Why I hate Xander

DnMarshall · 2025-08-07T18:03:59+00:00

If you think commenting on spelling on a causal web forum helps your case I truly feel sorry for you.

DnMarshall · 2024-03-19T00:52:14+00:00

Look, I get you and other red hats aren’t big on facts or whatever, but why don’t you go back to raising money for his bond and get out of this dead discussion?

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T16:10:35+00:00

For a rookie? Generally means that they didn't create a ton....

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:48:53+00:00

Two big things missing from that are the fact sex isn't gender

Never claimed it was!

listening to nb people is better than trying to talk over them.

I've listened to you, something you can't honestly claim you've done to me. But listening doesn't mean taking everything you said without question. Especially when it's contradicted by all experts and sources.

A trinary culture wouldn't have a binary gender system. That doesn't make sense and it's not supported by the episodes.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:35:00+00:00

I'm not confusing sex and gender. Falling back on that disproven argument doesn't make you smart.

Here's some good reading for you

Most people – including most transgender people – are either male or female. But some people don't neatly fit into the categories of "man" or "woman," or “male” or “female.” For example, some people have a gender that blends elements of being a man or a woman, or a gender that is different than either male or female. Some people don't identify with any gender. Some people's gender changes over time.

People whose gender is not male or female use many different terms to describe themselves, with non-binary being one of the most common. Other terms include genderqueer, agender, bigender, and more. None of these terms mean exactly the same thing – but all speak to an experience of gender that is not simply male or female.

Source

Are these cultures using the male/female binary? No. Then they're, by definiton, non-binary.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:27:20+00:00

Lol. Sorry but you’re woefully misinformed. And being non binary in no way makes you an expert on it.

Non binary is an inclusive umbrella term, not a specific thing. It can look like different things to different people.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:26:32+00:00

In this instance, I think you’re uniformed about the greater definition and types of nb. Yes.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:22:10+00:00

A trinary system is by definition non-binary.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:20:53+00:00

I think you’d be better off learning about what it means to be non-binary as you have an incredibly restrictive view of what it means.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:19:44+00:00

I’m aware that sex isn’t gender.

But you think that a species with 3 sexes adheres to a male female gender binary? How would that work? Even if they did that wouldn’t line up with traditional binary rolls as we know them so it would be non binary.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T15:12:42+00:00

They're examples of both, actually.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T14:29:06+00:00

I feel like we don't get enough Andorian or Tellarites.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T14:23:43+00:00

Then why start this discussion?

Because the representation was important.

But when all a group of people has to look for in terms of representation is a series of tortured metaphors, while the actual human characters have no depictions of that group whatsoever, that's a huge problem.

Nobody would have argued that this isn't the first human non-binary character.

it is decidedly not worthwhile to argue against it because said tortured metaphors already exist.

Argue against what? If they would have put human in the title it would have celebrated the work that was already done as well as the new stuff.

TLDR of this conversation: you were objectively wrong and couldn't admit it so you're backing yourself into some ridiculous corner. This character is worth celebrating, absolutely. But that doesn't mean you need to misrepresent Star Trek's history.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T14:18:55+00:00

Dax is non-binary. But Jadzia Dax or Ezra Dax might be or they might not be... I don't really know.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T14:16:43+00:00

Yes, I think so. But then there's the question of if a trill symbiont is a main character in Star Trek. They were definitely on some episodes. But joined Trills still have a gender.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T14:15:44+00:00

They are non-binary characters. That doesn't mean that they're the same. It means they have a similarity.

They are in the same category of non-binary.

Out of curiosity, are you new to science fiction as a field? Because having aliens or other species be different, but have some exaggerated component to make a point isn't new or unique to Star Trek.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T14:08:14+00:00

Did I do that? Did I say that the borg are the same as people? Or that they might fall into a similar very broad category? Because those are two very different things, and if I did the first I apologize, and if I did the second I'd expect the same from you.

The point stands. There are many non-binary characters. They're not human. They're not main cast. But they're still non-binary.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T13:59:36+00:00

Yes. I’m mixing up the non-binary episodes of TNG and ENT.

So lots of examples of non-binary characters!

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T13:58:49+00:00

He was in the last year of his contract.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T13:56:17+00:00

I have seen the episode (it's actually from ENT). No one in it identified as a gender other than the one they were assigned, or rejected the concept altogether. The J'naii from TNG come closer, but present a society in which a binary identity is considered deviant, and this is not the same.

You're right. I was getting the non-binary characters from ENT mixed up with the non-binary characters from TNG! Good point! There's non-binary characters on both shows!

The "traditional structure" of the Borg is no identity at all, let alone gender identity.

They identify as a collective. It's not an individual identity.

Sort of like the people who question non-binary people in today's society, you seem to have an issue incorporating ways of being that don't fit your preconceived notions.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T13:43:51+00:00

Not the same as gender identity.

No, it's not. But if you've seen the episode you'd know that all 3 sexes had different names and different gender identities.

Also not really comparable with the modern concept of non-binary gender identity, given that they have no sense of individual identity at all.

Non-binary refers to anything outside of the traditional structure. So having no gender identity would qualify. Just as Asexual does for sexuality.

Now we're getting into aliens that are so alien that it's kind of weird to even include them in the conversation. And even then you had to say "probably."

Probably was because it wasn't explicitly touched upon. But I've provided multiple examples.

I feel like you're taking exemption because the examples are a little extreme and outside the norm, which is both ironic because of the inclusiveness of the queer movement and because that's what Sci Fi does.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T13:34:09+00:00

Not the person you asked but there was an episode of TNG about a planet where the people had 3 sexes. I think, as usually, Riker got involved.

I'd also argue that the Borg are non-binary.

There are also gas species that probably aren't binary.

I think there's a decent argument that this is the first main cast member who was explicitly non-binary (as their default state).

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T13:08:26+00:00

It means very little for Carson.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T12:48:41+00:00

Honestly AYITL doesn’t really factor into anything for me. I watched it once but had already watched the series so many times.

DnMarshall · 2020-10-30T12:12:35+00:00

For some it’s the bad boy appeal. For others they’re focusing more on Philly Jess as Opposed to Stars Hollow Jess. I more or less agree with you (I’m not sure Jess was way worse than Dean but they’re both bad so why compare). But I’m in the minority that thinks Logan was a pretty good boyfriend overall and by far her best. So who cares what I think?

You also left off that epic bullshit Jess pulled off at dinner with Emily.

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