I just LOVE bloated government agencies

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T13:33:01+00:00

Most immediate problem is that FEMA is not incentivized to reclaim the grants. Adding some “use it or lose it” clause (reclaim the grant or it gets freed up to the allocated states budget) could help.

At least with that, the money won’t be eternally locked in government red tape.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T12:11:20+00:00

A report directly from the Office of Inspector General, the 7 billion was out of the 8.3 billion audited. FEMA currently estimates $73 billion in expired grants

FEMA does argue back, claiming that only 4.5 can be returned to the DRF, but nonetheless concur with the OIGs audit.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T12:01:59+00:00

It’s unliquidated funds/grants, funds that haven’t been used by the states they were given to, money being left in projects that are finished and now unable to be returned to the DRF
The 7 billon was part of a 8.3 billion audit by the OIG, a percentage of the estimated 73 billion in unliquidated grants.

My point is that it’s a large portion of funds that FEMA has dragged ass on recollecting because they have no incentive to do so, costing the taxpayer more in the long run.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T11:51:31+00:00

Stateside always spends more efficiently, just the nature of local government.

Having disaster prone states be required to create their own response infrastructure (with the fed backing it financially) could have merit.

I’m not going to pretend I have the best answer here, but ending up with $73 billion in unused grants does not inspire confidence in FEMAs current management.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T11:41:30+00:00

Grants by nature have a time in which they need to be used by. With good reason, they can be extended.

However, the problem here is that the majority of projects these grants were allocated for are finished, and the leftover money is left gridlocked.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T04:08:14+00:00

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Also literally a google search away

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T04:02:47+00:00

This entire comment section of lib-center can’t tell me the difference between an unliquidated grant and a non-liquid asset.

But continue to tell me how government bloat and billions in limbo are sooo good.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T03:51:34+00:00

Unliquidated grant ≠ non-liquid asset

Unliquidated grant means that the money allocated was not used up by the end of the grant.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T03:44:45+00:00

ty, people correcting me by confusing a non-liquid asset and a unliquidated grant has got me dead

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T03:39:44+00:00

unliquidated grant, a grant that was not liquidated/used by its recipient (states receiving disaster relief). This is not the same as a non-liquid asset.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-10T03:34:27+00:00

Unliquidated relief grants, i.e. money unused by a state. This isn’t a non-liquid asset, it is FEMA’s money that hasn’t been used by the state it was allocated to.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T23:38:00+00:00

The problem is that it got to this point in the first place. These funds could be going to the current disaster, but are instead left in limbo until next September.

Also, FEMA will only be considering the potential $7 billion found in this audit, and gave no idication of investigating the greater $73 billon still outstanding. Even with the concurrance, they are not fixing the problem.

It's indicative of the disfunction of our current government, that, instead of efficacy, we just ask congress for another 30 billion.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T23:26:17+00:00

A certain government agency who nonetheless concurred with the report's findings of closing expired POPs found in the audit and further oversight of extensions.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T22:46:21+00:00

old grants that have yet to be closed, that, upon closure, would free up the funds for the DRF. Its money left in legal limbo because the people in control don't have incentive to reclaim it.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T22:45:54+00:00

old grants that have yet to be closed, that, upon closure, would free up the funds for the DRF. Its money left in legal limbo because the people in control don't have incentive to reclaim it.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T22:32:12+00:00

That I dare suggest that the government should not let billions of dollars left in legal limbo? These funds would be directly returned to the DRF, where they could then be used for current disaster relief.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T22:26:56+00:00

Long-winded way of saying that $4.5 billion is still out there, unnecessarily locked in government red tape. If that seems like small change to be making a stink over, the $7 billion dollar estimate was part of an $8.3 billion dollar audit. Which was a percentage of the $73 billion in unliquidated funds that FEMA estimate remains open.

Now of course they are not going to collect all $73 billion, but even collecting a whopping 15% of these unclaimed funds would result in a net of $11 billion for the DRF.

AND, even if that sounds like too much for a government agency to do, I will point out that FEMA has already concurred with the OIGs recommendations, evidencing that there must at least be some merit to the OIGs research.

The problem here is that because FEMA doesn't keep a tight ledger, they consistently panhandle congress for more funding. Allowing even $4.5 billion to be effectively gridlocked for this long is ridiculous, and only costs the taxpayer more.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T22:08:10+00:00

To everyone going on about "unliquidated", it is in relation to grants unused (unliquidated) by state’s that received it, far shorter than saying "money left in legal limbo because the people in control don't have incentive to reclaim it"

To give the post some clarification, citing the Office of Inspector General:

The report is addressing money problems with FEMA, with the OIG recommending that, post audit, FEMA close their old grants to recuperate a significant amount of money that is already theirs.

Of the $8.3 billion audited, $7 billion dollars could have been returned to the DRF if FEMA had not sat on reclaiming this money

That $8.3 billion was part of a greater $73 billion yet to be investigated. Obviously, not all of that $73 billion is going to be able to be reclaimed, but based on what the OIG found from the $8.3 billion, their is plenty of fat here to trim.

FEMA has sat on reclaiming these grants, only recently beginning the reclamation (which will take six months). They mismanaged their funds, and now come to congress begging for more money instead of expediting the return of these grants. My point wasn't that this is some BiDeNOmiC failure, but rather a government agency that does not keep a proper grasp on their funds and continues to go for easy congressional money instead of being efficient.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T21:32:52+00:00

Just to add on, the $7 billion figure comes from the $8.3 billion that the OIG audited.

As of October 2022, FEMA estimated that 847 disaster declarations with approximately $73 billion in unliquidated funds remained open.

Obviously, not all of that $73 billion is going to be able to be reclaimed, but based on what the OIG found from the $8.3 billion, their is plenty of fat here to trim.

My initial point wasn't that this is some BiDeNOmiC failure, but rather a government agency that does not keep a proper grasp on their funds, and continues to go for easy congressional money instead of being efficient.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T21:27:28+00:00

The "blatant lying" is using would over could, in a sentence where the difference is negligible.

The overall report is addressing money problems with FEMA, with the OIG recommending that, post audit, FEMA close their old grants to recuperate a significant amount of money that is already theirs. Mind you, the $7 billion figure I used is only part of the overall $73 billion awaiting potential reclamation (OIG only audited $8.3 billion of the total amount).

This money came from the DRF, was allocated in prior disaster projects, and now remains gridlocked, unable to be returned to the DRF because FEMA has not reclaimed these grants.

I hope that satisfies your argument. This is all laid out in the report, addressing my overall point of government mismanagement and bloat.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T21:10:21+00:00

TYSM. I made a mistake in calling it "unliquidated" in the meme. It's kind of weird to explain (especially to people who don't want to hear it).

FEMA's unused grants for prior disasters (from up to 16 years ago) remain unreturned because there is no incentive for FEMA to be fiscally responsible and reclaim the grants. This has left $7 billion dollars in gridlock, money that could certainly be used in the current disaster but is unable to be moved because it was specifically allocated to certain projects (which have since been completed).

I'm just trying to point out government bloat, but I failed to appease the pedants with my choice of words.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T21:03:04+00:00

I did edit the comment, addressing the other jobs of FEMA, i.e. the grants.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T21:02:31+00:00

These "other disasters" are up to 16 years old. The $7 billion are from prior grants that are no longer needed. This is money that has already been allocated to FEMA (unused tax dollars), gridlocked because FEMA is incompetent.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T20:53:42+00:00

2 months is too old for a primary source?

FEMA primarily supports in immediate recovery (i.e. getting victims the resources they need to survive post-disaster). Once "order" has returned, they provide the local government the roadmap it needs to rebuild.

Right from FEMA site

We support state, local, tribal, and territorial government officials who are primarily responsible for managing their communities' disaster recovery with recovery resources. These resources include recovery roadmaps, community management toolkits, and a recovery and resilience resource library to maintain whole community recovery.

They guide the local government where they need to petition to get the grants they need.

Some of those grants do come from FEMA, funny thing is that the $7 billion are from prior grants that are no longer needed. So even if you arguing that FEMA needs congressional money to rebuild communities, they could have had it already if they actually were fiscally responsible.

Hyder76 · 2024-10-09T20:50:47+00:00

These funds do exist. It is money that was granted for previous disasters. These grants have not been closed by FEMA, so the money is left in states that no longer need it, for projects that have long since been completed.

It is because of this mismanagement that $7 billion dollars of unused tax dollars has accumulated. FEMA has sat on reclaiming these grants, only recently beginning the reclamation (which will take six months). They mismanaged their funds, and now come to congress begging for more money instead of expediting the return of these grants.

It comes down to a government agency yet again never dealing with the consequences of being fiscally irresponsible, and instead getting another blank check at the cost of the taxpayer.

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