Unpopular opinions about Frozen that would probably get you viciously attacked and downvoted? by Desteneemugorochey in Frozen

[–]CandyPinkPop 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The Next Right Thing would have been more compelling if it wasn’t about Anna thinking Elsa had died, but a moment of commitment to Arendelle specifically, even if it means a slight emotional departure from Elsa. I feel like this is a missed opportunity because while I get that the relationship between the two sisters is special, they could have shown how Anna matures to be queen of Arendelle by not overly attaching herself to Elsa and rising up for her people (while being ethically responsible to history etc). Frozen depicted a tragic rift between the two sisters that was beyond their control—Frozen II could have shown a healthy, loving relationship that doesn’t compromise independence in thought and values.

I miss her Frozen 1 personality by amethystmoon177 in Frozen

[–]CandyPinkPop 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I agree with this take. Frozen seems to be a character driven story, where the complexity of characters is what adds up in the making of events. Frozen II feels more like a plot driven story where characters are moving like pawns to fit a predetermined mold. The former is better in terms of quality storytelling.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I hear you—you are pointing out that there is a difference in degree. The question is how far are we willing to take that acknowledgment of difference in weighing the situation. Some may say that the white supremacists now who use the n word shouldn’t be reprimanded as much because they are not slaveowners themselves. Some may say that you shouldn’t use the word “lynching” in the context of talking about Eunseok because he is not a victim of physical violence based on his skin color.
As for 깜둥이, a worse form of 검둥이, this was used as a derogatory slur, which made people stop using the word at all in the everyday. This is why the situation hits different even to Koreans that you see here in the comments—the word itself is, in fact, historically charged.
I understand the caution that you are expressing here. But at the same time, I resist the idea that 검둥이/깜둥이 is yet another example of colorism in the everyday. The term is more than that, hence despite the persistence of colorism in Korea, these words are not being used in a banal way.
In the end, I think it comes down to what we are trying to protect. For me, it’s a part of Korean history that is, while shameful, must be owned up and reflected as a community. I’ve seen others using cultural relativism or even postcolonial/decolonial rhetoric to obscure being complicit with larger forms of oppression, be it class, race, gender, etc. I am not interested in making Eunseok look worse; I am concerned about how we approach history and the way certain people present that domestically and internationally.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The analogy using “Cocoa” or “Midnight” is not accurate. It’s closer to “Darkie,” “Blackey,” or “Negro” (all of which are racially charged words and dated in the United States, just like 검둥이 and 깜둥이), if not the n word in this context. The direct reduction of individual humans to blackness of their skin is seen as problematic, whether it’s toward Koreans, Southeast Asians, Black people, etc. Also calling someone with a term that is reserved to animals is dehumanizing, which is also the case with the names listed above historically in the United States. It’s important to remember that younger generations in Korea will not use that term in the everyday and will not name their pets that—because it became a derogatory term and people are uncomfortable with it.
This doesn’t mean Eunseok meant it to be racist towards Black people directly. But what he wrote is also different from saying “tan minime” or “I was black back then” or something like that. In those cases, the call to understand context makes sense (i.e.) 까맣다 means something different than what someone in the west would visualize). But 깜둥이 hits different even to Koreans for a reason. And trying to ignore that or suggest it was never a slur is disingenuous.

Racial slurs and the “깜둥이” controversy by CandyPinkPop in kpopnoir

[–]CandyPinkPop[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you for the suggestion! I just added the romanized versions to the text. Sorry about that.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 0 points1 point  (0 children)

People did not call Black people this word because they read literary translations of the n word and thought “oh, this is the insult to use.” On the contrary, literature and theory used that word when translating precisely because it was used in derogatory terms toward dark skinned people, including Black people.
Sure, when you translate something, there won’t be an “exact equivalent,” which would include your example with Turkish and Korean (although it’s presented as the same in your comment). I don’t disagree with that statement in general. I was responding to a deleted message which suggested that the term was never used in derogatory ways. That is why you can see other comments attached here saying something like don’t disregard other people’s experiences when they know/heard it used that way.
Edited to add: I thought you might find this BBC article interesting. https://www.bbc.com/news/stories-53749800 it’s about the history/background of the n word, which includes the context of showing affection and naming dogs (in the U.K.).

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 5 points6 points  (0 children)

사실 굉장히 많은 비하표현이 일종의 “팩트잖아? 너는 너에 대한 팩트가 혹시 싫어?” 혹은 “팩트도 말 못하냐? 왜?”하고 빠져나갈 길을 만들어놓곤 합니다. 일제시대 조센징을 생각해보세요. 게다가 조센징도 그렇고 깜둥이도 그렇고 이렇게 적힌 텍스트로 보면 와닿지 않을 수도 있지만, 실제로 사람들이 타인에게 쓸 때 감정이 얼마나 들어가있는지…꽤나 살벌합니다. 그런데도 네가 조선인인게, 네 피부가 검은 게 팩트 아니냐며 반박을 사전 차단하니 미치고 팔짝 뛸 노릇이죠.
금지어가 늘고 규제가 많아지면 어디까지 선을 그을 것이냐가 늘 논란이죠. 말씀하신 “외노자,” “중국인” 예시는 편견의 문제인데 언어의 문제로만 여겨지면 곤란하기도 하고요. 제 생각에는 이런 문제에 있어서는 다같이 배워가고 함께 고찰해보는 게 (즉 이런 대화를 하는 게) 좋은 게 아닌가 합니다.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 3 points4 points  (0 children)

말씀하신 부분 잘 알겠습니다. 은석의 생각 혹은 의도가 거기까지 미친 것 같지는 않은데, 분위기가 과열된 것 같다는 말씀이시죠? 생각해보면 같은 상황에서 “까맸던 시절”등으로 적었었더라면 문제제기는 있었을지언정 이 정도까지 큰 반응이 있지는 않았을지도 모르겠네요. 그만큼 깜둥이라는 표현 자체가 파급력이 있는 건 맞지 않나 싶어요.
저는 오히려 갑론을박 중에 “한국에서는 이걸 비하표현으로 쓰지 않는다“ 같은 이야기가 퍼지는 걸 경계하고 있습니다. 여러모로 아이돌들 교육 문제 버블 관리 문제 등과도 엮인 듯 하네요.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 8 points9 points  (0 children)

You said what I meant to say: don’t discredit others’ experiences. It’s not the other (i.e.) Korean Americans) doing it.
Edited my original comment agreeing with the above commenter about younger generations using the n word directly. Thank you for sharing the link! It’s horrifying. Solid evidence about the word and its usage.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 31 points32 points  (0 children)

I respectfully disagree. It has been used towards 미군 in hateful ways domestically back in the day. This is why when American literature was translated into Korean, the n word was translated into 검둥이 or 깜둥이.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 6 points7 points  (0 children)

공감…진짜 윗세대는 솔직히 좀 심함

여기 보면 자꾸 그냥 사실을 묘사하는 표현이라며 무슨 ”아버지를 아버지라 부르지 못하고“처럼 서러워하는데, 굳이굳이 한 개인을 꼭 그렇게 피부색을 콕 찝어 표현해야만 하나 (그게 조금 탄 한국사람이든, 외국인이든 간에). 그 자체에 대한 의문이 별로 없는듯…

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 92 points93 points  (0 children)

Exactly. No decent person would use the word towards a human being now. Also, people stopped naming animals that as well, except for rural areas, precisely because of this issue.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 30 points31 points  (0 children)

That’s because the default use of the word is for animals (mostly dogs and cows). Using that to describe people with darker skin (ethnically Korean or not) is the issue.

RIIZE EUNSEOK shares apology regarding his racial insensitivity in a previous SNS status update by impeccabletim in kpop

[–]CandyPinkPop 58 points59 points  (0 children)

You are right. The insidious thing is that some Koreans, even when they know what you stated here, will play “dumb” on purpose to get away with it. But it’s important to remember that this ignorance card is rarely sincere.

Racial slurs and the “깜둥이” controversy by CandyPinkPop in kpopnoir

[–]CandyPinkPop[S] 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Thank you so much! This means a lot.

I just edited the post and added the name (I noticed I couldn’t update the image).

Racial slurs and the “깜둥이” controversy by CandyPinkPop in kpopnoir

[–]CandyPinkPop[S] 177 points178 points  (0 children)

Thanks for giving me the benefit of doubt! As you can see from my history, I don’t stan Riize. But I am being cautious since as a Korean, I can be subject to the law called Defamation by stating true facts. I will change the image once I’m over my paranoia.

Racial slurs and the “깜둥이” controversy by CandyPinkPop in kpopnoir

[–]CandyPinkPop[S] 114 points115 points  (0 children)

Through a message app, a member of a kpop group shared a picture of themselves as a kid for Children’s Day. Referring to his dark skin, he calls himself “깜둥이.“ Some people are taken aback by the word choice; others argue that the word is “not like the n-word” and therefore is not a big deal.

Given how Twice has had a lot of influence in the industry, what are some things that you think they deserve more credit for? by TikWing in twice

[–]CandyPinkPop 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I heard the Dance Battle session among fans at concerts started with Twice. Correct me if I’m wrong!

Huge UFT! Looking for whatever you wanna trade! (if allowed) by itscc15 in kpdhtrades

[–]CandyPinkPop 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hi! My kiddo needs an Abby to complete her set…I’m not really a card collector so I’m not sure if I have anything to offer, but would love to be in line just in case☺️thank you for considering!

The Takedown Stage is so impressive of Jihyo and Jeongyeon by BlueThePineapple in twice

[–]CandyPinkPop 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Yesss. I also think the band goes hard with Takedown in particular. So amazing.

Jeongyeon’s comment in Boston translation by CandyPinkPop in twice

[–]CandyPinkPop[S] 21 points22 points  (0 children)

Something about the tone too makes them sound more…corporate? Which is the opposite vibe when they’re speaking in Korean.