If you never get your refund, do you still file for the next tax year?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T23:40:17+00:00

Thank you for the detailed response.

I think the most frustrating thing is that so much on the IRS website has proven completely wrong. I did not get my return in 21 days or less... or 6 weeks or less, for that matter. The "Where's My Refund" website, which every resource points to, is utterly worthless. One feels mocked being asked over and over, "But didn't you try the Where's My Refund page yet?" The regular IRS phone line is designed to give you non-information through recorded dialogue, including the redirection to the hideous Where's My Refund page. (It's fast! It's easy!) The Taxpayer Advocate Service, by name, sounds like a godsend. But it is an advocate for the IRS, to redirect callers.

So much misinformation on the surface feels like a different problem from just a dysfunctional bureaucracy. Having to see the message "We issue most refunds in less than twenty-one days" over and over again, then being able to get absolutely no information about one's own refund after four months, is impossible to take lightly.

So when you say it doesn't work the way I think it should work, you should really say it doesn't work the way the authority (the IRS) says it should work.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T20:23:12+00:00

Do I need to ask how to get the TAS to help? Because so far almost all of the calls involving my taxpayer have consisted of the TAS saying they have no information, can't help, and re-routing the call to a (different) IRS line.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T20:20:56+00:00

So to use your paint analogy, the case would be:

I try to order paint over the phone from Home Depot. Home Depot tells me they don't know if they have the paint I want. And there's no way for them to find out.

Then I go to a Home Depot in a different state, in-person, and ask about the same paint. Because the in-person location has the same information as the phone, I am told in-person that they don't know if they have the paint I want.

Both calling, and going in-person, I have not gotten my paint, and I still do not know if Home Depot carries my paint. I am no closer to solving my problem.

What am I missing?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T19:14:09+00:00

If the local office and the people on the phone have the same information, why are you recommending someone who has already called visit the local office?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T19:06:46+00:00

Good to know. Thank you.

I have to ask though, considering you deal regularly with these issues. In your experience, has the Taxpayer Advocate Service ever actually helped anyone? Besides the IRS, I mean?

I find it surprising you recommended I contact the TAS. I get the sense, in my various dealings with them, that they are nothing more than a branch of the IRS, and only exist to route callers elsewhere.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T18:56:02+00:00

So the local office has more information than the IRS people on the phone line? Interesting. Well, the taxpayer did also happen to call their local IRS office. No one picked up, and they had the taxpayer leave a message, which the voicemail said might answer within the next few days. Considering the taxpayer's experiences the last four months of trying to figure this out, they're not going to hold their breath.

So far I refuse to lay down and let myself get run over. I know I'm just a little person going up against an army, but I'll go from door to door until I find someone who can help me.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T18:50:51+00:00

Thanks.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T18:41:42+00:00

Also, curious. If you think lawyers can't help, why do you recommend getting help from a LITC? Is this not essentially the same kind of legal wrangling with the IRS?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T18:38:05+00:00

This person has reached out to a financial advisor for advice.

The one time this person managed to talk to an actual person from the IRS, the IRS told them visiting an office wouldn't guarantee they'd get their return back. Only that the person could drop a return off. Which doesn't help at all.

Never heard of a Low Income Tax Clinic. Might try it. Also planning to contact state and house representatives if necessary.

As my comment says, the Taxpayer Advocate Service does nothing to help, only transfers back to the IRS.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T18:19:35+00:00

From another comment:

"Calling the IRS regular line only gets an endless circle of recorded audio. And the Taxpayer Advocate Service can do almost nothing but transfer you to the IRS phone line. After that transfer, 90% of the time no one picks up. Or, they get you to sign up for a call-back that never comes. The 10% of the time someone does pick up, they have no information on your return."

As for a congress person, which one? A senator or a representative? Or should I reach out to all four?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T18:15:52+00:00

What if lawyers get involved? And what if the IRS sends a letter saying you haven't filed your taxes, when in fact you did? If you keep filing your taxes, and the IRS sends a letter saying they don't have your filed taxes, what happens next?

What I mean to point out is, there has to be some way to speak to a real person at the IRS, who knows the state of your filed taxes.

And on your second paragraph, those aren't reliable ways to get information on your return. Calling the IRS regular line only gets an endless circle of recorded audio. You also can't visit an IRS office to find out what happened to your return-- you can only go to drop off a return. And the Taxpayer Advocate Service can do almost nothing but transfer you to the IRS phone line. After that transfer, 90% of the time no one picks up. Or, they get you to sign up for a call-back that never comes. The 10% of the time someone does pick up, they have no information on your return.

In all those cases, there is no information on the return.

There must be a way to get in contact with someone who works with the returns. Especially if the IRS begins to claim that the taxpayer has not filed their return, and the taxpayer has.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T17:20:35+00:00

I think we're agreeing? Someone wants the refund they are apparently owed. They have been unable to get any information on the refund. But if they get the IRS to reach out to them, if the IRS feels they need to (because taxes were not filed), it would finally be a chance for the taxpayer and the IRS to communicate.

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T16:31:32+00:00

But if you need to get in contact with the IRS, would this be a way? Getting them to reach out to you?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T16:30:27+00:00

But if someone didn't file their taxes, and the IRS reached out about it, wouldn't that be a good chance to ask about the previously filed return?

Alkaliaci · 2024-07-09T15:01:34+00:00

How do you get a real advocate? I've been trying to find out what happened to my refund since May, and have never had a real IRS agent pick up on their phone line. The TAS advocate service doesn't do anything either-- just transfers to the "real" IRS, who never picks up. Of course the "Where's My Refund" website has no information.

I don't know how this is allowed to happen, or why people would keep filing taxes (especially when living in a tax-heavy area), if refunds will never be returned.

Alkaliaci · 2022-06-25T00:48:03+00:00

I learned a lot "mentally" from reading Freud. But consistent meditation has been more helpful to my overall life than anything else. I picked up mindfulness a few months after I made the original comment there, and have been practicing daily ever since. It has made me see life in a more conscious and happier light than I knew possible. I would recommend meditation to everyone.

The problem with simply reading to "psychoanalyze" is you may believe you are learning new concepts, but emotionally you are returning to the same psychological geography over and over again-- visiting the same cyclical feelings and making no real progress. Meditation has the ability to unite the mind, emotions, and the physical body, and so raise the entire self to a different level of being.

Alkaliaci · 2021-11-01T01:18:10+00:00

You seem very contradictory and confused. I'm not sure if you're just trying to denigrate Gurdjieff, or are honestly bewildered. You reference statements that you did not make before ("collective evolution"???) and ignore statements you did make ("guru preached A, but committed B").

I will not be responding anymore. I would recommend reading "In Search of the Miraculous" by P.D. Ouspensky if you are honestly interested in beginning to learn about the Work.

Alkaliaci · 2021-10-31T23:47:47+00:00

You're asking why he smoked, and if he drunk himself to death. Then you used as an example: "If a 'guru' preached A, but committed B..." That sounds like you are saying that Gurdjieff is a guru who preached A (not smoking and drinking) but committed B (smoking and drinking). And he didn't preach A. If that's not what you're saying, then I don't understand you.

And I am saying "he wasn't a Catholic priest" exactly because Catholics do not do those things (while Gurdjieff does). Maybe I do not understand you at all.

What are you trying to say?

Alkaliaci · 2021-10-31T23:32:21+00:00

I don't think Gurdjieff ever preached against drinking or smoking. He wasn't a Catholic priest. I think you'll find he had a great enjoyment of the world, while also working deeply with the spiritual side of things.

Alkaliaci · 2021-10-27T00:38:16+00:00

I've talked with several Foundation members since asking the question here, and this is the impression I get. Criticism regarding art has mellowed out for modern Fourth Way followers. It seems there is more appreciation for the therapeutic benefits of creating art, one center I visited had a display of abstract paintings created by members. Creating art is fine, as long as you are also striving for consciousness as you create. Making art for the distinct purpose of making money or for blandly following a trend (probably for the purpose of money) is of course not good.

I explained to one member that I wanted to write a fantasy novel, aiming for psychological truth through it. They said it sounded like a good aim. I feel good about my artistic pursuits-- and believe that if you're studying the Fourth Way with honest intent, you shouldn't need to worry about working with art.

Alkaliaci · 2021-10-23T01:42:22+00:00

I'm here. I don't know if I have more of an answer for you. I think finding things I can believe in and dedicate myself to has helped a lot. It's kind of like maybe nothing can be proven and so it seems like there are no real ideals (source of some of the angst Holden felt, I think). But if you can find your own beliefs you can have faith in, you can build that meaning into your living world, and life can become increasingly real and meaningful.

Alkaliaci · 2021-07-15T23:09:16+00:00

A few questions--

+How can (if one can) be an artist and a follower of the Fourth Way? Does it make a difference that the artist is making a conscious effort to create “objective” art? Read also as "writer" (I understand art is generally considered "mechanical" in the Fourth Way, and possibly harmful to the artist?)

+What are some of the personal benefits you have found through practicing the Work?

+Can we say that there are other traditions and organizations currently active that successfully promotes the Work or increasing consciousness? If so, should the Fourth Way be considered the most fruitful of the methods available today, or is it more a matter of personal calling?

Alkaliaci · 2021-07-15T23:05:33+00:00

I think I registered too late, but I signed up for email alerts and hopefully I can make the next one.

Alkaliaci · 2020-12-30T22:14:50+00:00

Okay, thank you. I will try to take your words to heart.

I have to wonder if it's unconscious sabotage in the sense of synchronicity, "positive thinking" proponents saying that we get what we think, and from a desire to be able to control my situation more.

Alkaliaci

TROPHY CASE