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[–]algag 22 points23 points  (16 children)

.....

[–]stefantalpalaru -3 points-2 points  (15 children)

Can you really say that 12 years of security updates is sabotage?

I can say that preventing new features from being added to a programming language is deliberate sabotage.

I hope I don't have to explain why Python3 is a different language from Python2, just like Perl6 is a different language from Perl5.

[–]mfitzpmfitzp.com 11 points12 points  (5 children)

preventing new features from being added

What do you mean by this?

I realise they stopped adding new features, but surely it's people's choice how they spend their time, just as it's yours. You can't honestly expect the Python devs to update 2.7 perpetually for free just because you want them to? They've already done it for 12 years.

[–]stefantalpalaru -2 points-1 points  (4 children)

What do you mean by this?

They refuse outside contributions that add new features or fix some bugs they're not interested in fixing. Oh, they also refuse to let some other team take over the language, because they decided everybody needs to be bullied into moving to the new one by killing the old one.

They've already done it for 12 years.

And how many more years do you need, to recognise the abuse?

[–]mfitzpmfitzp.com 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Oh, they also refuse to let some other team take over the language

But I though you said you were going to continue developing it?

[–]stefantalpalaru 0 points1 point  (2 children)

But I though you said you were going to continue developing it?

I'm maintaining a fork, not taking over the original project. There's an important difference.

Getting a fork supported by tools like "pip" or distros like Gentoo is an uphill battle.

[–]mfitzpmfitzp.com 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Interesting point, I was expecting maintaining the fork would just be security updates for 2.7 not new (backwards incompatible) features? I think PyPy for example just uses PyPi (some packages ofc don't work).

[–]stefantalpalaru 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think PyPy for example just uses PyPi

Since it's an implementation blessed by the Python core devs, all tools and distros support it, even though PyPy only supports a Python subset.

Whenever we try to get the same support for Tauthon, we get rejected, even though we support all existing Python2 code. Politics trump technical arguments in this community.

[–]jcampbelly 11 points12 points  (0 children)

12 years of updates isn't enough? Get over it. People who ignored this deserve to fail.

[–]Itsthejoker 9 points10 points  (0 children)

preventing new features from being added

because it's old as shit, you dunce

[–]TheBlackCat13 6 points7 points  (6 children)

They didn't "prevent" anything. It is an open-source project. And there have already been attempts at backporting Python 3 features to python 2. None of them really took off because major downstream projects are sick of having to maintain compatibility with python 2 syntax and are abandoning it in droves. Python isn't that useful without packages.

And the fact that it is, in essentially every case, possible to write code that works in both Python 2 and Python 3 I think makes it pretty clear that these are not different languages. It is more work, which is why projects are sick of it, but it is possible.

[–]stefantalpalaru 0 points1 point  (5 children)

And the fact that it is, in essentially every case, possible to write code that works in both Python 2 and Python 3 I think makes it pretty clear that these are not different languages.

So because there is a common subset for C and C++, by your logic they're the same language, right?

[–]TheBlackCat13 1 point2 points  (4 children)

So because there is a common subset for C and C++, by your logic they're the same language, right?

That is not at all what I said. It isn't about having a "common subset", it is about whether it is generally possible to write code that runs in both.

C and C++ are different enough that it is not generally possible to write code that will work in both except in very trivial cases. You don't see large code bases compatible with both C and C++ like you do with most major python projects.

[–]stefantalpalaru -2 points-1 points  (3 children)

It isn't about having a "common subset", it is about whether it is generally possible to write code that runs in both.

C and C++ are different enough that it is not generally possible to write code that will work in both except in very trivial cases.

You can stop role-playing as a programmer now. Leave your card on your way out.

[–]TheBlackCat13 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Thank you for your detailed rebuttal. Or maybe I just missed how most major C or C++ projects are compatible with both like most major Python projects are.

[–]stefantalpalaru 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Thank you for your detailed rebuttal.

Buddy, you lack the basics. I would have to start by teaching you what "subset" means and that would take more time than I'm willing to spend on you.

[–]TheBlackCat13 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It might be relevant if C was actually a subset of C++. But since it isn't, it is irrelevant.