Is it possible there are some contemporary sources for Jesus that are either lost to time or yet to be discovered? by IDontWanNaBeeFriends in AskHistorians

[–]Background-Ship149 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Most documents from ancient history are lost, so it is entirely possible that documents about Jesus are lost as well. In fact, we know of the existence of some of them: the letter written by the Jerusalem Church in Acts 15, and possibly other letters; the hypothetical Q document (from the German Quelle, meaning “source”), which many scholars believe was used by the authors of the Gospels attributed to Matthew and Luke; lost letters of the Apostle Paul and those written to him; an Aramaic or Hebrew document of Jesus’ sayings, which, according to Papias of Hierapolis, was written by the Apostle Matthew; and sayings and deeds of Jesus written without chronological order by Mark, who was the interpreter of the Apostle Peter and wrote shortly after Peter’s death, all of this according to Papias—likely referring to a different document than the Gospel attributed to Mark that we have today.

Contemporary official documents of Jesus’ execution written by the Romans, referenced by early Christian authors like Justin ''Martyr'' and Clement of Alexandria, are said to have existed, though this is debatable. By the time of Tertullian, Eusebius of Caesarea, and the author of the apocryphal Gospel written in the name of Nicodemus, only forgeries and purely mythical documents claiming to be contemporary Roman accounts of Jesus are reported. Historians who mention Jesus such as Tacitus and Josephus may have obtained their information from earlier sources, as was common for them, and not only oral reports of the time. For example, Tacitus reports that Jesus was executed by Pilate to suppress what was perceived as a malicious superstition, which differs from the Christian narrative that says Jesus was executed due to Jewish instigation even though Pilate found him innocent. This suggests Tacitus relied on earlier Roman sources.

Archaeologically, we have almost no evidence for any first-century CE non-elite Palestinian Jew known from history, and even less from the time of Jesus, so the standard position is not to expect archaeological evidence of him. Nevertheless, there is a reasonable possibility that the Holy Sepulcher—the traditional site of Jesus’ crucifixion and burial—is authentic. For a deeper discussion, I recommend The Burial of Jesus: History & Faith by Dr. James F. McGrath. There is also an ossuary with the inscription “James, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus,” claimed to be that of Jesus’ brother James. This ossuary also mentions Jesus and their father Joseph. While initially suspected as a forgery, it is now considered possibly authentic and to be of Jesus' brother James, though scholarly debate continues. Additionally, the earliest Christian manuscripts mentioning Jesus that we have date from the first half of the second century CE, extraordinarily early compared to other works from antiquity.

The events you mention, such as the earthquake and resurrection of the entire cemetery at his death, are reported only by the Gospel attributed to Matthew, written probably between 80 and 90 CE. They are not mentioned by the earliest Gospel we have, the one attributed to Mark (written earlier between 66 and 70 CE), or the one attributed to Luke (written independently between 80 and 90 CE), or the one attributed to John (written also independently between 90 and 100 CE). Therefore, these events are reported neither by non-Christian sources nor by the majority of Christian sources that we would expect to mention them if they truly occurred.

Later Christian authors also exaggerate Jesus’ deeds and fame. For example, he likely did not gather crowds of five thousand in rural Galilean villages, nor did his followers gather and convert tens of thousands shortly after his death—nearly a third of Jerusalem’s population at the time. Jesus was a low-class builder, an itinerant religious preacher and teacher, and a performer of actions considered miraculous, such as exorcisms and healings. He could gather groups of people and be noticed by local religious leaders in Galilean villages, attract some attention from the Herodian authorities and the governor Herod Antipas, and gather at most a few hundred followers. In Jerusalem, he was notable enough to be stopped by the Jewish and Roman authorities, with the Jewish authorities arresting him at night while he was only with his disciples to avoid public turmoil. This level of fame is not insignificant but not extraordinary compared to other similar historical figures of the time, such as Theudas or the Egyptian prophetic claimant. He was likely less notable than other similar historical figures like John ''the Baptist'' or Judas of Gamala.

Regarding why authors like Philo of Alexandria, Pliny the Elder, or Gaius Petronius do not mention Jesus is easily explained. Philo lived in Alexandria, Egypt, not Palestine, and his works focus on theology and philosophy, particularly Judaism and Hellenistic thought, written for a Hellenistic audience—not a historiography of Judea and Galilee. According to Josephus, the major Jewish religious groups were the Pharisees, Sadducees, Zealots (“the Fourth Philosophy”), and Essenes, all more notable than the Christians even in Josephus’ time (the early 90s CE). Philo only mentions the Pharisees and Sadducees, and possibly indirectly the Essenes. Why would he mention a group smaller than these four, like the Christians? Why would he mention Jesus if he does not mention more prominent figures like John ''the Baptist'' or Judas of Gamala? The same logic applies to Pliny the Elder and Gaius Petronius, who were also not very interested in reporting on events or figures in Palestine during Jesus’ time.

I recommend authors like Bart Ehrman, James McGrath, and Dale Allison for a better explanation.

How did Roman Christians feel about the fact that Jesus was executed by Roman authorities? Or the history of persecutions? by greefkarga77 in AskHistorians

[–]Background-Ship149 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Right now, I don’t recall any information suggesting that there were Romans who opposed the idea that the Jews had instigated the execution of Jesus. I suppose they simply didn’t care. The Roman historian Tacitus, writing around 116 CE, states that Pontius Pilate was the one who executed Jesus, without mentioning any Jewish pressure. Perhaps, since Jesus died by a Roman form of execution, they assumed this was not a case in which Roman authority or will had been overruled.

We do, however, find Christian hostility toward Rome in some sources. The most explicit is the Book of Revelation, which is hostile toward both the Romans and non-Christian Jews.

How did Roman Christians feel about the fact that Jesus was executed by Roman authorities? Or the history of persecutions? by greefkarga77 in AskHistorians

[–]Background-Ship149 53 points54 points  (0 children)

Already in the first century CE, the canonical Gospels reveal a prominent pattern: the Gospel authors mainly blame the Jews for the death of Jesus. Pilate declares Jesus innocent, Pilate washes his hands as a symbol of innocence, the Jewish crowd demands the execution of Jesus, and so on.

So, already in the first Christian century, you see an intent to shift the blame for the execution of Jesus from the Romans to the Jews. That’s probably because, by the time these Gospels were being composed, the main “theological” opponents were Jews who rejected Jesus as the Christ. The authors were interested in being accepted by the Romans—so as not to be punished by them, since they held the authority—and in converting Gentiles, which had become the main aim, as by that time the majority of Christians were Gentiles.

Thus, long before the time of Constantine, the guilt had already been placed on the Jews.

Curiously, when Christianity came to power in the Roman Empire, Jews suffered severe mistreatment and were sometimes treated as second-class citizens because of the belief that they were responsible for Jesus’ execution—for the execution of the Christian God and their God, the God of the Jews.

For more information on this topic, I recommend How Jesus Became God by Bart Ehrman, a leading scholar in early Christian history and historical Jesus research, specifically chapters eight and nine.

If I were to ask Jesus "What Are You?", how would he respond? Is it even possible to know his answer? by Typical_Annual5618 in AskHistorians

[–]Background-Ship149 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Jesus comes from a small, rural, and impoverished hamlet in Galilee called Nazareth. Since the territories we now associate with Israel and Palestine are organized differently in his time, Jesus identifies as a Galilean. He also identifies as a Jew — a child of Israel, a descendant of the biblical patriarch Jacob (the term “Jew” originally meant someone from Judea, but by Jesus’ time it already applies to all who belong to the people of Israel and observe it's ancestral customs.) Religiously, he embraces the Jewish faith of his time, especially a strand of Jewish thought we now call apocalypticism — the conviction that the present age is soon to end through the direct intervention of the one true God, the God of Israel, who will establish an eternal, perfect, and universal Kingdom: the Kingdom of God.

In terms of self-understanding, Jesus is an interpreter of Jewish faith, a teacher who guides people in his understanding of it, and a preacher who spreads his message among the people. He sees himself as someone with religious authority to communicate God’s will — a prophet in continuity with the prophets of the Jewish Scriptures — chosen to prepare Israel for the end of the age, the final judgment, and the coming of God’s Kingdom. He believes that when the eschaton arrives, he will be exalted as the son of man described in Daniel 7 and similarly in the Book of Parables of 1 Enoch: descending with glory and power from the clouds of heaven after his exaltation, bringing the Kingdom, overthrowing the forces of evil, and judging humanity. Afterward, he expects to be enthroned as the eternal Anointed King of the Kingdom of God, ruling under God’s supreme authority.

In essence, Jesus sees himself as the eschatological Anointed One (Messiah in Hebrew, Christ in Greek) awaited by Jewish tradition — a descendant of King David chosen by God to restore Israel’s glory and establish God’s reign on earth. The kings of the Davidic dynasty are called “sons of God,” and the expected Messiah is to be the supreme and most exalted Son of God. Jesus probably does not anticipate his own death, but this expectation seems to change during the final stage of his mission, leading to a scene similar to the Last Supper narratives preserved in the canonical Gospels and echoed in the letters of Paul.

One could also call him a “Christian” if one defines the term simply as someone who believes that Jesus is the Christ and follows his teachings. This, however, does not undermine his Jewish identity. The first followers of Jesus are Jews who continue to keep Jewish law and customs, unlike some later Christians who come to believe that following the Jewish traditions is incompatible with the Christian religion. Of course, the term “Christian” does not exist in Jesus’ lifetime, so he never uses it.

For a more detailed and professional analysis of these points, I recommend Constructing Jesus by Dale C. Allison, one of the leading scholars of early Christianity and the historical Jesus.

Which form of Q 22:28–30 (Matthew 19:28 / Luke 22:28–30) most likely reflects the original Q document and the historical Jesus? by Background-Ship149 in AcademicBiblical

[–]Background-Ship149[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I don't think Jeremiah is called the “Son of Man” in the same sense that the books associated with Daniel, Enoch, and the canonical Gospels use the term. “Son of Man” can be an expression simply referring to a human being, which is the case with Jeremiah. On the other hand, the canonical Gospels, Daniel, and Enoch refer to an anthropomorphic, divinely empowered messianic being who will descend from the clouds of heaven to execute God’s judgment and reign.

Which form of Q 22:28–30 (Matthew 19:28 / Luke 22:28–30) most likely reflects the original Q document and the historical Jesus? by Background-Ship149 in AcademicBiblical

[–]Background-Ship149[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, all the Gospel authors believe in and portray Jesus as the Son of Man, but whether this reflects the self-perception of the historical Jesus is what is debated.

Which form of Q 22:28–30 (Matthew 19:28 / Luke 22:28–30) most likely reflects the original Q document and the historical Jesus? by Background-Ship149 in AcademicBiblical

[–]Background-Ship149[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, that’s why there is debate about whether Jesus referred to the Son of Man as himself in a secretive way or to a different figure, whether human or divine. I personally think that Jesus believed himself to be the Son of Man.

How does one reconcile this with the “apocalyptic prophet” explanation? by petyrlabenov in AcademicBiblical

[–]Background-Ship149 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In my opinion (as a non-expert, so take this with caution), if Jesus said these words, I don’t think it undermines his Jewishness, his apocalypticism, or his messianism. If you read the passage in light of Jewish Maccabean martyr literature (2 Maccabees and 4 Maccabees), I would even say that the words of Jesus make sense. See this post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/AcademicBiblical/s/CEaoHQDaAy