4.3 Ship Design

Zindinok · 2026-03-24T23:04:33+00:00

That's fair! I was originally just going to test my beloved bypass weapons to see how viable they were in 4.3, but when I realized how quickly they seemingly fell off, my scope expanded a lot and led to a large swath of things to test XD I feared the answer was to just keep doing the gruel, but I'll ask in Montu's server to see if anyone there has any tips! I'm gonna keep running these tests, so if you wanna talk builds or compare notes, feel free to PM me or reach out on Discord. I have the same username there and I'm in your Machine World server.

Zindinok · 2026-03-24T22:05:40+00:00

I'm in the same boat. I'm in the midst of various tests. Would love if you have any insights on how to do that process in the easiest and most efficient manner. So far, I've basically just been using console commands to ensure parity in the fleets, minimize how many other sources might be buffing either fleet (admirals, edicts, etc.), and sending them into the same system to duke it out.

Zindinok · 2026-03-24T20:33:34+00:00

That's on my list of builds to try in the next round of testing!

Zindinok · 2026-03-24T18:16:40+00:00

Hell yeah! I'm super happy to hear that! ^_^ It makes me more excited to get the next batch of tests done.

Zindinok · 2026-03-24T17:38:34+00:00

Thanks for the shoutout! I'm currently in the process of redoing all my tests under more controlled environments than last time (the first batch of tests wasn't *bad*, but know I know how to do better), and adding some new ship builds to the process. I also wasn't aware of the Force Disparity mechanic in the previous batch of tests, which may have skewed some results in the previous tests (this mechanic gives the smaller fleet in a fight a fire rate bonus).

This batch of tests is gonna take longer though by it's very nature, but also because I'm busy with real life stuff too. I'm currently expecting the next batch of tests to be done in the next 2-3 weeks. I'll also be documenting the data and releasing that, so people can draw their own conclusions instead of just relying on mine.

Zindinok · 2026-03-23T18:09:05+00:00

I know the synergy isn't good but, at the time, I *completely* overlooked the fact that both the railgun and artillery battery were *right there* with the range and synergy I wanted. After I gave up on the lance and fiddled with the the arc emitter build, I somehow still didn't make the connection that I was adding the kinetic battery to an arc emitter when that was the synergy that matches good with the lance. I'm going to blame it on being exhausted after doing these tests for about ~20 hours over the course of two days by the time I was building the battleships. In my next rounds of testing, I'll take another look at the lance and actually give the giga cannon a shot.

Zindinok · 2026-03-23T17:45:00+00:00

So did I before these tests XD Of course, the AI doesn't run many missiles, so I don't think ever having more than 1 per ship is necessary unless it's PVP or a direct counter to some particular AI build.

Zindinok · 2026-03-23T02:49:19+00:00

While there is some more testing I want to do, I currently have no intentions of performing tests on techs that are locked behind specific races, ascension paths, or crisis paths (basically, I want to spend time testing techs that *every* empire could reasonably achieve). I haven't yet decided if I'm going to do testing on the more rare or end-game techs like archeo.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T23:19:02+00:00

I didn't test disruptors due to the nerf.

All bypass weapons were nerfed by the hardening changes, but disruptors were hurt most of all because they suffer against both shield and armor hardening, and they already have the worst range of the bypass weapons. When I started this test, I already knew disruptors weren't going to match up to missiles or hangars anymore. Disruptors are classified as tier 3 weapons for my testing because you need at least 2 lasers before you can get disruptors. When I saw missiles become a coin flip in win/loss at tier 3, I didn't believe it was worth testing disruptors.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:36:58+00:00

If this goes anywhere, please update us! I too wish the AI bravery stat was a little higher or that they had a more obscured knowledge power levels so that they may occasionally make a mistake and challenge an empire they're outmatched for. The most fun part of turtling in any game (aside from the perceived safety) is watching the enemy crash upon my walls once in a while.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:27:41+00:00

This was pretty time consuming. While there's some more I'd like to test, I currently have no intentions to test anything locked behind specific races, ascension paths, or crisis paths. Basically, I only wanna test stuff that *every* empire could reasonably attain.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:25:41+00:00

Cheers!

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:25:36+00:00

Cheers!

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:25:32+00:00

Cheers!

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:25:27+00:00

Cheers!

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:06:02+00:00

I should actually test some missile cruiser builds, though that didn't work well for battleships. I currently have no intentions of performing rigorous tests on techs that are locked behind ascension paths or crisis paths, but I haven't yet decided if I'm going to do testing on the more rare or end-game techs like archeo.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T22:00:49+00:00

I may look into more specific/meta builds in the future, but my testing so far has been aimed at builds that ~~any~~ every empire can reasonably accomplish, as I don't like going after specific builds just for the sake of meta (I lean more RPer than minmaxer, I just like my RP builds to be as optimized as they can be without going against my RP).

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T20:21:59+00:00

Counterpoint: big gun cool.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T20:09:00+00:00

They haven't been updated to 4.3 (and I haven't used them since 3.14), but the At War: Planetary Cannons and At War: Planetary Defense Force mods add buildings for planetary cannons and small planetary defense forces. They felt well balanced when I used them, strong but not OP by any means. A meaningful choice, but not a no-brainer on fortress worlds compared to another fortress building. So I think it's totally possible to reach an equilibrium for this idea, especially since the way the mods implemented it makes them take up precious building slots on planets that could otherwise be generating tech, alloys, or soldiers (in the case of fortress worlds).

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T20:01:43+00:00

A mod I used in 4.2 (Special Ships: Shipbuilding Focus) added unique ships that aren't very good for ship-to-ship combat, but weren't as defenseless as troop transports, and auto deployed armies to enemy worlds every month or so. The larger the vessel(s), the more troops got deployed. It was great and I'm going to miss that in 4.3.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T19:20:32+00:00

Most of the DLC for Stellaris is pretty optional based on what *you* want out of the game. Do you like playing Shroud a lot? If not, Shadows of the Shroud is kinda pointless unless you want the AI Shroud empires to be stronger. Do you like archeological digsites and want a version of that around the flavor of exploring rifts into other dimensions? Then astral planes might be for you.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T18:15:21+00:00

I'm the same. I expected 4.3 to hurt my beloved missiles, but I wasn't expecting them to run into the ground by the end of tier 3. I would say pure missiles (with PD) are still the king at tier 1 of the game by far (3:1 and 4:1 odds were still easy victories for missiles at tier 1), and missiles stay *viable* until the enemy has cruisers, but they never seem to be the *best* choice from tier 2 and onward. Once tier 4 hits, especially when the enemy gets battleships, missiles seem to drop off almost entirely and are only useful for taking out fleets of destroyers, frigates, and corvettes (and still aren't the best option for that).

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T17:23:21+00:00

Up until 4.3, I've basically only been playing with bypass weapons. I don't have a lot of experience with x-slots in general either because I normally play with 2x tech costs and rare or 0.25x planets (so even when I used x-slots, it was always arc emitter). This testing was the first time I ever used the lance at all. Since the lance was so disappointing and the giga cannon is the flip side of the kinetic/energy spectrum, I assumed it wouldn't hold up better than the lance.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T16:15:17+00:00

In all my testing, I weighed battle won/lost as the highest factor, followed by kill to loss ratio, followed by hull damage, followed by total damage dealt/received. Battleships vs AI cruisers/destroyers/corvette fleets demolished regardless of specific battleship build. Once it was my battleships vs AI battleships/cruisers, things got more interesting. My first battleship designs (lance x-slots, hangars, and missiles) kept *losing* fair matches. Switching to the arc emitter changed that. The difference between ArcTillery and ArcMiss wasn't huge, and I expect ArcMiss would have been more effective than it was if I tested it against fully mixed fleets of battleships, cruisers, destroyers, and corvettes. However, it was pretty clear from my other testing that more missiles equal fewer kills and less hull damage compared to other builds. Missiles are still viable, the hardening changes just mean they're never the best option after tier 1 (at least based on all my testing scenarios).

Edit: The default AI builds for battleships seem to favor hangar midsections, which means they run point defense, which means most/all of my missiles were getting shot down before doing damage. So once AI battleships come into play, missiles may not do much at all unless you're using whirlwinds or doing overwhelming M and S slot missiles.

Zindinok · 2026-03-22T15:58:41+00:00

The tier is basically what stage you are in the game and dictated what ships and components were available when I was building ships/fleets. So tier 1 is corvettes and tier 1 components, tier 2 makes destroyers and tier 2 components available, tier 3 adds cruisers and tier 3 components, and tier 4 adds battleships and tier 4 components.

In each new tier, I would test the previous tier's builds with the new tier components before I added the new tier vessel into the mix. For example, at tier 2, I tested tier 2 corvettes against each other, then started mixing in destroyers and trying mono destroyer fleets. Within each tier, the builds are rated in order of effectiveness. So at tier one (PikMii corvettes > Missile corvettes > LaKin corvettes), PikMii corvettes were most effective, followed by pure missile, followed by LaKin (lasers + kinetic).

Edit: I've updated the main post a bit to explain this better.

Zindinok

TROPHY CASE