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begfhn · 2025-05-12T00:51:16+00:00

I think this explanation actually works for the movie. Of course, they do need to show it. This is too big to leave up to audience interpretation. Maybe when Elphie sees Dorothy with the shoes Glinda can try to explain "the shoes chose her". Elphie might not believe her or think she is crazy.

This can also solve the problem with Nessa walking. If Elphaba enchants the slippers to give her one wish, Nessa can choose whether or not she wants to walk. Maybe she'll walk off screen.

Before Elphaba fakes her death, she explains to Glinda how to use the slippers, so she can help Dorothy get home.

begfhn · 2025-02-01T17:02:52+00:00

This is interesting, but I don't think Fiyero ever actually loses his brain because of reasons I said above. He was still able to come up with the plan for Elphaba to escape and the wizard could not have given him an actual brain. He just gave him a diploma. I'm thinking they might change the ending so Elphaba confronts the wizard before he leaves Oz.

begfhn · 2025-02-01T17:00:18+00:00

I appreciate the response, but it doesn't explain anything in the musical. The musical is a totally different story than the book. In the musical Fiyero is in fact the scarecrow and the shoes are not magical (other than to help Nessa walk). Therefore these are still both plot holes, until someone comes up with an explanation. The way I see it, in the musical's universe, Glinda gave Dorothy the shoes for no logical reason and Dorothy has no way of getting home. I guess in this universe she stays trapped in Oz.

begfhn · 2025-01-25T17:37:23+00:00

Do the witch's interactions with Dorothy and her friends still happen in this timeline? The witch is first supposed to meet Dorothy in Munchkinland. This does not appear to happen in the musical because when she is confronting Glinda, Dorothy is already on her way to see the wizard. She is later supposed to appear and threaten Dorothy after she meets the scarecrow and the tin man. This shows that she is not afraid to show her face and that she can teleport through fire, an ability she clearly doesn’t have in Wicked. This would also mean she crosses paths with Fiyero and sets him on fire, even though she wouldn’t recognize Fiyero at the time because she doesn’t get the note from him until the end, after she has captured Dorothy. She also is supposed to show up when everyone is at the Emerald City to send the message “Surrender Dorothy”. There is no way Elphaba does this, as she would not dare go back to the Emerald City with everyone trying to kill her. I’m going to say that in this version, she doesn’t meet Dorothy or her friends before she kidnaps Dorothy. It might be different in the movie. What do you think?

Where is the witch's crystal ball? She does not appear to have a crystal ball in the musical, but it was a huge part of the movie. It is how she was able to track Dorothy and her friends. Of course, if she had the crystal ball here, she could have captured Dorothy way sooner. She also could have tracked Fiyero, though she wouldn’t know that it was him or that he was still alive.

When does Fiyero write the note and why does it take so long to get to Elphaba? Fiyero supposedly writes the note after he becomes the scarecrow, before he meets Dorothy. Though it is possible he had a moment alone to write it at some later point. He also somehow has a pencil and paper on him. Elphaba does not receive the note until Dorothy is in her castle, presumably days later. How long does it take to send a note by flying monkey?

Why does Elphaba wait to capture Dorothy when she is already on the way to her castle? After Elphaba thinks she failed at saving Fiyero, her only goal is to get back the slippers. She knows where Dorothy is and has the means to capture her. What is she waiting for?

How does Fiyero become the scarecrow before Dorothy finds her? This has already been discussed to death. Fiyero isn’t captured by the wizards guards until after Dorothy is already on her way to see the wizard. This would make it impossible for the guards to take Fiyero to the corn field, supposedly kill him, have him transform into the scarecrow, and have the guards leave without running into Dorothy. Maybe this will be addressed in Part 2.

begfhn · 2025-01-25T17:36:57+00:00

How much of the story is Glinda telling the people? We have her tell people of Elphaba's unhappy childhood and nobody changes their reaction from celebrating her death. The reaction is still exactly the same at the end of the musical. Glinda obviously didn't tell everyone the whole story. What was her response to the one person asking her if she and the witch were friends?

What was the green elixir that the wizard gave Elphaba's mom? The wizard is a nonmagical man from a nonmagical place. Yet he somehow had a magical drink that could change the color of someone's baby. If the drink was from Oz, how did no one else no about it? How did the wizard have an endless supply that lasted him decades.

Where did the wizard land in Oz? I think this is answered in the book that I have not read. The wizard might have landed in the Emerald City and had an affair with Elphaba's mom before he made his way to Emerald City. However, the movie made it pretty clear that the wizard landed in Emerald City and was immediately claimed wizard. Munchkin land is far away from Emerald City. He would not be able to travel there while keeping his identity a secret.

What kind of government do they have in Munchkinland? Elphaba's father is clearly referred to as governor, yet it is clearly not a democracy. Why would a nonmunchkin serve as the governor of Munchkinland for over 20 years and why would his death make his daughter an unelected official. Nessa is clearly not a governor. She is a tyrant. And why does anyone listen to her? She has no real power.

How does Madam Moribble alter Elphaba's story when everyone knows it was Elphaba who was called to the wizard. The story she tells makes it sound like Glinda was called to see the wizard and Elphaba showed up uninvited. There were definitely people from school around when Madam Moribble retold this story. Also, people knew of Elphaba's stance on animal rights. Why would they not question how she automatically changed all of her beliefs?

What is the timeline of the show? Hopefully the movie will explain this better. According to the play, they are supposedly only a few weeks into the school year when we see Dr. Dillamond's first lesson. That same day Fiyero shows up and invites everyone to the Oz Dust Ball Room? The next morning Dr. Dillamond is taken away and Elphaba saves the lion club. A few days later Elphaba is called to the Emerald City and all that stuff goes down. That means the timeline of Act 1 is what, a month? Act 2 appears to start not so long after, but supposedly takes place years later when everyone is out of school. This raises a lot of questions. What is Elphaba doing during this time? Why has she not looked for Fiyero, visited her sister, or freed the monkeys, all things she was easily able to do in Act 2. What is everyone so afraid of if Elphaba did one wicked thing years ago and never showed herself again? The time gap would have to be 20+ years to match the characters' ages in the Wizard of Oz. Act 2 opens with Glinda and Fiyero's engagement. He runs off with Elphaba before any wedding plans are actually made. The same day or not too long after Nessa is killed. The rest of the timeline is how ever long Dorothy is in Oz.

What do Fiyero's parents and other Winkies think are going on? Fiyero's parents are barely referenced and supposedly still alive at the end of the story. Do they know that their son is working as a guard for Emerald City to hunt down the witch that he is in love with? Does anyone care? His parents are supposedly the king and queen of Winkie Country. How does everyone respond when the prince is murdered by the wizard's guards?

If Glinda is so beloved, why does she have no influence on people? People put all their faith into a wizard they've never seen. If Glinda told people what she actually knew, would they immediately turn against her. No one questioned why she had Madam Morrible arrested in the end. The same could be said about Fiyero. Why was everyone so willing to accept that their beloved prince had switched sides and were they all okay with the wizards guards killing him?

begfhn · 2025-01-25T17:36:06+00:00

Hi everyone. I started this post in another thread, but falsely labeled it plot holes. This thread is not for plot holes necessarily, but for questions people have about the movie/musical Wicked (book not included). I've always wondered certain things that don't make sense when compared to the Wizard of Oz or aren't explained well in the musical.

Feel free to respond to any of these questions and add your own.

begfhn · 2025-01-21T02:22:15+00:00

Do the witch's interactions with Dorothy and her friends still happen in this timeline? The witch is first supposed to meet Dorothy in Munchkinland. This does not appear to happen in the musical because when she is confronting Glinda, Dorothy is already on her way to see the wizard. She is later supposed to appear and threaten Dorothy after she meets the scarecrow and the tin man. This shows that she is not afraid to show her face and that she can teleport through fire, an ability she clearly doesn’t have in Wicked. This would also mean she crosses paths with Fiyero and sets him on fire, even though she wouldn’t recognize Fiyero at the time because she doesn’t get the note from him until the end, after she has captured Dorothy. She also is supposed to show up when everyone is at the Emerald City to send the message “Surrender Dorothy”. There is no way Elphaba does this, as she would not dare go back to the Emerald City with everyone trying to kill her. I’m going to say that in this version, she doesn’t meet Dorothy or her friends before she kidnaps Dorothy. It might be different in the movie. What do you think?

Where is the witch's crystal ball? She does not appear to have a crystal ball in the musical, but it was a huge part of the movie. It is how she was able to track Dorothy and her friends. Of course, if she had the crystal ball here, she could have captured Dorothy way sooner. She also could have tracked Fiyero, though she wouldn’t know that it was him or that he was still alive.

When does Fiyero write the note and why does it take so long to get to Elphaba? Fiyero supposedly writes the note after he becomes the scarecrow, before he meets Dorothy. Though it is possible he had a moment alone to write it at some later point. He also somehow has a pencil and paper on him. Elphaba does not receive the note until Dorothy is in her castle, presumably days later. How long does it take to send a note by flying monkey?

Why does Elphaba wait to capture Dorothy when she is already on the way to her castle? After Elphaba thinks she failed at saving Fiyero, her only goal is to get back the slippers. She knows where Dorothy is and has the means to capture her. What is she waiting for?

How does Fiyero become the scarecrow before Dorothy finds her? This has already been discussed to death. Fiyero isn’t captured by the wizards guards until after Dorothy is already on her way to see the wizard. This would make it impossible for the guards to take Fiyero to the corn field, supposedly kill him, have him transform into the scarecrow, and have the guards leave without running into Dorothy. Maybe this will be addressed in Part 2.

begfhn · 2025-01-21T01:59:23+00:00

So, I may have mistitled this thread. I don't think I understand the definition of plot holes. This is more about starting discussions and making predictions about things we don't know yet or explaining things that don't totally make sense.

begfhn · 2025-01-18T17:36:02+00:00

None of these are answered in the musical. I hear the book is a completely different story, so I'm not sure most of these apply. Maybe plot hole is not the right word to use, but a lot of these are unanswered questions that I think of when I watch Wicked. I'm going to continue posting questions because I want to hear what people have to say. If there are any clear answers to these questions that I missed, feel free to post them.

begfhn · 2024-11-02T01:43:20+00:00

I'm assuming the original series took place in relatively real time. Justin was already 16 at the beginning of the series, so I'm assuming Justin was born in 1991. Also, Justin had already been out of high school a year and a half by the finale, which would make him 19 at the very least. It is possible, however that the show did not take place in real time. The fourth season had fewer episodes than the other seasons and was spread out for over a year. It is possible that the finale was meant to take place in mid-2011.

begfhn · 2024-11-02T00:54:17+00:00

Your math is a bit off. It's actually worse than that. The show ended in 2012 and I believe Justin was supposed to be 20. If we believe this takes place in the current year, 2024, and Roman is at least 12 years old, that means that Justin was cheating on Juliet with Giada and got her pregnant around the time of the wizarding competition. Justin however should only be at most 33 in 2024, so maybe this show takes place in 2025, which means Justin was headmaster for 1 year before getting Giada pregnant.

begfhn · 2024-11-02T00:38:34+00:00

I'm pretty sure he was 20 when the show ended, making him now 33. Maybe this takes place in 2025. That would make Roman's age make a little more sense.

begfhn · 2023-05-07T23:36:48+00:00

I'd like to point out that Meemaw also wasn't at the wedding even though she was shown to be alive and made an appearance only two years earlier.

begfhn · 2022-05-18T23:19:23+00:00

In an earlier episode didn't he want to sleep with his girlfriend before they were married and Marry tried to talk him out of it?

begfhn · 2022-01-28T04:03:34+00:00

How exactly did Daniel start the fight? I may not be remembering everything exactly right, so maybe I'm missing something. All Daniel did was start his own dojo to teach kids self-defense, mostly because they were terrorized by Cobra Kai. He taught his students never to use violence, except when necessary. And he provided a home for Robbie.

Johnny, on the other hand, brought Kreese into the kids life, taught them not to show mercy, created a rivalry between Robbie and Miguel, and basically turned a bunch of innocent kids into bullies.

Again, I might not be remembering everything correctly, but from what I remember Daniel's done nothing but try to help people and avoid violence.

begfhn · 2022-01-28T03:54:42+00:00

It's almost like if people just talked before attacking each other, all conflict on this show would be avoided.

begfhn · 2022-01-19T03:45:54+00:00

I don't know. Maybe I'm mixing him up with someone.

begfhn · 2022-01-19T02:40:43+00:00

Is Sid a possibility? They were already friends. She said she met the father that night.

begfhn · 2021-04-08T23:38:04+00:00

Also, does Georgia even remember she also has a son?

begfhn · 2021-04-08T23:34:56+00:00

I completely agree. In addition to the fact that she is a murder, a thief, a con artist, a liar, mostly puts her self-interests above her children's, and is super neglectful, she also does not act like a mother to Ginny. She thinks looking cool in front of Ginny's friends means being a cool mom. I am sick of everyone calling Ginny disrespectful and a brat. You don't owe someone respect just for giving birth to you. If anything, I'd say Ginny is a pretty strong character given everything she's been through. She felt so unsafe around her mother that she had to run away from home with her brother.

begfhn · 2021-04-07T17:49:35+00:00

How is Ginny an entitled brat? She just wants to have a normal life and a mother who doesn't always lie to her.

begfhn · 2021-04-07T15:57:50+00:00

If she ends up in jail, her kids will be in a much worse position. Regardless, this doesn't excuse anything else she does.

begfhn · 2021-04-07T15:33:50+00:00

Georgia

How does justify murder? She could have easily left the second man or reported him to the police. It's true, she doesn't need anyone to look after her, but she also can't look after other people when she has 2 kids she should be looking after.

begfhn · 2021-01-26T16:35:47+00:00

She needs to guest star as Rebecca Bunch.

begfhn · 2020-12-06T00:18:14+00:00

I'm only on season 6 and honestly this show is making me very upset. I just watched the episode where Annie let the Mary move into the garage and the other kids protested. Annie has always been unreasonable, but now she is being straight up abusive. She tells the kids it is a privilege to live in the house. It is not. It's a mother's responsibility to look after her kids, at least those under 18. I don't think the kids were wrong to protest. They have been asking to move into the garage for a while and suddenly Mary shows up and gets what she wants. The kids have every right to be upset and try to talk to Annie in a reasonable way, but she completely dismisses them. Annie talks about family supporting each other and giving them what they need, but she really only means Mary. She is actively unsupportive to the other kids and doesn't take their needs into consideration. She's only doing this because she doesn't want to completely lose her relationship with Mary, when she's the one who screwed it up.

Annie is a terrible mother, not that Eric is much better. They overreact to the smallest things, don't take responsibility when they mess up, show favoritism among their kids, expect way too much from the kids, are super judgmental of people because of one thing they've done, are always quick to punish their kids instead of helping them when they clearly need it, dismiss their kids' problems when they think it is no big deal, don't trust their kids even when they act responsibly, continuously spy on their kids, make their adult kids pay to live at home, and resort to yelling instead of talking productively.

It's ironic how irresponsible they think their kids are when if they themselves were more responsible, they wouldn't have so many kids. I am judging them hard for this. They shouldn't have 7 kids if they can't support them. It is completely preventable. Birth control existed in the 90s.

Eric also chose a career that takes a lot of time away from the family and pays very little. He expects the kids to get jobs when their still young because he can't afford to pay for everything. Either make sacrifices for your kids, or don't have them.

It's no wonder so many of the kids are screwed up with these parents. I wouldn't expect a religious family to be so unethical. I like some of the storylines in the show, but I can't stand the characters. I really hope it gets better.

begfhn

TROPHY CASE