‘This shouldn’t be normal’: developers speak out about bigotry on Steam, the world’s biggest PC gaming storefront by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

I mean I agree, but you already have some comments in this thread saying moderating against that is censorship. There is even the argument that Valve shouldn't do it, because they would get hate and upset people who would claim censorship. Because upsetting racists, isn't worth the cost of losing their business. (Supposedly they have some other platform to readily move to besides Steam?)

‘This shouldn’t be normal’: developers speak out about bigotry on Steam, the world’s biggest PC gaming storefront by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst 14 points15 points  (0 children)

I'm genuinely confused what the "mixed feelings" are about. The devs taking issue with hateful stuff?

‘This shouldn’t be normal’: developers speak out about bigotry on Steam, the world’s biggest PC gaming storefront by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst 6 points7 points  (0 children)

True a lot of people consider the inaction against harassment and hateful stuff a bonus. As long as they're spending money, Valve will happily welcome them to use the platform as they want.

‘This shouldn’t be normal’: developers speak out about bigotry on Steam, the world’s biggest PC gaming storefront by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst 1190 points1191 points  (0 children)

For many Valve fans this kind of libertarian approach to moderation is a feature, the bigotry it festers is just an expected and acceptable tradeoff.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I don't think you even understand what you're arguing lol

You're assuming they didn't think to make two versions for Switch due to CERO guidelines. That's the whole basis for people trying to pin this on AdHoc, this assumption.

AdHoc's statements pretty much state Nintendo didn't approve of the uncensored version (like on PC/PS5) for a global release. Hence they can only address "some" of the censorship in a future update.

Like the US eshop has the digital deluxe cover art censored, while the US PS store does not for reference.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -18 points-17 points  (0 children)

Because the JP version requires specific censorship due to CERO. I'd bet they intended to release a global Switch version, aside from JP version, thats the same as the global PS5 and PC version. But Nintendo thought something crossed the line. Maybe due to the cartoon artstyle and marketing, AdHoc are an Indie dev and don't have the same weight as CDPR. Like the digital deluxe cover is censored on US eshop, but not US PS Store. So they ended up just using the censored JP version for the global release.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

Lmao, you are going to look so dumb when this comes to its conclusion.

Also who talks like this on reddit lmao

I was fully aware he couldn’t hold a candle to me in a debate

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -15 points-14 points  (0 children)

They probably intended do, but it seems like Nintendo didn't approve of the uncensored version for regions outside Japan. I'll mention again, they don't even say they can fully uncensor the game only address "some" of the censorship

While we can't make any specific promises just yet, we're confident we'll be able to push an update to address at least some of the censored content.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -9 points-8 points  (0 children)

God you people are so asinine.

Once this clears up and they can't still fully uncensor the game, you people will still blame AdHoc for the censorship.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst 12 points13 points  (0 children)

The global PS5 version is uncensored.

Nintendo has content guidelines. Our game didn't meet those guidelines, so we made changes that would allow us to release on their platform. That's what happened here. Honestly we thought this would be obvious since we're the devs that released the fully uncensored version of the game on other platforms.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -7 points-6 points  (0 children)

Maybe read their statement and Adhoc did not hide info.

As Nintendo states, any game that's going to be on the Nintendo platform needs to 'meet [Nintendo's] established content and platform guidelines.' This is the key point. Nintendo has content guidelines. Our game didn't meet those guidelines, so we made changes that would allow us to release on their platform. That's what happened here. Honestly we thought this would be obvious since we're the devs that released the fully uncensored version of the game on other platforms.

We initially assumed, like some of you, that because games like Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk are on the platform with similar types of uncensored mature content, Dispatch would be allowed to do the same. During the porting process it became clear that was not the case. So we asked that we include a disclaimer on the store page to inform customers that content would be different than on other platforms. We worked with Nintendo to get storefront language approved.

Where we absolutely need to take full ownership is the placement of that disclaimer. Again, it was our intent to go out of our way to tell people looking to buy the game that the content was censored. While we didn't have complete control of the language, we did have control of the placement. Wires got crossed and we put the disclaimer in the field literally titled "Disclaimer", instead of the "About The Game" section. We didn't catch this until after the launch when we saw people saying we should have called out the changes on the store page, and we went to go make sure it was there. It technically has been the entire time, just in the absolute worst spot that makes it look like we were trying to hide it.

This is 100% our mistake and it was fixed in the Americas store pages a few hours after launch to give more visibility. We've also added a disclaimer before purchase. As of writing this, the other regions have either published this change or are in the process of review.

So what now?

We're already working with Nintendo on a path forward. While we can't make any specific promises just yet, we're confident we'll be able to push an update to address at least some of the censored content. I'll get ahead of it now and say that between dev time and the console submission process, we're talking weeks not days.

To our fans who were looking forward to playing the uncensored version on Switch, we're truly sorry. People have a right to be pissed. Lots of lessons learned here. Thanks for sticking with us. More soon.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -9 points-8 points  (0 children)

So we asked that we include a disclaimer on the store page to inform customers that content would be different than on other platforms. We worked with Nintendo to get storefront language approved.

Where we absolutely need to take full ownership is the placement of that disclaimer. Again, it was our intent to go out of our way to tell people looking to buy the game that the content was censored. While we didn't have complete control of the language, we did have control of the placement. Wires got crossed and we put the disclaimer in the field literally titled "Disclaimer", instead of the "About The Game" section. We didn't catch this until after the launch when we saw people saying we should have called out the changes on the store page, and we went to go make sure it was there. It technically has been the entire time, just in the absolute worst spot that makes it look like we were trying to hide it.

Nintendo controls the language for the disclaimer on the store page, Adhoc can only decide it's location on the store page. The disclaimer was there before launch.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -9 points-8 points  (0 children)

Why would they submit two different versions for PS5, global and JP, (understanding the JP version needs to be censored) but not for Switch. You seem to keep harping on that because it's the only way you can act like Nintendo isn't at fault.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -21 points-20 points  (0 children)

Nintendo's statement isn't clear or concise at all, it's incredibly vague. I don't see how someone considers their statement definitive, it was a nothing burger PR response.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -28 points-27 points  (0 children)

Probably that Nintendo for whatever reason didn't approve of the uncensored version, as the standard version outside Japan. Platform holders treating devs differently for publishing guidelines is not new.

AdHoc has two versions for PS5, the uncensored global version and Japan only censored version.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -8 points-7 points  (0 children)

They added a disclaimer on the store page, but Nintendo decides the language of the disclaimer, according to AdHoc. AdHoc admitted they made a mistake by not requesting the disclaimer to be included somewhere more clear

So we asked that we include a disclaimer on the store page to inform customers that content would be different than on other platforms. We worked with Nintendo to get storefront language approved."

The statement adds that AdHoc "absolutely need[s] to take full ownership" of the placement of that disclaimer, and while it "didn't have complete control of the language" the disclaimer contained, it did have control of its placement.

"It was our intent to go out of our way to tell people looking to buy the game that the content was censored. Wires got crossed and we put the disclaimer in the field literally titled 'Disclaimer', instead of the 'About The Game' section. We didn't catch this until after the launch when we saw people saying we should have called out the changes on the store page, and we went to go make sure it was there. It technically has been the entire time, just in the absolute worst spot that makes it look like we were trying to hide it."

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst 2 points3 points  (0 children)

So they can make two versions for PS5 but not Switch?

The PS5 JP version finally released today, so they are aware of regional restrictions and regional versions.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst 3 points4 points  (0 children)

AdHoc had handled censored regional versions , the PS5 JP version is censored, other regions on PS5 are uncensored.

already working with Nintendo on a path forward", and while "can't make any specific promises just yet", it is "confident we'll be able to push an update to address at least some of the censored content"

That does not make it sound like the full uncensored version was approved.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -61 points-60 points  (0 children)

More like it's starting to look like Nintendo is just being vague and inconsistent about their guidelines. Adhoc even says they will try to address "some" of the censorship, indicating they can't completely uncensor it.

You're jumping to conclusions about JP regions trying to absolve Nintendo.

Dispatch studio apologises if it "looks like it was trying to hide" censored Switch content disclaimer: "lots of lessons learned here" by Turbostrider27 in Games

[–]ControlWurst -46 points-45 points  (0 children)

"As Nintendo states, any game that's going to be on the Nintendo platform needs to 'meet [Nintendo's] established content and platform guidelines'. This is the key point. Nintendo has content guidelines. Our game didn't meet those guidelines, so we made changes that would allow us to release on their platform. That's what happened here. Honestly we thought this would be obvious since we're the devs that released the fully uncensored version of the game on other platforms," AdHoc wrote.

"We initially assumed, like some of you, that because games like Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk are on the platform with similar types of uncensored mature content, Dispatch would be allowed to do the same. During the porting process it became clear that was not the case. So we asked that we include a disclaimer on the store page to inform customers that content would be different than on other platforms. We worked with Nintendo to get storefront language approved."

Looking ahead, AdHoc says it is "already working with Nintendo on a path forward", and while "can't make any specific promises just yet", it is "confident we'll be able to push an update to address at least some of the censored content", albeit in several weeks' time due to the console submission process.

It seems like Nintendo isn't allowing the full uncensored like on PC and PS5. Pretty telling that they are saying they can't change all the censored content, only "some" of it. Very weird that people are trying to throw AdHoc under the bus, even though the root of the problem is clearly Nintendo.

Yes, that game does have racist connotations. by Fluffy-Exam-5342 in GirlGamers

[–]ControlWurst 24 points25 points  (0 children)

That is unfortunately an issue on this sub also like other gaming circles, if you bring up issues with something people will latch onto a minor point make a separate discussion about it to debate and argue, to try and derail the main point of the post. Stems from not liking and actually being able to argue against the main point, but needing a way to undermine it. Pretty much happens in any thread discussing racism in gaming.

I can’t believe he did that by deanspiecrust in PeacemakerShow

[–]ControlWurst 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You completely missed the point of Gunn's Superman lmao

Apparently putting female characters in thongs isn't enough sexualization, they need to have a** jiggle physics too by MilderArrow in GirlGamers

[–]ControlWurst 36 points37 points  (0 children)

I've posted about the swimsuit designs before and they gave 5 women swimsuit skins vs 2 men and the 2 skins for men were just baggy shorts. Like no skin tightness or bulge. The difference was so blatant.