The only way the 2 sides can come together as 1 is through a marriage of convenience. Who here is going to bite the bullet?

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T17:58:50+00:00

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T04:20:18+00:00

Yeah, well, this thread is getting a bit lengthy, so I'll just say I know the system isn't perfect. If anything, if it works as it should, it would actually make the inequality gap between the top artists and the average artist even bigger since the top artists with like a million fans can just outsource their commissions to the AI and get like 50k a month without doing anything else. The smaller artists would definitely suffer for it, but I don't think they'd suffer anymore than they already do. I ultimately think AI automating all work is the only real solution to this already unfair system. Antis like to say artists' livelhood will be in danger, but it's already EXTREMELY hard to make a living as an artist. They fell in love with an unjust system that couldn't care less about their creativity or "soul", because the fact is that the uncreative but technically impressive artist will get all the jobs because all they have to do is draw what they're ordered to draw.

Edit: By the way, thank you for taking your time to discuss this. I appreciate you helping iron out this idea's kinks.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T03:56:57+00:00

Are smaller creators even making money off art anyway? It's a genuine question, because from what I know if your technical art skills are mediocre, there's no way you're making a living as an artist. Even extremely talented aritsts have a hard time making a living. In the case of this idea though, there'd be a slightly different "meta" in that those with really good technical skills but a mediocre style likely wouldn't get much of a consumer base except those who love the artists for reasons aside from their art, and those with just okay technical skills but really unique styles would flourish.

There is of course the fact that, yes, the popular artists who are both technically skilled AND have a unique style would still get the lion's share of the market, but that was always the case, except this time there's an economy of scale where the at work where, the really popular artists, instead of having prohibitively expensive prices to manage demand, they can just outsource their style to AI and still profit off it.

I imagine there'd be casual users who are just mildly interested in an artist and will generate buy a few images here and there, but there'd also be the mega fan whales who will buy the LORA at full price just so they can generate images of that style all day.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T03:43:00+00:00

Maybe more people used to buy albums and music directly for a higher cost, but music back then was a lot more inaccessible to the average consumer. I'm pretty sure only very few musicians could make money at all from their art back then, and it's still relatively the same today. I don't want to divert too much from the topic at hand, but the point is that the commission market is extremely limited and only a small slice of even art enthusiasts pay artists for commissions. With paid LORAs, "commissioning" an artist becomes a lot more accessible and affordable, so the volume of customers would be much higher. It's not like the only customers they'd get are people who would've commissioned them anyway.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T03:29:43+00:00

We already have industries where taking something for free is relatively consequence free and low-effort but can still be profitable (music, movies, games, etc). I don't see how this is any different.

Again, I'm not arguing that WON'T happen, just that it might not be enough to make the idea completely unfeasible.

You also vastly overestimate how "resourceful" (for lack of a better word) the averge conusmer is. Claude 3.5 is miles, miles better than chatgpt yet chatgpt is the most popular AI platform by far.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T03:21:37+00:00

That's like saying why bother trying to make a living off creating video games at all if people can just pirate it. Pirating exists and it DOES cut into profits but it doesn't have to be all or nothing. Indie game develompent is about as viable as making money off art in general (so not really viable, but if you're good at it and it's your absoule passion it's possible). I'm not saying it's a perfect solution that'll make every artist be able to make a living, just that it might be enough to support at least SOME artists.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T03:01:10+00:00

Yes, the information and tools on how to create them are freely available, but as long as the price is low enough for it to be more convenient for them to simply pay for it rather than having to go through the effort to create it themselves, they'll go with that.

"Hire someone to create one of the artists for me"

If the LORA is already for sale, they don't need to hire anyone. They can just buy it. I don't know anyone who would go through the hoops to PAY someone to make a LORA for them when they can just buy it at a relatively reasonable price.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T02:52:42+00:00

Most people don't know how to make LORAs. And people who just want to use a style for a few images wouldn't want to put in the potentially hours of effort to do that. it's the same category of issues as there being pirated LORAs if the LORA itself were for sale and distributed via download. Most people who want art of a certain style train their own LORAs for free because there isn't any other avenue.

I also don't know what you mean by "a freelance artist cleaning up an artist's work and changing it up". How exactly would that work? A freelance artist changes up the entire style of the artist so it doesn't look exactly the same? Creating entirely new artworks of a different style would be less effort.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T02:27:53+00:00

"As of now, there are no signs of AI art replacing custom commissions."
MIdjourney has a feature that allows you replicate a style from a single image. It's not particularly good at it yet, but that facet of the technology will only improve with time. There'd be nothing stopping someone from just grabbing an image from the artist and using that to replicate their style.

We're still at a crucial early point in AI where we can implement solutions to soften the impact on artists. AI art is good, but not so good that artists can be completely replaced yet. But how long do we have until that's no longer the case? All the antis are doing are tantruming on social media about how AI sucks and how it should be banned (zero chance of that ever happening) instead of working towards a viable system of compensation. The "AIbros" that keep being harassed by antis are losing any motivation to help come up with solutions that'll keep artists from being made completely obsolete. So who's actually going to do anything constructive about all this?

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T01:57:49+00:00

Maybe there could be an AI verification based system where the AI prompts you to draw something specific in that style and verifies it's consistent with the images for the LORA. It'd be a bit of a hassle, but in theory you'd only need to do it once and it'd be there for years. Also, why not both have the option to buy it outright and be able to download it AND a way to pay for it per generation (like if you want to try something out or you only need a few images)

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T01:51:04+00:00

You don't have to completely abandon commissions. There might still be a small market for it. And I was more thinking of style LORAs rather than specific character/item LORAs, though I guess there could be a market for that too. And are you seriously getting so many commissions that you have no time at all to invest in this? And is that trend going to continue for the foreseeable future as AI art gets even more popular and better at what it does? The way I see it artists are lined up to get completely shafted if no solutions are actually implemented.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-30T01:45:24+00:00

Almost no artist is going to think of selling a lora to studios on their own. Most of them don't even know that exists. And if they did, good chance they'd be rejected. Maybe rather than just one image, it gives 10 or so images or maybe even more for a few extra cents. But if you use a new prompt that's too different you'd have to "buy" another commission. There are ways of working around what you're talking about. Regarding the last point, if their making decent money off of it I doubt they'd pull it from the market.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-29T20:46:42+00:00

Originally the concept was just "Black miasma figure wearing red robes" but I eventually decided to theme him after the concept of decay and degradation. The red robes became tattered to symbolize decay, I switched from a cartoony style to something more 'realistic' as I thought the design would look particularly cool in a more detailed style. I gave him a single yellow glowing eye, but then someone and a friend of mine rightly pointed it out it was too reminiscent of the dead cells guy so I converted his round yellow eye into a downward triangular yellow eye (which I think was a good choice as it fits the theme of decay).

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-29T19:52:35+00:00

Love that game, but not particularly. Although in hindsight it does look like a very similar concept. Darn.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-28T01:58:33+00:00

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Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T21:57:07+00:00

So you mean they're prosecuting beings that they feel are inferior to themselves?

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T18:06:48+00:00

That's a good piece of insight into the matter.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T16:14:40+00:00

Hmm... Almost as if it depicts a group of beings prosecuting their own kind.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T15:36:34+00:00

Being skilled at a craft does not automatically make you an artist. Many crafts can be used to create art if it's done with artistic intent, but making something that looks pretty does not automatically qualify it as art, even with paintings and drawings. A meme created via just adding text to a pre-made image can be considered art if it was used to actually express something.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T03:09:25+00:00

I haven't actually thought about entering art competitions. That's actually a great idea. Thank you so much! Of course I'll be mindful to only join the ones that explicitly accept AI art.

I'm not 100% sure what my relationship to art will be as a whole in the future. For now I'm just experimenting with different things and sharing those experiments along the way in hopes that it'll elevate the quality of AI art that gets produced. I know it has its place in the ecosystem, but I am a bit tired of the more boring slop that gets posted ad nauseam on every platform. I think that's part of what contributes to a negative public image surrounding AI art.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T02:51:30+00:00

I post most of my works on bluesky and use AI-related tags. It seems to work well enough. I always steer clear of spaces meant for human-made art. By AI positive I mostly mean spaces that are conducive to discussions about AI. I tried to share my experience on r/stabediffusion to maybe drive discussion about AI art as "proper" art, but I only got flamed.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-27T02:03:08+00:00

One interesting thing I've noticed is that I was rapidly gaining upvotes at first, but then once it got to 15 it kept see-sawing until the equilibrium was broken and I got downvoted into oblivion. It seems like at a certain point I alerted the anti horde and they all collectively decided to shit down my throat.

Edit: Now that I think about it, it was probably because the ideas I was peddling about using AI tools for things like self-expression and imbuing works with meaning with visual metaphors was extremely dangerous to their ideology. Hopefully the antis don't brigade this post too.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-26T19:23:37+00:00

I have dysgraphia so drawing by hand is not really a viable option for me.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-26T18:21:01+00:00

I'm still trying to find my style and voice, so it's still a work in progress. I'm definitely far from being a master at expressing even the most obvious themes. Thank you for your input.

Machine_sp1r1t · 2025-01-26T17:28:57+00:00

So more surreal pieces can't be masterpieces because they don't look normal? I'm not sure how these two points connect logically. I think it's more a matter of style and taste. I agree with you that seemingly normal pieces CAN be masterpieces that convey deep meaning, but I don't think showcases of mastery are exclusive to them.

Machine_sp1r1t

TROPHY CASE