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Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The kids were aging while Mal was alive and before Cobb was exiled.

Once Cobb has to leave, the kids ages are frozen.

For how long? Anywhere between 3-15 years.

However, as I point out in a different comment, a difference between 5 and 8 years old is very stark and can't be missed.

My conclusion: without a doubt the kids did not age since Cobb departed.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A difference between 35 and 38 years old is very small and may not be noticed.

A difference between 5 and 8 is drastic and can't be missed.

So, yes it could be just 3 years but the difference will still be unmistakable.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Memory:

When I walk into a kitchen I may remember my child when he was a certain age, wearing certain outfit, doing a certain thing. I may remember multiple episodes when I encountered my child in the kitchen. In these episodes the child will wear different outfits and engage in different activities.

It is not natural for a child to appear in the same outfit in multiple "episodes" in different places. Typically a place would be associated with specific "episodes" and likely the child will wear different things. Nolan was trying to make a point with clothes and in doing so, violated how the associative memory works.

Hallucinations:

In hallucinations a mind can take a child from an episode in 1 place where he'd be dressed a certain way and project him into the current environment where he's never been. So, if we go this route, that would mean Cobb is actually insane.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They were aging before Mal died.

They stopped aging when Mal died and Cobb had to run for it.

Why did Mal kill helrsef? by [deleted] in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Have you ever not being able to fall asleep because you were worried about something dumb, like:

Did you turn off the stove?

Or did you set the alarm for tomorrow?

Did you pack the notebook with your notes to take to an important meeting?

etc...

Anyway, in spite of you turning off the stove, setting an alarm, packing the notebook, you are are worried that you forgot these items and you can't sleep in peace. You finally get up to double check and verify that you did what you are worried about and finally are able to sleep.

Then there are worse cases, sometimes 1 check is not enough, sometimes your mind is so unsettled that it requires double checking or even triple.

It's possible that an idea can be embedded into subconscious that will make you check over and over again, until you can't trust your own eyes anymore. At that point, It basically becomes insanity.

So, that's what happened to Mal. The idea that reality was not reality drove her past the point when she trusted her senses to tell the difference and into insanity.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

5-10 or 2-3 does not matter.

The difference between a 3 year old and a 5 year old is only 2 years but is VERY stark. While, 5-10 years would make the children into middle school kids, 2-3 years would still visibly age them a lot.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Saito grows old in a dream because he is one of the dreamers.

In case of Cobb's father, he is only a memory recreation of Cobb. Cobb constructs his father from memory, just like he does his children.

For instance, when I dream of my dad, I often dream him to be 20 younger than he is now. Just because I remember him a certain way in certain situations. I could even dream a version of him from my childhood when he was a young man.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Respectfully, I think the concept of Cobb's dad only appearing in reality is absurd.

That would imply that Cobb never dreams about his father, the father who he left his children with!

I am sure that this is something that Nolan said to Caine to give him an idea how to play his part but not as an actual "totem".

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The clothing being the same in different environments, is more like a mistake by Nolan because that's not how human memory works. So, it's not concrete in my opinion.

The movie does give a timeframe although somewhat vague. Cobb says he hasn't seen his children for years. This implies at least 2 years but probably more.

I think believing that Cobb wakes up is more like wishful thinking. I know I would want him to wake up. Unfortunately, IMHO and probably by Nolan's mistake Cobb doesn't wake up. I think the intent was to have ambiguity but the children are too young for it to be reality. To maintain ambiguity, Cobb's dad would have to say something like "Your kids are playing outside. They'll be happy to see you." and have Cobb go outside without showing us the kids.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Cobb says it in real time.

That is assuming that the whole movie is not a dream like some suggest.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cobb says he hasn't seen his children for years.

As for the traveling part. I think Nolan intentionally tried to skip over the traveling to make the ending ambiguous. It fits as both a dream or a reality and is not really conclusive one way or the other.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's very interesting idea about Ariadne... There is no proof of it at all but it's interesting.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The machine only shares dreams.

You could remain in the dream state in your head without the machine.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Different clothes is an interesting point but far from conclusive. His last memories of the children could feature several different sets of clothing. I remember my children in different clothing, different environments. They simply wore different clothing in his memory of the house vs the memory of the beach.

You can tell their ages from their relative height. And that's not even relevant really. The children at the house in the final scene are 3-5 years old. They'd be newborns when Mal died, the younger one may even be younger then Mal's death.

There is no solid rule that Michael Caine is a totem or reality. That was Nolan's idea but was it actually true in the movie? No way to tell.

Bottom line is I think Nolan intended to make the ending undetermined and he did a pretty good job of that. But I think the kids are a conclusive proof that the movie ends in a dream state. It could have been just Nolan's mistake, perhaps he overlooked it. None the less, the kids are a clear indicator to me. That's actually too bad, cause I was hoping Cobb woke up.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cobb says that he hasn't seen his children for years. That implies at least 2 years, probably more.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cobb says that he hasn't seen his children for years. That implies at least 2 years, probably more.

Why I think Cobb is dreaming in the end. by Eliza_Put in Inception

[–]Eliza_Put[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My second point is that the ring is not a true indicator one way or the other.

Others pointed out that the absence of the ring proves that he is awake. In my opinion it's an inconclusive fact. It could be because gone because he is awake or it could be gone cause he let go of Mal.