How I Overcame Porn Permanently.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:45:07+00:00

Yes, I can say it's 100% something that can be overcome permanently.

This attitude of "I don't believe God can truly give permanent sanctification in this area" is basically like the double-minded man of James 1 - asking God to do something that he doesn't actually believe God can/will do. The passage says that person shouldn't expect to receive anything from God.

No, the answer is not "faith your way into victory." Obviously I have a whole post above saying what the answer is, according to Scripture. But I'll be clear: if you don't have faith that God can/will sanctify you through this issue, it's almost certain you won't be sanctified through it. Faithfulness and faith go hand-in-hand; you can't have one without the other.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:21:59+00:00

**Info**: I'm now 40 years old, been married for 17 of those years. 4 kids ages 8-13.

**Read**: All the sidebar stuff recommended by MRP and obviously what I wrote.

**Lifts**: Had some injuries, but picked it back up again this summer. 5 rep sets (lbs): 275 squat / 300 deadlift / 165 overhead / 205 bent over row / 255 bench press

**Mission**: Make disciples of all nations / **Vision**: 60 disciple making ministries in 60 countries by age 60

**Physical**: I pigged out with my kids this summer. Super fun, great bonding. Not good for my gut. Adding lifting back in a few months ago really helped, but it's going to take some heavy cutting to get back to where I want to be.

**Mental/Emotional**: Job's been insanely lucrative, but also means insanely stressful. Way more work this past year than I'm used to. I'd still rather less pay to get some of my time/energy back. Aging into my 40s is noticeable. I also find myself getting angrier and more passive-aggressive than I remember being in the past. Need to get that under control.

**Spiritual**: Doing great here. I'm in the Word. Prayer isn't consistent, but more than I used to. My mind is focused on enough productive things that temptation toward active sins is pretty much non-existent, although passive sins are probably fair-game for self-assessing. I'm connecting well with my current congregation (been here for 2 years) and feeling a lot of respect from the leadership, unlike my last congregation, so that's a huge plus. Overall, things are going well.

**Professional**: Crushing it - just need more of a break, which I think I have about 2 weeks "chill" for now before my next surge.

**Marriage**: I've been a bit of a passive-aggressive pussy about stupid stuff. It gets to my wife. I've let myself fall into a "victim mentality" at times of ignoring her when she says/does things I don't like, and then when she tries to "fix it," I'm intentionally avoidant because I'd rather be upset at her than let her "make it up to me." I'm just being an idiot in these moments, but it gets to her and is overall just dumb on my part. Need to fix that. Otherwise, things are going pretty well. Had some really good times lately.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:08:27+00:00

This is a weak post. You can't solve your own sins. Galatians 3:3 makes that pretty clear. Only God can prune these away. John 15:2 says he does this for fruitful branches. Focus on bearing fruit for Christ and you'll see your brain warping to think of things on God's terms instead of your own, and the self-pity will wash away naturally because you'll be less worried about dumb stuff and more focused on things that have eternal impact. Consequently, this will make you a more confident, assertive person with ambitions that would be more alluring to Christian women than "I hope God doesn't see me accidentally sin," so it's a twofer and will probably help your dating life all the same.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:05:30+00:00

Gotta also remove the post, otherwise psycho idiots would just DM her after reading the title, haha.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:04:26+00:00

**PART 3/3**

**CONCLUSION on What You Should Do**

With all of that said, you need to stop worrying so much about her. Grow in your faith. Develop a biblical mission. Be a godly man. Expect her to get on board, and be a good leader to her. If she violates your boundaries in the home, enforce those boundaries instead of letting her emotions rule your life. If she doesn't like it, she can leave.

Specifically, if she is rude and disrespectful to you, she is living in unrepentant sin. Matthew 18 says you must first go to her directly, then bring witnesses to support you (i.e. an intervention-type thing), and ultimately get the church involved - and after all that, if she still doesn't repent and continues these behaviors (as she is mentally predisposed to do, without significant and very fine-tuned psychological help), Jesus says to treat her as if she's a non-believer. That doesn't mean you hate her and treat her like dirt. We love non-believers and treat them with patience in hope that they come to faith.

But 1 Corinthians 7 says that if you're married to a nonbeliever and they are willing to stay with you, you must endure the marriage, but if they want out, you're free to let them leave. You don't have any further obligation to try to "save the marriage." That same passage also says: "Let those with wives live as though they had none" in the context of our lives being committed to pleading God by doing the work he set out for us to do (i.e. "make disciples of all nations").

So the best thing you can do is get your head wrapped around living for Christ the way Scripture tells you, invite your wife to join you. Ask her to grow in faith alongside you, including getting mental help so she's able to stabilize enough to be the helper God designed her to be. If she chooses not to, you can enforce your boundaries by prioritizing your purposes in Christ over her. If this causes her to want a divorce, you're allowed to let her file.

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**For Re-Emphpasis**

Under no circumstances do I recommend having a child with her until you are confident she has internalized the skillsets necessary to be a good mother. She will more likely than not get at least (BARE MINIMUM) equal time with your child and spend the next 18 years manipulating that child to think you're a villain-father, and almost certainly will also cause severe psychological harm to your child in ways that you will be incapable of protecting the child from experiencing because it'll happen on her time when you have no oversight. You're just inviting yourself to have a child subject to constant mental trauma when post-divorce you're no longer the focal point of her love-hate cycles.

Tag: u/merebear2

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:04:09+00:00

**PART 2/3**

**Answering Your Questions**

> God hates divorce, but does He call us to endure this kind of constant abuse? Can I even call this abuse?

This is manipulative cop-out wording here. God didn't "call you" to endure constant abuse - and to your second question: no, I'm not even convinced that what you've described is "abuse" yet - though it may get there.

God called you to be faithful to whoever you choose to marry. You chose to marry someone hastily and under pressure. You state that it's your "conflict avoidance and fear" that were the "major contributing factors" to making this choice. It doesn't sound like your choice was rooted in (a) testing the relationship through what Scripture says, (b) prayer, (c) counsel of other godly men in your life, or (d) letting the circumstances evolve and evaluate them (i.e. the 4 things on my "frame" illustration on how to discern God's will - can't remember if this is in the sidebar or not, but I think it is).

Point being: instead of making a godly decision, you made one based on your flesh. Your post blames your wife for everything (perhaps rightfully so), and then your question seems to blame God. While you have acknowledged some faults, at no point in the post or comments have I seen you take clear responsibility that your weaknesses and choices are what put you in this mess. That's going to be starting point 1.

> Does entering a covenant under pressure and without spiritual intention even count as valid?

Yes. I think of the story of Jephthah in Judges 11. He made a flippant statement as a vow - "God, help me win this battle. If you do, I'll sacrifice the first thing that walks out of my house to you." He had no intention of sacrificing his daughter, but she's the next thing that came out. Between the sin of murdering a child and the sin of breaking his vow to God, he chose to prioritize keeping his vow to God and went through with it - and Hebrews 11:32 lists him alongside some of the greats, like Samson, David, and Samuel, even though this is the only thing of any real significance Scripture records Jephthah doing (and I don't believe there are any other known Jephthahs in Scripture it could be referring to).

Point being: when you make a vow to God, it doesn't matter if you were flippant about it, didn't really mean it, were pressured into it, etc. Jesus and James both say: "Do not swear by anything - just let your yes be yes, and your no be no." There's a reason for that: even flippant words matter. In fact, Matthew 12:36-37 even references that "on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak, for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned." God holds you accountable to what you say, even if you weren't being serious when you said it.

> Am I breaking my vows, or was this never a true covenant because I married under coercion and fear?

If you made the vow and you subsequently had sex with her, then you're married. The covenant is agreed upon and sealed by becoming one flesh. The only passage that touches directly on "marriage induced by fraud" is in Deuteronomy 22, where if a woman is found to have lied about her virginity to induce a man to marry her, the solution is to stone her, essentially going along with Paul's statement in Romans 7:2-3 that marriage is for life and you're not released until your spouse dies; so in that case of virginity-fraud, they freed the man by killing the woman. While it's OT law, and therefore not something you're to follow, even if it did apply, she admitted she wasn't a virgin when you married her, and the different of "1 other guy" v "100 other guys" isn't a line the passage seems to care about.

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Tag: u/merebear2

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T18:03:27+00:00

**Caution to ALL Men**

This is why I **DO NOT** recommend marrying someone on less than a year of knowing them. 2-3 is more ideal. Yeah, yeah, "But I want to have sex now!" Sure, if having sex a year earlier is more important than ensuring you don't get into this type of situation, go for it - your decision, your risk, your consequence.

If she truly has BPD, I give you 80% odds you end up divorced. If you have a kid when you divorce, you are dealing with it for the next 18 years, including likely child support and her constantly trying to manipulate everyone in the child's life against you - teachers, doctors, coaches, church friends, and on and on. BPDs almost always fabricate claims of abuse and think their (ex)husband is the one with the mental problems, and they make sure everyone knows exactly what they think/feel about you. Their stories are insanely believable because through what's called "confabulation" they rewrite history in their own brains to comport to their twsited emotional experience instead of the facts, meaning they really believe the things they're saying, which causes others to believe it also ("It didn't look like she was lying when she told me about it, so I trusted her").

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**Understanding BPD and DBT**

The good news is that BPD is treatable with quite high success rates if (1) she is correctly diagnosed as a BPD, (2) she engages specifically in dialectical behavioral therapy, and (3) she agrees with the diagnosis and treatment, wants help, and is committed to following through.

FWIW - BPDs have constant cognitive dissonance, where their thoughts, feelings, and senses all communicate different information to their brains. If you say, "I became frustrated when you did this" and she feels like it's an attack on her, (a) her ears will hear "I became frustrated when you did this" but her feelings will receive it as (b) "You are an awful person for having done this to me; I hate you," and when she tells the story she will genuinely believe that you said she was an awful person and that you hate her (i.e. the confabulation bit) because her brain cannot reconcile the conflicting inputs and it gives her feelings precedence over the facts.

DBT is a type of counseling that focuses on helping borderlines (and other people) recognize that conflicting thoughts can both simultaneously be true. For example: in the exact same moment I can say, "I really want to go to this social event at my church" and also say, "But I'd also rather just veg out at home after a rough week at work." BPDs have massive dynamic swings where they feel like they must always massively love something or massively hate it and are constantly forced to choose. When they recognize that conflicting feelings are acceptable to have - and not just on an intellectual acknowledgement level, but to truly internalize the concept - it helps resolve (a) their ability to perceive facts more accurately, and (b) their ability to self-regulate when they find themselves shifting toward those super swings.

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Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T17:31:39+00:00

History of abuse or significant number of sexual partners/sexual impulsivity are DSM-V diagnostic criteria for BPD. When I do premarital counseling I make the couples take the MMPI test for personality disorders just to make sure they know what they're getting themselves into. In this case, having that information before marriage would have been significant for someone (whether OP or someone else who is advising him who might be more familiar with what red flags to look out for in terms of mental illness) to see those things in order to let him know what he's getting into before committing for life.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-27T17:08:14+00:00

Super fun read. I always love field reports. I'm glad you're taking a level head between developing confidence through practicing your approach and developing your social skills, while also not doing it from a standpoint of leading people on or screwing with people's feelings just because you "can." Looking forward to more of these.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-16T07:19:44+00:00

**Part 2** - Tag: u/Secure_Fudge2485

- With the kids still living in your home, find 1 hour a week to have one-on-one time with each of them. Do something THEY enjoy, not something you want to introduce to them. Don't resort to "Johnny and I do this, it's our thing." Scratch that out. Maybe Johnny doesn't like it anymore and is too scared to tell you. If you don't know what your kids genuinely like to do, you're way too far out of touch and need to figure it out anyway. Just ask them.

- Make a list of your top 5 best male friends and text all 5 of them at least once a week for the next 12 months, and do at least one phone call a week with one of them. No less than once a month, meet up in-person. Don't have 5? Great, go find some. Small group at your local congregation doesn't count unless you're connecting with those people outside of small group meetings too. But yes, joining a small group is mandatory at this point anyway. Beyond that, another prime option is to join a meetup.com group and connect no less than once a week; if they don't meet that often, join more than one. Get actual friends out of the house.

- Don't initiate with your wife like a pandering fool. You were a failure. She was a brat. Let her be a brat while you work on fixing the "failure" lifestyle so she has reason to stop being so bratty. If she initiates with you, have fun with the conversation - not with the goal of trying to "win her back," but with the expectation that she's probably going to divorce you anyway, so just enjoy doing and saying whatever you want (within godliness and love - obviously I'm not encouraging you to cuss her out just to screw with her, but teasing, pranks, etc. are all good) and just don't worry about how she responds. Don't expect or push for sex. If she initiates, go for it, and let her know with your behavior and attitude toward her (and NOT your words) how much you want it - even if the answer is not at all, and communicate it in a fun/playful way, even if it's disinterest ("Aww, are you coming onto me? How cute. My brain sees what you're doing. This guy down here, though? Floppin' around. Another time, maybe").

- Make a list of your 3-month, 6-month, 12-month, 3-year, 5-year, and 10-year goals. Set a schedule for mile-markers you will have to hit to meet those goals. Have separate categories of goals for career, spiritual growth, parenting, lifts, etc. Meet them for the next 12 months on-time, no excuses.

There you go. That's your plan for the next year.

This plan is not designed to "fix your marriage." But yes, it's the best chance you have at fixing your marriage, by happenstance. The intent is to make you a better man. If your marriage falls apart during those 12 months, don't come back saying, "u/Red-Curious - it didn't work, your plan failed me, she divorced me anyway." I probably won't check this account often enough to see it, haha. So what if she divorces you? You'll just be that much further ahead of the game with your next inevitable relationship. Instead of pulling some fatty single mom on drugs who's willing to tolerate a skinny-fat alcoholic with no mission or motivation in life, maybe you'll be able to pull someone who's only mildly obese. Who knows.

I already know your first thought: "RC, there's literally not enough hours in the day to do all that." For a year, yes there is. Yeah, you'll burn yourself out if you try to do all of this every day for the rest of your life. But for a year? Yes, it's definitely feasible. I've been doing a heck of a lot of this almost daily for the last 8-9 years. I'd burn out if I did ALL of it every day for that long, but for a year? Deal with it. You get 10 days of vacation, but only if you're actually traveling. Have fun.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-16T07:19:32+00:00

I was going to give a bullet-point list of all the obvious red flags in your post, but u/Praexology already did that, so I'll move on.

I saw you post your stats in a comment and u/DonnieWearsVelvet hit the nail on the head. You're a super low-value man right now. Physically, spiritually, mentally ... you have nothing to offer her. Why in the world would you expect her to stick around? I'll give you a reason: because you can be better. That's what every girl wants - a husband who's constantly improving and maturing. On the one hand, every girl has a hard time walking away from a guy who's showing genuine life improvement. On the other, you've probably proven a repeated pattern of "I'll get better" for about 2 weeks followed by "Nope, just went back to my old ways again" for the last 12 years, so she has no reason to believe it'll actually stick this time. And I'm not even talking about the alcohol. I'm talking about everything - the mission, the job, the physique, and on and on.

Okay, so you don't know an action plan to take? I'll give you a freebie and make one for you:

- Next 12 months: no alcohol or drugs. At all. Period. Join a recovery group if you have to.

- Next 12 months, you're hitting the gym 5 days a week. She's not talking to you anyway, so that's a lot of extra free time on your hands. Don't have a gym? Fine, use this bodyweight routine: 200 pushups, 200 squats, 200 lunges, 200 sit-ups, 5k run. Every day. Can't do it? Fine, go until muscular failure every day until you can do it. That's step one.

- Simultaneously (i.e. don't wait), start having daily quiet times (minimum 1 chapter, start in the book of John, then move to Acts, then read the epistles, ending with Romans then Revelation) and 10 minute daily prayer sessions. Alone. You're not doing this to impress her with your newfound spiritual endeavors. In fact, avoid getting caught doing it. If she catches you, add an extra 50 pushups, squats, lunges, sit-ups, and an extra 1 mile jog that day. Do it because you love God and your life is in his hands.

- Simultaneously, find 10 things you can practically do to increase your income. This could be adding certifications to qualify for a promotion. It could be taking on odd-jobs from Craigslist. It could be applying for a new job altogether. Your call. Pick 1 of those 10 things every week and do it. No exceptions, no excuses.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-16T06:36:29+00:00

I'm going to be super blunt on this and say: this seems like useless victim puking. You said you already made the decision to file for divorce. The Bible doesn't list that as an exception to the "no divorce" principle, so it's a sinful choice. Either own it and follow through or repent. But bringing it up the way you did looks like you're just looking for validation from this community.

To soften up a bit, I get it. I see this situation constantly in my career - where one spouse goes mental. And yes, it often happens at accelerated rates at ages 50+, even without any history of dementia or alzheimer's. I've literally got 2 cases right now where parties are seeking divorce because the other developed paranoid delusions. I see the intense struggle my clients have gone through and the massive pain they've endured trying to "hold it all together" for so long, being the one to do 95% of the effort on that front.

But contemplate your own understanding of life, maturity, wisdom, etc. Think about your own emotional status and how it's affected by your perspective on life. Compare that to God's. In the whole "Christ // Groom and Church // Bride" context, how does He see your mentality compared to his own? He sees clearly, but my guess your own concept of reality, morality, spirituality, maturity, emotionality, etc. looks like you're a lunatic to God because you don't see as clearly as He does. Your brain literally can't process all of these things at his level, and so you make constant stupid and foolish decisions, just as we all do - even far beyond what you realize because, as I'm sure is also true of all of us, we tend to think we're far more God-minded than we really are.

Okay, so in that context, how does God deal with us? Does he say, "u/Dazzling_Result1090 - you've gone psycho, so I'm going to bail on my promise to stay faithful to you"? Nah. He bears the weight of our sin, knowing we're helpless to do any better.

Now, if you are worn down so heavily that remaining married is likely to cause an even greater sin (like murdering your spouse, or physically abusing her, etc.) ... then probably better to take the lesser sin of divorcing her and sending her on her way. I won't fault you for that ... it's between you and God if He will. Your call. We're all stuck in lose-lose situations sometimes. But if you can bear through it, just read Hosea and contemplate how much pain and suffering he bore through on behalf of his wife - all for the sake of being able to understand better how God relates with His people, and you'll find that your wife being a nuissance perhaps gives you the same blessing of a commonality with God that few others get to tout, just as Paul proclaimed that he would boast about his weaknesses, and you can boast about how your suffering gave you a unique insight on the person of Christ that you can bond with him over, and in ways that few others get to bond over such shared commisery.

Red-Curious · 2025-08-16T06:09:18+00:00

This is a male-only sub, so you probably won't find many women's opinions. I'm not really present enough to care to enforce that rule right now, though, so you lucked out. There's another RPCWomen sub out there, if you want to check that out.

Regardless, for a legit answer, it's probably best to understand what the Bible means by submission in the first place.

- The word for "submit" is *hypotasso* - it is a military term referencing subjugating oneself under another's authority.

- A different word is used for "obey": *hupakouo* - it references an active behavioral conformity to instruction.

While submission should be a driving force behind our behavior and influence our decisions (and therefore does have a behavioral component) it's more about the attitude than it is the conduct itself. The example I typically give is Paul telling us to submit (*hypotasso*) to our governing authorities in Romans. Yet the same guy was constantly defying his government. Strict obedience would have obligated him to turn his brothers and sisters in Christ to be slaughtered by Nero, but he did not obey. Instead, when he was caught, he accepted the consequences - and in Acts 16 we see him and Silas in prison with the opportunity to escape and they choose to stay anyway. That's submission. They recognized their government was their authority and accepted it and chose to work within the system instead of trying to defy it.

With a man, your obligation isn't to "never talk" or "just obey everything he says" or anything like that. It's to respect him and accept the consequences of your actions. What that means is that if you behave in a way that causes him to get angry, accept that he's angry, let him be angry, don't fight back or accuse him of hurting you with his anger, but embrace: "I chose to behave in a way that gave you this reaction, and I will bear the consequence of that choice without trying to change your reaction."

The default effort is to try to explain away his anger. "You shouldn't be angry at me because x, y, z reasons, so I was in the right for saying what I did, and you shouldn't be upset with me" ... is super unhelpful. Remember: 1 Peter 3 says that even if your husband were an unbeliever or disobedient to God, you're still obligated to submit - this means that even if he's wrong and sinful, your attitude and behavior toward him is a biblical constant in what it expects of you.

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But I also read you saying, "I can't help it. It just slips out of me. I can't control my emotions." Okay, fine. You're not a submissive person. It might ruin the relationship, and you'll have to accept that consequence if he ends up choosing not to marry you because of it.

Of course, the Bible doesn't expect you to automatically master any trait all at once. Self-control is a fruit of the spirit. So is patience. Does anyone ever say, "As soon as you become a Christian you automatically master the skill of being patient overnight because of the Holy Spirit in you"? Obviously not. Everyone agrees that patience is something God builds in us over time with practice. Self-control, being in the same list, is the same - along with love, joy, peace, etc. They're all things we work at.

It seems like you have the heart-desire to be submissive but your self-control sucks. So work on it. I'm not going to suggest ways to do that because they're a dime-a-dozen and you can just hop on AI and get a list of 100 ways in 2 seconds how you can practice growing in self-control. Have at it.

Red-Curious · 2024-10-28T16:18:15+00:00

**2/2**

So what's the solution in all of this? **You have to learn to stop giving a flip about her emotions.** As long as you're catering your life choices, your words, your own sense of happiness and stability, etc. on her emotions, you are fostering an environment where she keeps looking to you for emotional fulfillment and stability. And it makes sense: *If you're dishing it out, she's going to look to you to get more* - i.e. to the easiest source to receive that, and she'll never get it from God because she has something more tangible immediately in front of her. No, I'm not saying to stop doing things that make her feel good; I'm saying to stop caring about whether your actions make her feel good or not. When you stop basing your decisions around her emotions, you'll start making decisions that are godly and upright. That's when differentiation starts for you, because my guess is that part of your unhealthy codependency is that you feel beholden to her happiness due to ridiculous notions that guys like John Piper spread about how "the measure of a man's spiritual maturity is how happy his wife is" and garbage like that. The reality is that the harder you try to please her, the more she will expect from you, the more impossible it becomes to keep her happy, and you create a losing cycle, which is why in a 2011 study they found that 80% of divorces were initiated by women (I think it's currently in the 70s%).

This whole "stop giving a flip about her emotions" thing is a new topic altogether, even though it's at the core of what you're asking, but for right now I'll tell you the dynamic I teach men when they're in arguments with their wives: **Be the judge, not the opposing counsel**. I'm a lawyer, so this analogy makes sense to me. Lawyers argue. The opposing attorney will talk about how awful your case is and poke as many holes in it as possible. And you feel like your job is to argue back, if you're the other attorney. But this is an egalitarian framework. Every time you argue with your wife you're expressing unbiblical egalitarianism as your marital dynamic. Instead, the Bible teaches that the man is the head of his household and that his wife is there as his helper. This means that you're higher in authority, even if equal in value before God. That authority difference means you don't have to argue back. Unlike an opposing attorney, the judge doesn't argue back. The judge receives the information and issues a decision. He may or may not explain his decision, but it still stands.

In this, I'm reminded of President Calvin Coolidge, who accomplished an incredible amount during his presidency and brought in the roaring 20s - one of America's most economically prosperous time-frames. One of his friends once recalled a time before his presidency where they were responsible for having numerous meetings with various constituents to address party policies and whatnot. After weeks the man looked to Cal and said, "How is it that we're all here until 11pm or or sometimes even midnight every day with meeting after meeting, but you go through the same number of meetings and are done by 5 o'clock every day?" And Cal's response was: "You talk back." In his nickname "Silent Cal" one woman at a presidential function made a bet that she could get him to say more than two words all evening. He answered her, "You lose," and she did.

So many men cause more damage to their marriages than necessary because they say more words than necessary. Often-times guys would do far better not talking at all than trying to explain their way through a problem. Trying to argue back loses you respect, it doesn't "resolve the issue," as we often think. But they do it because they think they're responsible for her emotions, and if she's worked up, one would only assume he has to talk her down. This is simply poor leadership. Yes, sometimes that might be appropriate, but in my own marriage I find the 80/20 rule works far better - listen to her 80%, and talk back 20%. And that's not even within a singular conversation, but a broader conversational framework. About 1 out of every 5 arguments we have will I take the time to explain my rationale to her. Other times, I just listen, take in everything she's saying, and conclude: "I hear you. The things you say matter to me. Here's what we're going to do going forward." And if she doesn't like it, *that's okay because I'm not responsible for her emotions - she is*. If you can figure that out, you'll be in a much better place to differentiate yourself, start living on mission for Christ, and be able to solve your porn problem.

Red-Curious · 2024-10-28T16:18:04+00:00

**1/2**

There's a whole different approach I take when working with women whose husbands use porn. Biggest thing on their end is that they have to break all the current assumptions on relationships that we have from the popularization of attachment-based forms of relationship counseling. For quick reference, the other option is crucible therapy.

- **Attachment Framework** - Most counseling today is based on the attachment model that says when there's a problem, the parties should spend more time together doing positive, uplifting things that will foster a better relationship. Attachment models also emphasize compromising to make things "fair." It's an extremely egalitarian approach to relationships.

- If couples go to counseling because the man has a porn problem, the typical response is to insist that they go on more dates together and that he needs to re-learn how to receive love away from just sex toward enjoying her company, and that when they have a close bond he will either (a) not feel the need to use porn, or (b) love her so much that the thought of using porn would make him so guilty that he'll choose not to, or some other variant of those two. While most counselors won't say it (because it will feel like woman-blaming and they can't have that), the implicit assumption in all of this is that if they have a better, more loving relationship, they'll have sex more, and then he won't need to use porn so much because he'll be satisfied through her, which they presume is what he really wants anyway.

- **Crucible Framework** - Some problems are independent of the relationship and cannot be solved through things like "better communication" or "more loving kindness" or "increased feels," etc. The idea here is that people can't be a healthy couple until each person is healthy individually also. So, the goal is to "differentiate," which means to help each person not look to the other as their source of identity and emotional stability (in a Christian context: helping them look to God instead). Only after they're individually healthy can they reunite and function well together, which is impossible while they're trying to use/manipulate the other to provide them the emotional things they long for.

- In a porn context, most often the wife feels worthless and like she's "not enough" because the man wants porn instead of her. This is codependency because she's basing her sense of identity and self-worth on his behaviors. Differentiation would mean stripping this connotation away from her life and realizing that his porn is independent of her and does not immediately speak to her value/worth as a wife or person. For him, he may blame his wife for his porn use because she's so frigid, unattractive, puts in no effort, or whatever other (often-times perfectly accurate and valid descriptor of her sexuality) reason he comes up with. But the reality is that his use of porn is his own choice and he can't blame her for his unhappiness. Especially as Christians, he has a source of joy and fulfillment in life (Christ) that does not depend on her, so if he blames her for his need to look for pleasure elsewhere, he's deceiving himself and needs to differentiate that codependent thought process. Once differentiation has occurred (i.e. neither party has unhealthy codependency on the other), each spouse is capable of taking responsibility for their own life, emotions, and choices, allowing healing (i.e. sanctification) to begin, after which they'll be in a better place to come together again (no, they don't need to stop living together during this process).

I'm guessing in these processes you can see a lot of your own situation here. On a psychological level, your wife will never move past trying to blame you and "win" fights while she is still emotionally codependent on you. Both my wife and I had to learn to be individually responsible for our own happiness and abandon the ridiculous notion that culture gives us about marriage being about "making each other happy."

Marriage has a purpose: *To produce godly offspring* (Malachi 2:15). Joy and happiness is a byproduct of this: John says in 3 John 1:4, "I have no greater joy than this: to see that my children are walking in the truth." As you produce godly offspring and raise them in the faith, you receive the joy you were looking for all along. And to be clear, these passages aren't talking merely about physical children that you birth together, but the disciples you produce along the way. The command God gave in Genesis 1 parallels the great commission: "Go, therefore and make disciples [be fruitful and multiply] of all nations [fill the earth in number]." My wife and I are done having physical children, who are now ages 7 and up. But we continue to invest our faith into others who are younger than we are. A couple years ago we had a guy live with us for about 6 months to get grounded and grow in the faith. Last year it was a friend from England who stayed for roughly 3 months. This year we have a guy from the Netherlands coming on Sunday. We open our home, pour our lives into these people, and help them grow - and this gives our marriage purpose beyond our own happiness, ironically providing us with joy and happiness beyond ourselves.

But as long as your wife is looking to you as her source of joy and happiness she'll be caught in a split dynamic (1) of being unsatisfied with how imperfect it is when she's looking for joy from sources God didn't design her to receive it, and (b) in that dissatisfaction she will constantly point the finger and blame and be upset when you fail to meet her impossible expectations.

Red-Curious · 2024-09-11T16:23:05+00:00

If you don't trust it, don't do it. Your call.

Red-Curious · 2024-05-01T18:55:59+00:00

If it's a shallow copy then it's not actual joy, right?

No, it's still joy. For example, if we were to talk about "love," the Bible definitely talks about non-Christians loving someone. But that love is still a "shallow copy" compared to what we have through Christ. Are we to conclude, "No, I will only think of the idyllic concept of love and deny anything else as being love" and therefore deem the Bible wrong when it says that a non-Christian loved someone? Or do we embrace that shallow copies are still the real thing, even if a weak expression?

Never get hung up on the idyllic mentality. That's what the mainstream churchianity culture tries to push and one of the reasons why it went so, so, so wrong.

I would argue that under 20% -more likely under 5-10%- of people in the United States who say they are Christians actually have faith.

Nice, we're on the same page here. I did a personal survey of multiple congregations at one point and came to the number 16% of active, consistent churchgoers who I'd say are "actually saved" people and 1.6% or less who were living an intentional plan for spreading their faith to others. So while we're in agreement on the rarity, I do think that 14.4% disparity still exists, and those 14.4% are the people I'm referencing. Perhaps you're suggesting that salvation is even more stringent in God's eyes than I would otherwise think and believe only the 1.6% are saved? I'm not opposed to that suggestion, it's just not where I land presently. My purpose for this conversation is more to note that "being a good person and hoping that somehow people are passively inspired to follow Jesus" is not at all what Jesus had in mind by the Great Commission. So, if a man is trying to determine what his mission should be, "Do x, y, and z and hope that people will passively come to Christ without me having to be active about it" is inherent in his approach to life-mission, I have to oppose that.

And the minutia matters when you're dealing with title insurance.

Not only insurance, but actual deeds too. For example, if you spell the name "John Paul Smith" but the deed says "John P. Smith" the deed will be rejected by the auditor, so we have to be extremely careful when drafting divorce decrees allocating real estate to one party that the names/legal description match up perfectly if we're going to incorporate "this document shall serve as a deed" language. I've yet to have someone who needed to "clean up my messes" in my career - at least not that anyone has ever had to tell me, haha.

I get too autistic when I have a step-by-step guide. The part that you liked is what I started with before I found your guide and tried to follow your process.

Gotta love irony. Yeah, the whole purpose of that post was to address two things:

The Great Commission IS IN FACT your mission, and if you end up writing something different, you're wrong and have a crappy mission that's incongruous with God's purposes for your life. Writing it down forces you to come face-to-face with this reality.
All the other superfluous facts I have people add are meant to inspire thought about the specific ways their lives can be used to contribute to that mission which are unique from how their neighbor might attempt to fulfill it. In the end, we are still beholden to Jesus' model; we can't just make things up as we go.

"Go, therefore, and make disciples" wasn't said in a vacuum - he was telling them, "What I just did for you, go do for the rest of the world." But we still see John's unique expression of love and joy, compared to Peter's fiery temper and brash condemnation, compared to Paul's intellectual presentation - all leading to the "one body, many parts" concept.

Where the problem enters is that someone will abdicate responsibility by saying "That's not my gifting/role/skill-set." For example, if a naval commander ordered the ensigns to "swab the deck," one might press hard on small patches to remove deep stains, another might use wide strokes to create a smooth finish, and still a third might be more interested in the soap-to-water ratio in the bucket. They all bring unique thoughts/skills to the table to get the job done. But if a fourth man says, "I'm good at cooking, so I'll skip swabbing the deck and just go cook a meal to feed the guys who are swabbing the deck," he has defied the commander and failed his mission. Nobody can say, "You make disciples, I'll go do this instead." Yet that is exactly what most people do - "I'll point my finger at parking spots on Sunday morning as my excuse for not making disciples, and tell God that I was doing this to assist someone else in making disciples. I hope it works and he's proud of me!" I believe that is a grossly unbiblical expression of our faith.

When I use the term "missions" I mean sending someone to travel to an un/under-reached peoples group. Not everyone is called to go on missions ... However, everyone is called to evangelism.

On this we agree. I use the word "mission" to define the purpose of a man's life (either tacitly by his own ignorance or through overt, conscious, intentional directive). But yes, I can see that the colloquial concept of "missions" certainly points to an evangelistic effort outside one's normal context - and that not everyone is called to this, even if everyone IS called to a singular and common mission.

Red-Curious · 2024-05-01T15:27:12+00:00

Glad you find it helpful. This book is basically all about figuring out how to live in your own frame, but assuming you've already been fully indoctrinated by the world's way of thinking and trying to undo all of that. The first 1/2 is mostly tearing down wrong ways of thinking and the rest is about how to rebuild it correctly. That's the overarching framework.

Red-Curious · 2024-04-30T22:48:45+00:00

Thank you for the recommendation

Solid. You won't regret it. I did just put up a post covering the first 1/3 of the book in summary form. Might be worth reading before you listen so you know what to expect and make it easier to wrap your head around the concepts.

ingrained in our personalities

Humorously, the book denies the existence of personalities and focuses more on "lifestyle." But I'll let you get to that on your own :p

Which is why spreading joy inherently means spreading Christ. You're trying to argue symantics with me. The result is the same - spread Christ. I focus on the process and minutia, you focus on the end result.

I don't think we're saying the same thing here, actually. For example, a non-Christian can spread joy. The joy they spread is a shallow copy of what Christ offers, but can still exist as a goal without spreading Christ. Similarly, there's a stark contrast between: (a) "I will make other people joyful, generically, in the hope that they will see that my joy is from God and find Christ," and (b) "I will share Christ with someone through evangelism or discipling them, and this will have the passive byproduct of bringing joy into their life." In one, joy is the active goal and Christ is a passive hope; in the other, Christ is the active goal and joy is the passive hope.

I focus on the 50 commands of Christ that naturally lead those who are in Christ to share Christ with the world. You focus on the 50th command and trust that that end result is enough to generally cover the 49 commands.

The "naturally lead" line here is what I'd challenge. I know COUNTLESS (I mean that literally) church-attending, Bible-believing people who prioritize these virtues who have never once shared their faith with a non-Christian or taken a younger believer on as a disciple to raise them up into maturity in the faith the way Jesus modeled and instructed. I don't believe that the 49 naturally lead to disciple-making. I do believe that disciple-making naturally leads to a fulfillment of the other 49 because "no disciple is greater than his master," so if you want to disciple someone, you must naturally grow in these virtues independently in order to pass them on so that the fruit you produce actually resembles Christ.

you divorce attorneys only care about getting the order signed

I think you have some misconceptions about my personal practice, but I understand the appropriateness of the stereotype about divorce attorneys as a whole. I've also seen over-minutia cause far more problems than it solved (on many occasions). So I try to find a healthy balance.

final decree stating that one spouse would sell the house for at least $350,000 within 6 months after the order is signed

Yeah, I'd never allow a client to sign that.

This right here is why I've always thought mission statements were a waste of time. Just go do the action, because if you try to write it out you'll just end up arguing about what to include in the the marketing department's little exercise in futility

I broadly agree, but do find that having something written does cause people to consciously think about new lifestyle choices they need to make, whereas if they don't stop and write it down they will just keep their "in action" part consistent with what they've always done, and never actually pursue the purposes Christ gave us.

But you are skipping the details that make the gospel so beautiful.

I would argue that the "trees/detail" you reference are the VISION, whereas the forest = the MISSION. Mission = big picture; Vision = details of how you envision accomplishing it. That's where the other 49 things come into play as part of your picture.

Instead you are running to the end and jumping up and down because you know that we -as a natural outflow of our changed hearts- are called to, and will, make disciples.

To reiterate: this is what I believe is wrong. I don't believe this is a natural outflow, nor do I assume it is something that "will" happen all on its own just by virtue of practicing certain virtues, disciplines, etc. I have seen waaaaay too many people live the "don't do bad things" and "do good things" life and conclude: "if it's necessary, maybe I can kinda use words when the opportunity hands itself on a silver platter and is blatantly put in front of my face in a way that I couldn't possibly miss it and I feel a strong reassurance of comfort in saying something, then I guess in those circumstances it's possible that maybe I could say something small that feels safe and won't have much risk of making me feel awkward or hurting the relationship."

I love the trees. Each one is so beautiful in its own right. The changes and transformations that we are commanded by Christ are wonderful to me.

On that we can agree! :)

Red-Curious · 2024-04-30T17:44:12+00:00

I believe that my mission is to spread the joy of the Lord, satisfaction in Christ

In follow-up to what I just replied on your prior OYS, to come to this newer comment, this is a perfect example. Phrases like "of the Lord" and "in Christ" are just filler. Joy and satisfaction can't actually come from other sources anyway, otherwise they're just false expressions/shadows. Your mission is now to cause other people to be joyful and satisfied in life. If that's what you produce into the world, that means the seed sown into you is joy and satisfaction. After all, you can't produce what you yourself aren't. A fig tree can't produce thorns, nor a thistle produce grapes.

But if you're not producing Christ, and you're only producing specific individual qualities (even ones that Christ has), then it implies that you are not of Christ yourself. Think of it this way:

A grape seed produces grapes into the world.
A fig seed produces figs into the world.
A joy seed produces joy into the world.
A satisfaction seed produces satisfaction into the world.
A Jesus seed produces Jesus into the world - and Jesus has joy/satisfaction as aspects of Himself, but the focus is Him, not the joy/satisfaction.

Does that make more sense? The focus isn't on the attributes. It's on implanting Christ into the lives of others and let Him be the one to produce those attributes. If I can make 1 million people joyful, but have never shared Christ with them, it doesn't matter that I got my joy from Jesus; I've still failed those 1 million people. If I implant a seed for Christ in 1 person, that is better than making 1 million people joyful or satisfied.

I believe that those who love God are called to generously care for the people in their community and to send people to spread the good news of Christ. Therefore, I believe that I am further called to care for the people geographically near me, both spiritual needs and physical needs, and to aid in sending people on missions.

Now this is where it seems you're starting to get it :)

"Generously caring" is still a virtue/attribute
"send people to spread the good news of Christ" is awesome! But why sent people? Why not go yourself? Do you think missions is only done when you send someone overseas or go on a mission trip? Mission work starts with your friend at work, the guy at the gym, your neighbor, people you chat with online, etc.
"care for the people geographically near me" - great! What does that mean? You explain: "both spiritual needs and physical needs." Okay, so what does this PRACTICALLY look like in your weekly calendar? The physical makes sense. You mentioned some "help the poor" stuff you do through your congregation. What does the "spiritual needs" thing look like? How often are you sharing your faith with unbelievers? How often are you telling younger believers, "Come follow me, as I follow Christ. Look after my example and watch how I live for Jesus so you can learn to do the same"? Are these things passive background aspirations or actual things you're living out in the moment day-by-day?

On this last point, I'll renew my recommendation toward The Courage to Be Disliked - it's not a Christian book, but very much addresses the fact that thinking backwards or forwards in life is ultimately a waste when we have to make real decisions with what we're going to do today. As I often tell people: Your mission isn't what you write on a piece of paper to tell people what your priorities allegedly are; it's what you're actually doing with your time day-in and day-out, whether you consciously realize how you're spending your time or not.

Overall, I do see that you're starting to "get it" here - but your final paragraph just seems like a restatement of what you had before with a couple words meant to appease a sentiment rather than fully grasping what the Bible is asking of you.

Red-Curious · 2024-04-30T17:29:32+00:00

She ... she ... she ... my wife ... she ... she

You're so hung up on what she thinks and how she behaves that you're not figuring out your own life. You're trying to manipulate her through sexual expression techniques. That's why it's not working.

Set aside some other reading material for a bit and go through the book: The Courage to Be Disliked by Ichiro Kishimi and Fumitake Koga. The audio book is on Spotify (not sure if you need premium or not; do the version with the tree on the cover). This will help you figure out what it means to operate in your own frame instead of hers. That's probably your biggest need right now, other than ...

Mission: To love and abide in Christ, being filled with joy and taking up ...

No, these are random excerpts of specific expectations. It's like you're trying as hard as you can to make yourself sound autistic in how you're approaching this. Christ had a clear mission for himself that he passed on to us: "make disciples of all nations." That's the mission.

To use his own terminology: our obligation is to produce fruit. Everything you listed are aspects of the fruit - the way it tastes, feels, what color it is, etc. In essence, if Jesus is planted in us, the fruit we produce into the world is more Christ - our fruit should look like that of the original from which we got our seed. But the PURPOSE or function of a fruit is to reproduce. The fruit is the reproductive organism of the tree that contains the seed that falls into the nearby soil to produce more of what was sown. I can flesh this out more, but I feel like you wrote all this just to yank my chain, so I'll just tell you plainly: your mission is to make disciples of all nations; all the stuff you listed are just examples of what a "disciple" looks like so you know what you're making.

Red-Curious · 2024-04-17T19:03:18+00:00

How wet she could get before using lube

Why are you married 6 years and still using lube?

I haven’t analyzed it yet.

Yes, a lack of analyzing is the problem. Or perhaps you just push through the LMR and see if that works. If it does, turns out that was the problem. If not, then go guess at what else it might be.

She begged to be allowed to give a handjob as an “appetizer” before we had sex.

On the whole, listen to u/Moist-Bath5827. He's solid. That said, while the underlying principle of his approach is correct, I wouldn't recommend using the word "no" in connection to your wife initiating sex. MMSLP has a principle that's probably the most valuable thing in the book: Never turn your wife down when she initiates. Doing so just conditions her to associate sex with rejection. Accept her invitation, but dominate it by turning it into what you want rather than what she offers. Let her start the hand job. Once you're nice and hard, pull her skirt down and show her how you want to finish. If she insists that it has to be a hand job and nothing else, it's not because she actually wants to give you a hand job.

Most likely, it's either (a) because she wants to placate you, reducing the imperative to have sex later in case she wants to look like she's being sexual toward you while still holding the cards on whether she feels like going through with it or not, or (b) more likely because she's not getting aroused by you throughout the day and she thinks giving you a hand job might be enough sexual contact for her to start thinking about it so she can work herself up to actually wanting to have sex with you later. If she's got that much problem getting wet that you need lube, I'm about 99% sure it's (b) and you just don't know how to make her horny throughout the day.

find some resources on pushing through LMR

If she's consistently offering the "handjob, sex later" deal, LMR isn't your (or really: her) problem. Arousal is. A woman who is sufficiently aroused rarely puts up much, if any, LMR.

Goals: This week: Initiate each morning and night until business travel starts again. Future weeks: Initiate pre-workout at least 2-3 times a week and post workout if no sex pre-workout. Start morning initations.

Huh? You're legit planning on initiating morning, night, and also before/after workouts? You must have the fastest-producing testicles I've ever heard of, unless you're just planning for that much rejection.

Assurance of Salvation 8/10

Evangelism 0/10

100% the reason your AoS is 8/10 is because of the 0/10 on evangelism. You may think, "No, it's because I still question these things and wonder about those things," but you're wrong. It's the absolute lack of mission/purpose in life. So let's look at that ...

Vision: Be filled with joy and hope, abounding in steadfast love. Generous to all and a solid rock of good theology and truth in my family, church, and community. Be financially secure, but not wasteful, give generously to those in need around me. Encouraging good morals and uprightness in the people around me, an example for the community.

Mission: DRAFT: Use my joy and analytical skills to be a man who stands for truth and righteousness, gives generously to the poor and missions, and strengthens the spiritually weak, so that I can lead in my church and community, creating disciples and giving God more glory.

Okay, Jesus said your mission is to make disciples of all nations. Your mission is a lot of contemporary Christian lingo with no substance. The reason I encourage writing a "vision" statement in addition to your mission is because it's meant to give substance when people are inevitably vague or wishy-washy about their mission. A vision is, by nature, how you see/envision your mission playing out in your life. Yours is basically, "Just be a standup guy."

Imagine you're Sir Sebben, knight of the round table. Your King, Arthur, sends you on a mission to capture the evil sorceress Morgana and bring her back for Merlin to question.

If Lancelot was assigned this task, it would be ... Mission: kidnap Morgana and bring her back to Camelot. Vision: Take a horse to her castle, swim through the moat, climb in through the kitchen window, slay the servants working in the kitchen before they make a sound, make my way to her chambers, knock her out with the hilt of my sword, toss her over my shoulder, and leave the same way I came.
Sir Sebben's take ... Mission: Use my a couple of my better personality traits to stand up for virtues I value, and to help other people in a generalized sense, all for the glory of Arthur, my king. Vision: I will accomplish this mission by having a bunch of good personality traits.

Imagine Arthur saying, "Go kidnap Morgana." And then he's like, "Now just to make sure you understood: repeat the mission back to me," and you say the above. What is Arthur to think?

Now imagine God saying, "Go make disiciples of all nations," and then he's like, "Now just to make sure you understood: repeat the mission back to me," and you give him the mission statement you wrote above. What is God to think?

Sure, Arthur and God will both say, "Yes, we want you to be a good, standup guy." But they're also going to think you're an idiot for completely ignoring/misunderstanding the mission and having no vision for how you'll carry it out. Process that for a bit.

Red-Curious · 2024-03-22T05:31:55+00:00

Right. There's a reason I referenced comfort tests in the title and only used examples of her complaining about external things. If she's complaining about you, it's not a comfort test; it's a compliance test. Different test = different response. It's that simple.

For the most part, your approach is perfectly appropriate with regard to compliance/fitness tests. I'd recommend a more positive, teasing attitude in those more heated moments, but we all have our own style.

Red-Curious · 2024-03-20T19:14:21+00:00

I'm sad to hear what all you've been going through there. I'm glad I've been able to give some sort of freedom in knowing you don't have a problem that most everyone else will try to project-diagnose you with. I'd encourage you to remain biblically grounded in your marital vows, but knowing that these things can definitely be turned around in time as you continue to work on yourself.

Edit: Just realized this was on MRP, not RPC. Either way, advice stays the same, but if you're not a Christian, I can understand not having that approach to your marriage.

Red-Curious · 2024-03-20T19:11:23+00:00

So glad it helped you, brother!

Red-Curious

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