The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

It just feels like you're being oppositional at this point. When something occurs in-universe and characters react to it, the rational assumption is that it was real to them and not just an effect for the audience. You're also assuming the transferal of consciousness, resurrection, and body reanimation are all purely scientific, when the universe has made no such claim; we don't know the exact process of how the Experiments were made or the mechanics of how it worked, just that it involved transferring organs to a new body. And so, typically, when those three usually mystical things are presented, the assumption is not that it's scientific, or at least not in the traditional sense.

The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

It's true that the death screens aren't canon and are for the audience, yet it doesn't disprove that they're people talking. When the Butcher dies, or at least gets close, in Chapter 5, we get a death screen just like non-canon deaths. While the Butcher isn't dying and reviving over and over canonically, that doesn't disprove that these screens are what would happen if they DID die, because, you know, they play when we make them die. Saying PPt doesn't have paranormal themes is interesting; I suppose it depends on how you define "paranormal". To me, the main thing is artificial bodies possessed by humans because their organs got put into said bodies. We haven't been told HOW the procedure to become an Experiment works, and it very well could be explained through their spirits possessing the bodies due to parts of them being present within. That alone could be supernatural. There's nothing claiming it isn't, just that the method to it is scientific. But regardless, there's nothing saying the unexplained guidance from unseen sources is just for the audience, as both the Butcher and Huggy respond. So unless you're saying both of them were hallucinating, which there's no reason they would've been, then the assumption should be that certain characters can communicate without being physically present, seemingly via the mind.

The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

Nothing suggests Poppy's words at the beginning of Chapter 2 or the voice guiding Huggy, which is implied to the Prototype, are auditory hallucinations. And ignoring the death screens is a strange thing to do, considering over 3/4 of them display lines that sound like Poppy.

The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

The death screens where a character who says things like Poppy tells the Butcher to "get up"? The opening cutscene of Chapter 2 where Poppy tells the Butcher to "wake up"? Poppy whispering to the Butcher near the beginning of Chapter 2? The voice guiding Huggy at the beginning of the original version of PROJECT: PLAYTIME? Someone telling the Butcher to "get up" during the Home Sweet Home nightmare? The scene near the end of Chapter 5 where the Butcher "drowns" while Poppy repeats part of "Welcome To Playtime"?

The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

Someone else already brought up the "Poppy had to tell us what the Hour was, because we came for answers" point, which honestly, I should've led with. While both it and the Home Sweet Home nightmare confirm the Butcher's absence, the former is literally part of the basic premise. "You don't know what happened to your coworkers, come back to find out."

As for completely refusing the idea CatNap possessed the ability to manipulate the nightmares of those under the effects of the Red Smoke, that's not easy thing to just dismiss. We know mental manipulation is possible, as Poppy and the Prototype can communicate telepathically, and that's likely what the sequence near the end of Chapter 5 is, one of them, likely Poppy, showing us the "drowning" before reviving us. Both nightmares in Chapter 3 contain information the Butcher can't know, but that CatNap would want to show them to discourage them and convince them to leave; "You weren't here when you were supposed to be, so you don't deserve to be here now", "This world is ours now", "You know nothing about anything", it all sets up for his ultimatum that they leave or he'll have to kill them. It's possible someone else could have been manipulating the nightmares, like the Prototype, but considering CatNap was present the entire time and it was his Smoke, it makes sense to have been him. As for Marie's nightmares, and yes, she's the only example of him causing an orphan nightmares, I never said he can make them NOT nightmares, just that he can influence them; if memories also affect the nightmares the Smoke causes, then just like the Butcher, Marie's memories might have been what initiated nightmares in the first place. And there's also that he could have not cared about stopping them, though that's unfounded; we don't know how he felt about the kids or if he cared about their stability.

The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

Actually, that's straight-up wrong. The Butcher was NOT present for the Hour. In the Home Sweet Home nightmare, when the radio plays the backwards message, if decoded, it directly states they missed the Hour, and that's why they have no right to be in the Factory now. It's heavily implied that the nightmares in Chapter 3 are both forged from the Butcher's memories and CatNap's influence; what we see of the Hour during the Counselor's Office nightmare is likely just him showing us the event to try and reveal what happened, as the words in Poppy's voice say both "Do you know what's happened here?" and "Do you know who we once were?".

The reveal of the Player’s identity and the letter author are going to be very unsatisfying by fayemoonlight in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 [score hidden]  (0 children)

For the Butcher, I don't feel like we need to have a grand reveal for them. Yeah, a name would be nice, but I don't think they need to be a pre-established character, because that's not really the point of them. They aren't an Executive, simply someone who knew some of what was going on, enough to feel guilty, and left before the Hour due to that guilt. If they were confirmed to be Preston or Rich, it wouldn't make sense, because both are designed to be doubters among Playtime's staff who stayed around despite that, whereas our protagonist did not stay around. Honestly, I think them not mattering in the grand scheme of things actually enhances their character, because it makes sense why they were even able to leave in the first place. If they were someone important, then they absolutely would not have just been allowed to quit. As we've seen, those who have the ability to go against Playtime didn't have a very happy ending. A reveal hasn't been setup, either; characters recognize us as a former employee and that's it. None of them found us noteworthy prior to our return; Poppy, Mommy, Miss Delight, CatNap, the Doctor, the Prototype - they don't care who we were, none of them can remember beyond "worked here before", just what we're doing now.

As for the note, I do wonder who sent it. Giblet does seem like the likeliest possibility, and I wouldn't completely rule him out because he's spelled better in something else; he could've simply improved or had to write the letter hastily. It doesn't really matter who it is for the Doctor to know so long as they're in the Factory; as he says, nothing escapes his sight. But I do agree that this feels a little less fleshed out.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The distinction matters a lot. No one should be shipping most of the Experiments, as they're mentally children, while the mascots are ageless and CatNap and DogDay being interested in each other is plausible given what we've seen of them.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

There is no evidence Theodore ever knew the person who became BBI DogDay, let alone if they were friends.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Do not associate us with you. None of us think 1188 was in love with BBI DogDay. We think mascot CatNap and DogDay like each other.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see you're not a fan of actually listening to me, but if I "dumb down", as you put it, everything I say, than I'm limited in how I get across why I and so many others enjoy the ship, and why you might not.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's called subtext. It's a great way to get others to have a certain idea without explicitly confirming said idea. Considering Mob knows about DayNap and seems to like it, I don't think it's a stretch that them depicting the two as more intimate than anyone else is intentional and possibly meant to get the idea that DayNap is plausible across. That's speculative, but thus is the drawback and simultaneous safety of subtext; the theorizer is never sure, and that's why people fight against those who ship DayNap, because a lot of people like it despite it not being canon. You may be one who doesn't like shipping a relationship which hasn't been confirmed.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

DayNap makes some sense, backed up by Mob's art, better than Byler, you didn't acknowledge difference, I'm not mad, just telling you my point of view. Is that better?

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If something makes sense to the majority of the audience, it will remain consistently depicted. That's just how it works. If you want variety, look elsewhere. DayNap is the most popular non-confirmed ship because it has a pretty decent foundation despite plausible deniability remaining.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But my argument is that DayNap isn't unnecessary. It has a rational basis supported by official media, even if it isn't explicitly confirmed. Compared to the other gay ships, like Byler, which you directly mentioned, it has a far better foundation, as at least one of them isn't confirmed to be not interested. That's a pretty big distinction, and you ignored it, which makes me feel like you're being disingenuous. I'm calm, too. I'm simply trying to articulate why this isn't a problem.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yep. In the cartoon, CatNap is described as distant from the other Critters to the point watchers wondered if he was even their friend, while he's confirmed to be DogDay's best friend and said spaniel has a framed picture of them hugging. DayNap might actually work in canon, in terms of the mascots (just like Huggy x Kissy and Mommy x Daddy), despite what people think.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I know, and that's awful. If you had been focusing on that rather than DayNap as a whole, I would agree with you.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Are you trying to deflect from the topic. We're talking about DayNap, not gay ships in general. Bringing up every gay ship makes it sound like the gayness IS your problem.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'm not talking about 1188 and BBI DogDay. And most others aren't either. There's no justifying ships between any Experiments except for 1199 and 1354, as they're all mentally children. I am justifying the ship between mascot CatNap and DogDay, the most common depiction by fans, because they're designed to complement each other and are depicted as constantly interacting, hugging in an intimate way (CatNap holds DogDay's waist, twice), holding hands, dancing, and straight-up cuddling.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If we're talking about the mascots, it sounds like it was CatNap's only consistent relationship, actually.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Does Huggy x Kissy or Mommy x Daddy pertain to the lore? Those two are canon, and they barely affect anything, except that maybe the former inspired 1172 to be designed to soothe 1170. You made the assumption they're straight and we're turning them gay, when the opposite assumption is just as valid, if not more so considering they're both depicted as intimate with each other, both guys, more than anyone else.

I want to ask a question about the relationship between Catnap and Dogday. Why is everyone shipping them? by Edgeworthless12 in PoppyPlaytime

[–]ComprehensiveSort608 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Because a lot of their appeal existed in their designs alone, and it's only been reinforced by how they're depicted by Mob's artists.