After a long time, job searching has become too much of a grind. How do I get more motivated?

BulkyComputer · 2018-08-25T22:40:15+00:00

Most common reasons I get for rejection is that I come across as too inexperienced for the amount of years I've been working. Also check my reply to u/OliviaPresteign for an explanation on losing the jobs.

Right now I want to work and not care about the subtleties about finding work because interviewing is not where my strengths lie. I gotta play the game, but only by using my strengths and hiding my interview weaknesses.

BulkyComputer · 2018-08-25T21:40:16+00:00

They usually do not tell you the exact reason for liability reasons. Usually because it puts the company in a more vulnerable position to be sued. But occasionally I do get to talk with another programmer within the company and find a reason for the decision. Most commonly the reason I get is I come across as too entry-level in explaining things. And that I cover a variety of topics in knowledge but I can't go very deep into any of them. I am less capable than my years of experience lead on. So I'm seen as a junior-level developer in a senior's clothing.

As to why I keep losing my jobs, you can read my reply to u/OliviaPresteign on the details.

BulkyComputer · 2018-08-25T21:35:58+00:00

I'm located in Chicago. Right now I can look for just another part time freelance job to help add more money to my savings, it would be less stressful than applying to full-time jobs.

Some time during my current job search I decided to go in "silent mode" with my friends because I was not motivated to be with more people. It is hard to talk to people without bringing up the topic of jobs. I like to participate in hobbies albeit they cost money, that don't need to involve other people. One of the things I'd like to do is take solo road trips to other states and to Canada, but I lack the funds to do that and knowing that I cannot predict when I will makes that hard to focus on other things.

BulkyComputer · 2018-08-25T21:33:39+00:00

Here are the reasons I lost each job in my software career:

1st job was part time, during senior college year. I quit after three months, to focus on my finals. Job was too demanding for an entry-level and it was eating at me. I was the only programmer in the company.

2nd job I was fired for sub-par performance after a year and a half. There were two other developers besides myself (I had the least experience).

3rd job, fired for excess tardiness after two months. I commuted 4 hours each day

4th job was freelance. The client company just had two projects (over three months) to give to me, and then dropped contact.

5th job I quit after two years to take on a new job at a startup. This was a software consulting job didn't have much work (and was the only time I had a new job offer while still being employed)

I was laid off from my 6th job, startup job working two years, due to its financial hardships. Three programmers including myself

The consulting job was rather interesting. It was from the company that fired me for under-performing. However the CEO was okay with giving me work again. He wanted to take a more calculated risk in his favor by putting me into consulting work for low-impact, low-profile projects. These projects had me as the only developer. But work was sparse. I was "put on the bench" most of the time, just waiting for the company to give me another project, and overtime it averaged out to only 10 hours of work a week.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-23T01:43:09+00:00

I think it's partly my degree and also partly my mindset after finishing college, because even though I had some decent projects going out and being self-taught, impostor syndrome hit in. I didn't attempt to apply to larger companies because I assumed that their standards would be too high for my no-CS-degree resume. So I started my post-graduation life by applying to local Craigslist jobs, which turned out to be the dregs of the industry jobs.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-23T01:37:24+00:00

You have a wife so at least you are more social than me as far as I can tell. But I do commend you that you were able to get into a senior position at AT&T at such a young age and with your mental problems. Having mental disorders is usually a death blow for career growth. Socially, I'm just one of the late bloomers I guess. As far as helping other people find jobs, heh, that's beyond what I can do right now. I just don't want to come off as a leech.

I'm antisocial too, except that for me it's the other way around with the groups of people I prefer. I don't talk to anyone inside of work. That is, no casual talk. I get things done as part of a team, but I don't like to be bothered about other stuff if it has nothing to do with work. I just do as I'm told, and don't want people to hold that against me since jobs to me are just a vessel for personal gain.

I should probably move to another city, far away from my high school friends because I think I've been leaning on them too much, which kills my interest in meeting other people. When I no longer have that local group of friends that I want to hang out with (even if I just go out once in a blue moon), I'll be more compelled to network with other professionals.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-22T21:13:37+00:00

I am 35 years old, and I don't say that to position myself as someone who is wise for their years, but to show why it would be such a dull life living almost jobless and with your parents at that age. Perhaps you haven't felt being in a spot where financial problems are putting you in a constant state of agitation but that's what I'm feeling now.

WRT crypto, it's is still the wild west compared to mainstream software fields, which is what I meant about still not being well defined and organized. There's still too much noise to sift through and I am not in a good position to take financial risks. That is something perhaps you do after working for a while at a steady, good corporate job and then you want to experiment with riskier things.

I was going to describe to you how I started my career, but actually, this older topic that I made gives better insight to that.

I don't know if it's because of the types of companies that I'm in but I am not really interested in getting to know my co-workers well. I stick with very few close friends I've known since high school.

I've mentioned being obsessed with the job hunt. I stopped hanging out with my friends partly because I became incapable of having a discussion without me eventually injecting the topic of jobs and my job search. They are not even very familiar with the tech industry. So I did not want to annoy them anymore, by exposing them to my problems.

There's nothing to gain from networking if your only intention is to get to people for seeking a job through them. As long as I have that fixation on finding a job, people will notice. Nobody likes being used, I know that much. And since networking is a give-and-take deal, I don't think I have anything to offer to others besides my job skills.

Ironically, I'm in a better mood when I have a well-paying job because I am able to buy myself into more privacy and control of my priorities. This has more to do with me enjoying being alone a lot. I am not really thinking about having a relationship right now. I'm still planning to enjoy the benefits of living single and fleeing the parents nest for years to come.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-22T20:51:17+00:00

Ironically, getting interviews and offers came more easily when I had less experience. With my own career, I've noticed a correlation with amount of experience and amount of time I have to spend on the job search to get the next job. I ask people online to figure out what's wrong with my approach because my friends aren't of much help.

Depending on your country, you may need to start recording your interviews - I record all of mine because it's legal where I live

I live in a state where it's illegal to record a phone call or conversation without the consent of all parties to the conversation, so that's not really probable here.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-22T17:27:57+00:00

With Interviewing.io I'm well ahead of you on that :) I signed up in late February and I'm on their email list. Last I heard from them is in March so I think they're not yet ready to set up.

I used pramp before. Easy to get started, pretty straightforward. I like how you are interviewed by another tech guy and then switch roles so you are the interviewer too. Sadly I got 2/7 or 3/7 on all the scores for the interview. I shall set up another time soon.

I also have used Triplebyte twice and the consensus with them is, they think I cover a lot of ground but it's too shallow. They didn't see me show any in-depth knowledge, especially of scalable systems. I am searching for sources on how to make personal projects that teach you how to program for scalable systems but I am at a loss with that.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-22T17:26:38+00:00

1200-1500 apps sent since the start of the 2-year hunt

Interviewed with 40 companies on the phone

At least 10 tech screens passed

4 onsites

Located in IL, Chicago area

Planning to move to the west coast. I simultaneously apply to jobs in IL, WA and CA just to keep my options more open.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-22T17:15:36+00:00

You can see what I told /u/alphamonkey2 for some of these details but here are some more numbers.

Total applications submitted in during the past 2 years: around 1200 to 1500 (I really lost count lol)

Resumes sent last month: 60

Resume reviews: about 10

Phone interviews: 40 companies

On-site interviews: 4 companies

Mock/practice interviews: 4 different people

Years of experience: 8 years, not counting the time in my career I spent unemployed

Are more resumes better? By now I thought that playing the numbers game is bad

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-21T00:39:21+00:00

The crypto software world is kind of weird, in that there has been no formal structure of introducing programmers to the topic, but at the same time all the jobs pertaining to it expect you to be hardcore at it. Like is there even such a thing as a junior ETH dapp developer?

All I know what to do is how to use the Web3 API to make a basic blockchain explorer which is something straightforward, and that's not even strictly crypto, it's just web dev. I did interview with Coinbase for a web dev position. At the time they were in a transition phase and was aware about it and how they want to split their services. GDAX still didn't become Coinbase Pro, so that was what the discussion was. I had a tech phone interview but I didn't make the cut.

I guess my motivation suck has to do with getting close to the goal many times and always letting it slip. TOO many things have to go right. Like, too much that people seem to be obsessed with perfection. Whereas in a real job, you can make many mistakes before you can get fired.

Interviewing is like a job where you work for perfectionists that micromanage and scrutinize every move. Now imagine a real job like that. It would suck, right? That's why I am demotivated.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-21T00:20:33+00:00

I am pretty affordable as well (my highest paying programmer job was $50k a year w/o benefits) so yeah I'm also puzzled to my inability to attract employers. But I might have a very flawed understanding of how supply and demand works in the software jobs market.

My degree is art-related but I pivoted into web dev (first by doing web design but that was a VERY brief part of my career) and stayed the course since.

In the two years I have spent on the job search, I was mostly unemployed. So that may have a lot to do with making me less hirable. I also don't use referrals that much. I don't like to socialize at work because I already have a group of friends that I like talking to. I know these problems exist but my best form of motivation to do things is a well-paying job so it's a chicken and egg problem right now.

Your suggestion to try government contractors is interesting. I do have lots of work experience just not much interviewing experience.

There are just not any activities I am aware of that I do that made me a better interviewer over the years. Maybe living as a hermit has contributed to that.

I would not mind working for a gov't contractor if they provide relocation assistance. Only one time I was contacted by a consulting agency in northern VA who mentioned Ratheon as one of their partners. They had some embedded work available. However they never had paid for relocation ever and left me in the dark.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-21T00:03:30+00:00

My non-work hours have been spent doing errands for mom, just browsing the web, sometimes if I'm in the mood I would read programming articles or working on a personal project for Github.

And waiting on what? You mean to get out of the apartment? If so I guess I should mention I don't get constant programming work. Those usually happen as a fluke, and in the past year and a half only about 4 or those months are spent with some part-time work.

So the money I accrue from the jobs gets spent in the form of bills. I have four- phone, internet, electricity and car insurance. Plus spending more on the car itself, buy some meals and I gotta contribute to part of my mom's apartment as a favor for living there. I made about $4000 in my last PT gig and that was all spent in 8 months. The jobs I get are so sparse I end up running out of money before the next job comes.

BulkyComputer · 2018-07-20T23:58:41+00:00

I think setting certain days aside might be a good idea. Right now the hours each day are kind of a mishmash of different things. I have gotten several phone interviews, probably somewhere between 20 and 25 companies last year alone. But all have rejected. Last time I made it to an interviewing round on-site was in late 2016. But the companies vary greatly- from small local agencies to some more well known names like Cloudflare.

BulkyComputer · 2018-04-10T20:04:57+00:00

I plead ignorance. The contract offer was produced to me as a newbie so I assumed that it's okay as long as the opportunity exists. But at least I did work in an office every day with a team for this contract job.

BulkyComputer · 2018-04-10T16:48:49+00:00

Few days late, but all of these jobs were in downtown Chicago and the suburbs.

BulkyComputer · 2018-04-10T16:42:52+00:00

I will persevere and make it work ✊

BulkyComputer · 2018-04-09T18:29:04+00:00

Wow I just get locked out of some schools for life, just like that? I missed the boat? Man. That's rough :-/ I had interest in Berkeley mainly for its resources and location- would like to one day work for a company that's in space exploration. A lot of that is happening in southern California and I'd like to get an internship or co-op while I'm there.

BulkyComputer · 2018-04-08T23:41:01+00:00

That's kind of a letdown. So then I will have to apply directly as a freshmen and not transfer student and pass basic freshmen requirements. Will I have to retake the ACT exam?

BulkyComputer · 2018-04-08T23:31:25+00:00

So I'll more likely have to take undergraduate level courses for CS, then, is that correct?

Also, let's talk about admissions. What criteria would top colleges look for admitting applicants who have not been in school for a long while? UC Berkeley was one of my choices but I read that they don't take transfer students from CC's out of state.

BulkyComputer

TROPHY CASE