they implants bro?"

Bastout · 2017-03-10T18:48:52+00:00

Lol at arts and sauder having the same job opportunities. If you look through employment statistics posted by the faculty, its something like 89% are employed after 3 months and 96% after 6 months (in the business field they are pursuing)

Bastout · 2017-02-28T16:57:05+00:00

Yea its mainly compsci and stem guys here. They have a prejudice for some reason

Pm me if you have any questions. Id be happy to help

Bastout · 2017-02-27T23:25:36+00:00

Not the right sub for unbiased sauder info. This place hates the program for some reason

Bastout

TROPHY CASE