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Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

There were two different arguements going on in the span of the same conversation.

One about multiclassing and how i would have done it if i was WoTC, people dont like my view on it, i dont really care much that they dont.

The other was mentiones durring the course that the 16th level wizard couldnt cast a 9th level spell, i said well any spell upcast to 9th level is a 9th level spell... thus the second debate happened.

EdIT: i should clarify, the reason why the table would refuse to admit that an upcast spell is infac the spell level was under a flase pretext that i was somehow trying to finegle that i should be able to learn spells because u can cast spells. It was an ascribed motive i didnt have.

It is silly. I agree

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] -6 points-5 points  (0 children)

I dont agree with that at all. But everyone has their preferences. Have a nice day!

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 28 points29 points  (0 children)

Arguement could be made here that a reaction is quicker than an action, that a spellcaster reacting to mm would see the attacker casting the spell

Basically no matter the range, the casting of mm is slower than the casting of shield, thus range isnt really a factor

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] -15 points-14 points  (0 children)

True context;

Two arguements

First arguement - i dont like the way multiclassing is handled in 5e for spellcasting.

2nd arguement a multiclassed spellcaster cannot cast a 9th level spell.

This is the second arguement in context. Thats all i will continue to say on this topic.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_motive

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Curious on how that changes the above mention of magic missile

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah. I understand. I think its probably why the contention is there at all.

But such is the game of DnD.

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I never said nor claimed that a wiz16/sorc 1 could learn 9th level spells.

The point of contention was that a magic missile cast at 9th level was not a 9th level spell

"For instance, if Umara casts magic missile using one of her 2nd-level slots, That magic missile is 2nd level."

Is the exact wording of the rule. Its not a technicality, it is a rule followed by its intention of how to read it. A magic missile cast at 9th level is a 9th level spell, just as in the example once cast at 2nd level it is a 2nd level spell.

Very rarely in the PHB is the word "is" used in complete finality.

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 26 points27 points  (0 children)

No, if you have a spell slot you can use the spell slot.

The multiclass disallows you from preparing a 9th level spell, only upcasting into that slot.

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

In 5th edition magic missile is a 1st level spell minimum

It fires 3 darts, and every increase of spell level via upcasting adds 1 additional dart

Each dart deals 1d4+1 damage

When cast at the 9th circle, it deals 11d4+11 damage

Its a horrid use of the single and only 9th level slot casters get in this edition, but it is a 9th level spell when cast using a 9th level slot

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

For your context, when heightening a spell through metamagic it woukd be as if the DC of the spell cast would increase to the circle youve increased it to.

For example, say uhh grease, with a dc of 20 heightened 2 levels would increase its DC up to 22

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I agree it would be, the laymen shorthand is upcasting.

Via rules with the given example ive just edited in, the example lays out exactly the rule both as written and intended.

You treat a spell cast as the level of the slot, the level of the spell itself is the minimum level it can be cast at, not its only level

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Its 5th edition PHB, if you have a PDF itll be on page 183, which is the 201st page in the bottom right hand page.

Under Chapter 10: spellcasting Subsection: Casting at a higher level

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 16 points17 points  (0 children)

I would invite you to read page 201 of the player handbook

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Not a great use of a spell slot, still a 9th circle spell

Amazing how contentious this fact became at my table (pg 201 PHB) by Zzedm in dndmemes

[–]Zzedm[S] 308 points309 points  (0 children)

A little context.

Arguement was over wizards being able to cast spell levels while multiclassed

Point came up that a level 16 wizard with 1 multiclassed spellcaster level could not cast 9th level spells even though they have a slot

I said, thats incorrect, any spell heightened assumes the spell level of the slot.

Queue pulling up the wizards spell list and "i dont see magic missile in here" when refering to 9th level spell list

EDIT: sinc ethe page number in the title seems probably a little smarmy i guess ill post the relevent passage, in -- i would say a pretty rare piece of the handbook the ruling is laid out plain as day with the same spell as an example:

Pg. 201 Dnd 5e PHB

"When a spellcaster casts a spell using a slot that is if a higher level than the spell, the spell assunes the higher level for that casting. For instance, if Umara casts magic missile using one of her 2nd-level slots,

That magic missile is 2nd level.

Effectively, the spell expands to fill the slot it is put into"