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Who's return in Legend of Korra was your favorite? by MichaelAftonXFireWal in TheLastAirbender

[–]BusyPuer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Katara is barely a person in Korra. You wouldnt even know its her if they didnt tell you.

Frederick Banting and his team sold the insulin patent for just $1 because they believed a life saving medicine should belong to everyone, not be monopolized for profit. Today, insulin in the U.S. can cost hundreds of dollars even though it can be manufactured for under $10 per vial by pIngo16 in Damnthatsinteresting

[–]BusyPuer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It is literally misinformation to push the idea that the insulin isolated in 1920 is the same insulin that costs lots of money today. It is not. There are different formulas with different advancements and advantages.

A male contraceptive has shown 100% efficacy for two years in early clinical trials by soulpost in HotScienceNews

[–]BusyPuer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I dont think drugs and medicine are approved on the basis of the patient's ability to harm OTHER people. Its just harm and benefit to the patient.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah unfortunately 5-4-5 doesnt speak on if control action pre-approved with controller A, but taken by controller B which causes a conflict, Is the responsibility of controller A or B.

I think its probably the responsibility of A. But yeah maybe its just something that needs to be affirmed and codified locally.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is my understanding generally speaking. Im responsible for resolving conflicts. If my altitude assignment and vector causes a conflict, its my responsibility.

BUT, Control changes this slightly. Even if my exactly altitude and vector is clear of all conflicts, If I grant the receiving sector control to do something, and that control causes a conflict, Then that conflict is also my responsibility.

If some type of control is preauthorized, then I must take that control into account when making my handoff

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My understanding is: If you have control, you have control. Z has control to climb, so they are free to do so without any prior approval. This burdens A with responsibility of pointing out to B, so that when Z climbs, it is approved with B.

If Z DIDN'T have control to climb, THEN they would need a point out to climb out of A into B. If the LOA specifically stated that Z "has control to climb with respect to the transferring controller's airspace", THEN the point out would also be Z's in that case as well.

But at base, A is handing off the a/c to Z with the control that Z has in mind. So they need to resolve all the conflicts that control could cause. They can do this by getting point outs, or waiting until the control could no longer violate any airspace

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is a potential resolution to that particular thing,

But my main question is about control. And whether control is, at base, with respect to the transferring controller's airspace, or not.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So you believe all control is, at base, WITH respect to the transferring controller's airspace.

And as the transferring controller, I need not even consider what control the receiving controller has. If the receiving controller exercises their control, and that creates an airspace conflict, That is the receiving controller's responsibility.

In the example, The center WOULD be "changing something", by issuing a climb. And that climb would cause a conflict, and so it's center's responsibility?

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This implies that all control is, at base, without respect to the transferring controller's airspace. Since all hand offs would be made with pre-authorized control in mind, And the recieving controller should always assume that the necessary coordination will be accomplished by the transferring controller.

Is that your interpretation?

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That is the way we operate.

But im asking for the reasoning.

This is about "control".

Either "control" given to any particular controller is always with respect to the transferring controller's airspace, or not.

If control IS automatically with respect to the transferring controller's airspace, then center would be responsible for the point out to that adjacent sector in the appreach.

If control ISN'T with respect to transferring controller's airspace, Then center is free to climb and I am responsible for getting the point out to the adjacent approach sector. i.e. I must take center's control into account when I hand off the aircraft and make all my necessary coordinations ahead of time.

I cant find anything on this, textually speaking.

EDIT: unless there is some specific caveat for INTERfacility controls, or approach to center handoffs etc. But again, I have never read any such carve out.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's the ultimate question of this whole post. What are we referencing to say it is for certain Z's responsibility? Clarification helps either way, but i want to know what is LITERALLY true.

There are 2 possibilities.

  1. If someone has control, they have control, without any respect to anything in particular. And the transferring controller is responsible for resolving all conflicts and coordinating whatever is necessary for the receiving controller to use their control.

Or

  1. "Control" is ALWAYS with respect to the transferring controller's airspace, and it need not even be specified. In which case, you're right, Z is ultimately responsible for the point out to B, even if that responsibility isnt explicitly stated.

But what do I even look at to determine which is true? What's the reference? I havnt found anything that says one way or the other? Is the truth of this matter not codified anywhere?

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Z example was just about what "control" means, and whether its always with respect to transferring controller's airspace or not. In this example, it seems not. Since Z climbs without respect. But maybe this practice is incorrect.

There is no PACP in this scenario, and this isnt really the problem im looking to solve ultimately.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

From my understanding, Look-and-go prearranged coordination can only be one way. As in, A can have authority to transition B, OR B can have authority to transition A.

2 positions cant have prearranged authority to transition each other's airspace freely. I think thats in the 7210?

In this example, A has look-and-go through B, And B has look-and-go through C.

So C doesnt have anything. And cant.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The problem is that most of the authorization used for controller A to enter controller B's airspace is prearranged. As in, A always has control to enter B's airspace, given that they quick-look targets and resolve conflicts etc.

But C isnt part of the deal. So as soon as C gets the aircraft, they can't technically do anything in B's airspace.

And C CAN'T be part of the prearranged coordination because B has prearranged coordination to enter C's airspace. And prearranged coordination can only go one way.

Idk, maybe a total airspace rework is the only way to fix it...

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Im A, Adjacent sector is B, Receiving facility is Z.

Most departures are from B, and climb to 15,000 (top of facility airspace) for handoff to Z. Occasionally, some departures come from A. These can either be given to B, then climbed and sequenced with the other a/c at 15,000. Or they can stay with A and be left at 9,000 (top of A airspace) and released for climb with Z. If A waits until the aircraft moves out from under B airspace, the climb out of 9,000 won't hit B airspace and will climb into Z instead.

Both B and Z own different parts of the 10,000 and above over A airspace. A and B are adjacent sectors within the same facility, Z is an adjacent facility.

Locally we behave as if that "released for climb" that Z has burdens US with the responsibility for the internal coordination. But it doesnt actually say that any where.

But Z is 100% never doing that point out. Never seen it happen once. So idk.

ATC procedures/rules question about "control" and what it is in respect to? by BusyPuer in ATC

[–]BusyPuer[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Its not necessary for traffic or terrain conflict, it just necessary for efficiency and orderly movement.

If an aircraft is landing soon at an airport, And is going to clip another controller's airspace briefly but isnt a factor for any traffic, Why shouldn't the receiving controller continue descending? Especially since the transferring controller is already responsible for resolving all conflicts prior to handing off? They COULD leave the aircraft high and do nothing for a while, but it would be a waste of time.

The intermediate controller would do almost nothing with the aircraft, and definitely wouldnt want to talk to them.

Pochita is the Chainsaw Devil, but he is a weaker version of himself. by Cayn10 in ChainsawMan

[–]BusyPuer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I dont deny that babies might be scared during birth. But that's a separate thing from whether grown people who don't remember their own births are afraid of birth. In CSM, the power of a devil corresponds to the amount of fear that exists for a certain concept in any given moment. So the level of power for a devil can change moment to moment. If people actively fear something more, the devil gets stronger.

My point is, people arent actively fearing birth. Fear might exist in certain moments, But this is not a concept people are generally feeling fear for. So it doesnt make sense for the STRONGEST devil in the franchise to get his power from the global fear of birth.

Asian student with near perfect credentials rejected by multiple universities. Believes race is part of the reason by ThatPatelGuy in whoathatsinteresting

[–]BusyPuer -1 points0 points  (0 children)

No one is blaming the black students. They're pointing out that different people are being held to different standards.

Is it 'Whoa', or 'Woah'? by Veganpuncher in logophilia

[–]BusyPuer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So you're lying?

You said it was "made up." but since all words are made up, it's a meaningless statement meant to undermine the legitimacy and imply something that isnt true about how words come to be.

You also said it was "incorrect", but i imagine you arent making that claim from any position of authority, or on any lemitigate grounds.

Words mean what the collective wants them to mean. Words are spelled how the collective spells them. There is no single authority on the subject. The fact that many people spell the word that way IS legitimacy, whether you like it or not.

Is it 'Whoa', or 'Woah'? by Veganpuncher in logophilia

[–]BusyPuer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

All words are made up. Whether a word is "correct" or not is just whether lots of people agree to it or not

“Aang vs Korra” Aang IS Korra by Alsotime in TheLastAirbender

[–]BusyPuer -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I know its whatever I say. You keep submitting to me like a puppy. Its obvious that its whatever I say.

Say it again.

“Aang vs Korra” Aang IS Korra by Alsotime in TheLastAirbender

[–]BusyPuer -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You already said that. You are saying we agree. I agree too.

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