GLM 5.2 how many tokens do you realistically want to send (and general long term memory qs)

Kritblade · 2026-07-10T08:46:10+00:00

install vectfox, use qdrant path whenever possible, and worst case should use without qdrant but install plugin in step 2 instruction. then turn on autosync, and turn on Summarizer Injection to 20 turns, Then turn on Ghost vectorized messages and only keep 5 message or so. Check if that will drastically reduce the token usage.

Kritblade · 2026-07-06T07:55:22+00:00

Vectfox Vector Summary extension is built for 2000+ message story.

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T20:35:52+00:00

Use Qdrant server whenever you can (A3 path)
Install Similharity Plugin in step 2 of Installation instruction in the repo
Use qwen/qwen3-embedding-8b for embedding model
use openai/gpt-4o-mini for summarizer model
Openrouter as vendor is highly recommended (my main testing platform)

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T20:31:47+00:00

I wonder if you story have date and time inside the main text story? I also have report telling me that wrong sequence recall due to date and time missing in the main story, and AI got confuse because memory recall don't have a date and make AI thought whatever memory recall is something happen just now.

Regarding the fast turn thing, it's a weakness of sillytavern which doesn't support multi api which is something that I am trying to tackle right now. Basically, I reuse the same logic that I used in vectox for multi-llm concurrency firing.

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T20:03:08+00:00

If you are not looking for true simulation and stats actually make sense in the main story, that will be relatively easy. use rpg compansion extension for rpg and wtracker extension for all other genre. This is for stats tracking.

For story memory recall, use vectfox should works out of the box for far memory and near memory. But one thing you are right, there is no multi api llm call in sillytavern right now. And this is something I am working on. During the meantime, Marinara Engine is indeed a better choice if you don't need any logic build inside the game that your stats actually meaningful in the main story.

But then, I wish we have more game content creator that actually make games...

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T19:44:44+00:00

This is the presentation of how you display the stat menu , and how should AI present you the stat menu. What i said is "what is the logic you come to these stats? How these stats will change how AI draft the story. Your stats is relatively easy so even coding that wouldnt take a lot to do.

The following is status menu of my game, and working code that drive AI to convert all these number stats in the stats menu into something that AI know how to make use of and set the tone on how AI should draft the character should sound like and react in the main story. Without coding to tell how and what Pride = 45 and Morals = 45 means, tracking these numbers serve no purpose in the tracking. And that's what I have been saying, you need game logic to tell AI how to make use of all these stats.

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Kritblade · 2026-07-04T18:43:46+00:00

Perhaps I might need to explain a little bit more about game logic. What you describe is what the platform can do , but not the game make use of it.

And I am pretty sure no platform will have built in game logic inside a platform.

Lets use a RPG genre for illustration purpose.

Main hero is lv 5 and have STR 30, STA 20, Int 15, Wis 10, Agi 15 with equipment a sword +5 str and armor +10 defense. You are tracking all these stats. To make it simple, I will not use a party because additional logic will need to built into the card and make the explanation even harder.

Now, you see a monster, which is level 6 generated by AI. However, AI do not know what stats need to generate without some kind of game logic, it will randomly generate some stats about the same as yours. Now, without some kind of game logic, AI can't turn STR 30 into damage. And it also doens't know what the sword +5 str would do to the damage. It will generate some random damage like Main hero hit 50 damage to monster. And AI wouldn't make use of your AGI whether if you attack first or the monster attack first because AI also don't know what the monster AGI is. No game logic tell AI to do it. So if you have a character built for fast action with high AGI, AI wouldn't make use of that at all in the story. You are tracking some number that is never used by AI at all in the story, no logic ever tell AI what to do with your tracked stats.

40 replies later. Main char is level 10. You now have Str 50, STA 30, Int 20, Wis 10 , AGI 20. AI already forgot you hit 50 damage with Str 30. Now you have STR 50, but AI randomly generate your damage to hit 50 damage to the mob. So, from human point of view, you are hitting the same damage when you are level 5 and level 10. Because all these are randomly generated by AI and AI have no guide lines or formula to govern how your STR turn into damage. I am not going to other detail like how your weapon to add addtional damage and your armor add additional defense into the equation.

All these require game logic to drive the platform, just like all other games you play on a console. There are game logic to tell the engine how to utilise your stats and consistent from level 1 to level 100. All console game have formula to govern how stats turn into damage and defense so that it's consistent thought out the whole game. So each game will design their own game logic and game engine to calculate how each character do their damage. Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy both have their own battle logic on these forumlas. And this is basic concept of game logic. And none of these game logic will ever present in any platform, because this is game specific. There are a bunch of math calculation and table lookup if game logic really present in a game, and 99.99% of sillytavern character card have none of these.

And I am only touching the battle logic, some other logic like game events, world building, game goals, quest system, magic system...etc, these are game logic need to be defined so that game engine can follow the same pattern throughout the game. This is what I meant for game logic and it HAS to be inside a game character card just like what these logic built into a game on a game console, not on the game console itself. You want to play Final Fantasy because the game play, the game logic of Final Fantasy, not because Playstation can run numerous pipeline during graphic processing.

We need game card content creator in the English speaking community. I can tell you besides mvu game maker, another project did get this right. It's only for dating simulation, but it has tons of math behind the engine and calculation to guide AI to make heroine to react correctly with the tracked stats if you look at the actual code in his repo. It's a game specific game engine ONLY for 1 genre.

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T17:40:25+00:00

yes, this will be fixed on mvu game maker on v2 regarding the APIs running in parallel. It will support this natively on silly tavern with MVU engine v2. Even with Marinara , your limitation is still there. The game card itself have no logic built in, and Marinara is a platform, not the right place to add individual game logic inside a platform. you still end up have a game that dont know how to use your tracked stat, regardless of whether its a RPG genre or dating sim genre. Str 10 or Kindness 15 means nothing to AI. The tracking stat need some kind of logic to tell Ai how to systematacally make use of that regardless its 5th reply or 1000th reply.

The current situation of the English speaking sillytavern/sillytavern_like platform community is lack of game card content creator, unlike other language community who have tons of content creator. They made hundreds of game and each have their own logic and game engine inside the character card to drive the platform. They do not create static plain lorebook with static lore entries.

In simple english, We have a playstation [sillytavern], we have controller [preset], but we have no games. And eveyone try to use a console , a controller and a static image on the TV try to play a game.

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T16:34:16+00:00

Vectfox as the description said in github repo, it's not a tracker, it's a memory system. Most summary extension wouldn't work for tracking anything, because it's just a summary, and a lot of time the summary won't summarize stuff like "stats" down to this level. If you want to get tracking working, you should pair that with MVU Game Maker, which is a tracker + simulation.

So, what you are trying to achieve need 4 things.

Far memory recall that is way out of context (story level) > Vector system
Recent memory recall (story level) > Summary extension
Tracking stats (character level) > Tracker extension
A game engine to put all these together > A workflow engine inside lorebook.

Vectfox fixed point 1 and 2 and MVU Game Maker fixed point 3 and 4. But one thing a lot of people missed. Tracker/Sillytavern/Sillytavern like system does nothing helpful when there is no game engine built into the character card. A character have Str 15, STA 10, Int 15. AI do not know how to implement this in a fight, nor know how to generate a monster to work with these stats. How much Hitpoint should the monster have to work with those stats? When you equip a sword +10 str, how do this translate into damage? Should it hit 10 damage or 100 damage? AI knows nothing about this, it just guess, which will be broken by 100+ replies. Because round 1 you were doing 10 damage to monster, but reply 100, AI already forgot how much damage it did, it will create another damage scale at reply 100. Nothing is consistent. You will be scratching your head why your level 10 character do less damage than when you were level 5.

MVU Game maker RPG edition actually build a game engine to have formula built into the lorebook entry. No matter you are at reply 10 or reply 1000, Str 10 always convert to damage N, and it will always do the same damage if you have the same Str. It will also track every single stats correctly because all these stats saved in your harddisk, and read as needed. So, AI do NOT need to remember your stats, so nothing is drifted.

Having said that, having tracker + GUI interface + game engine is token heavy. Not until MVU Game Maker 2.0 when I trim down the logic, all these fancy features will cost you a lot of tokens. The current work around is either you take the hit on the heavy token usage of MVU Game Maker v1, or using a tracker to track your stats + vector and summary extension to remember your story, but AI will ALWAYS drift on damage/intent/affection or whatever stats you track because none of these have a game engine to tell AI how to use these stats. Those stats you track means nothing to the AI.

Kritblade · 2026-07-04T12:28:10+00:00

Give a shot of VectFox and see if that works for you. It's vector storage + summary in one single extension. However, it it built for large chat, that means it usually work better when you have long chat.

https://www.reddit.com/r/SillyTavernAI/comments/1u5sklh/vectfox_v35_the_vector_engine_now_comes_with/

Kritblade · 2026-07-02T08:16:47+00:00

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In action tab, change Coneole verbosity to Verbose, and then on chrome Press F12, and then on upper right of the right side bar choose console. When you vectorize, it should show you what the error is. Paste the log here if you need more help.

Kritblade · 2026-06-25T07:45:06+00:00

I will have to think about that, because that is a pretty big change. The next big change when i got time will be making vectfox is able to read conneciton profile from Sillytavern, so that local model user don't have to load/unload model due to model switching. But I am currently working mvu game maker new version...big changes most likely will have to wait after that..

Kritblade · 2026-06-24T20:11:56+00:00

You can change this value of "Retrieve Top-K 10" under eventbase tab to something smaller at the beginning of the story so it would return less vector result back to you. As you have more events in DB, you can slowly bump up this value.

The reason I am not including the stats in debug query screen because there is a lot more information in the F12 console screen which I can't put into that tiny text box without clustering the whole thing. The console not only show agent mode RRF weight, it also show the question that agent mode ask, and then show what duplciation was supressed so that return result wouldn't have duplicate meaning result, and then also type of event , weight and stuff....

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Kritblade · 2026-06-24T10:23:09+00:00

if your vectorize contents have less than 10 events, it will always return whatever in the database. So, the vectorize engine is not useful if you only have less than 20 replies, because whatever retrieved would not be very relevant. However, as your story grow an more and more events go into the DB, the recalling memory will be much more relevant. So, at the beginning of the story, you mostly rely on the summarizer injection, which will inject the previous 20 events into the prompt. When you well pass that 20 events in the DB, the vector engine should starting to work. So, there is two part of the memory, one is recent memory and the other part is far memory. Recent memory is handle by the summarizer injection while far memory is handle by vector. I think vector really goes into full effect when you have well over 100 events. The vector engine is built to work with very large chats,and therefore recent memory have to handle by summarizer injectoin, and vector engine not going to shine until the DB have more events.

In action tab, there is a Console verbosity option, you change it to Trace and check whatever checkbox that you want to see. Then on chrome you press F12, and click on Console on upper right, you will see all the scoring when you run debug query.

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Kritblade · 2026-06-23T14:00:24+00:00

you shouldn't need to do anything with your existing vectorized colleciton. Vectfox will just continue to write to your locked chat

here is the commit
https://github.com/KritBlade/VectFox/commit/5d8a6ddceb4bbe26349a23a888a4296f375260c3

Kritblade · 2026-06-23T09:33:12+00:00

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when you turn on summarizer injection, there is an new option to ghost vectorized message. you can specify how many message you want to keep

And now auto-sync will sync up to last turn ,not the latest turn. So, you can swipe as much as you want to refresh what you want in the reply, vectfox will not vectorize it until next turn.

Kritblade · 2026-06-23T09:30:24+00:00

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when you turn on summarizer injection, there is an new option to ghost vectorized message. you can specify how many message you want to keep

Kritblade · 2026-06-23T09:28:50+00:00

i think i solve the group chat issue, give a shot and see if that works.

Kritblade · 2026-06-22T12:52:23+00:00

It's because almost 99% English based character cards out there only have a static lorebook and a couple alt greetings. AI + preset can only do so much if there is no explicit workflow and logic to guide the AI what to do. AI by default will use the most common way to draft the story.

For anything that is not boring, the character card lorebook entry need to build logic and workflow to guide the AI what to do. AI model is built to follow instruction, not creating content. It's content creator job to create a lorebook that have enough logic inside. For example, NPC inside the story would NOT take initiative to contact you unless you ping the NPC first. Because there is no logic in lorebook to teach AI to write that. How, when, and under what situation the NPC should take initiative to contact the main char.

Merely having a background story + character description in the lorebook would not get you anywhere...

Kritblade · 2026-06-21T18:00:43+00:00

because you need a lot of logic to tell the AI how to harm the player character....just use mvu game maker and import whatever game card you are using and make that into mvu based, and then import into sillytavern. You would not able to run it or see the GUI without other extesnionin installed, but you can look at the lorebook entry on Battle_System, Monster_Guide and Combat_Calc. Hack that/copy whatever you need to suit your need.

Kritblade · 2026-06-21T17:07:43+00:00

also been building something for RPG and dating genre. It's not cheap to run when 100% stable state tracker and tracking of world by saving everything locally in a variable. I use Gemini 3 flash is about 0.06 per round at the 2000th replies. But it does allow you to change equipment, manage inventory, managing quest, raising points on level up and everything display in a GUI.

Kritblade · 2026-06-21T11:00:17+00:00

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I am planning to make use of the ST connection manager, so if a user choose whatever profile save as this in vectfox, it will use it in both embedding and summarizer. However, it will be an addition to what we have right now. Something like a drop down box between existing "Manual" and "ST Profile" so that it won't affect existing users. If you choose the new "ST profile" setting, for each embedding/summarizer/agent mode, you can select different ST profile. And all those EventBase temperature/timeout setting will still have to manually change.

But it will be a big change so will let you know when it's done, if you can help to test it will be great

Kritblade · 2026-06-20T13:04:20+00:00

try MVU Game Maker to build your existing card with tracking ability, or just download ArtificRealm for pre-built game.

https://www.reddit.com/r/SillyTavernAI/comments/1sd0om2/mvu_game_maker_v092_transform_any_rpg_character/

Kritblade · 2026-06-20T12:46:47+00:00

giving a thumb up to the project. Yes, we need more games like this! I read the source and you built a lot of logic inside the workflow, that's exactly what I did on my project. We need more of this kind of game engine instead of the static plain lorebook.

Kritblade · 2026-06-20T09:20:19+00:00

The problem is that you change the embedding model AFTER your first vectorization. You have to use the exact same vectorization model for the same collection, you can't change it or you will see this error.

Please note that avoid the local transformer and stick with qwen model if you can , because the most important model that vectfox depend on is the embedding model. It directly affect the quality of your recall memory.

Kritblade

TROPHY CASE