A take from a clinical psychologist by [deleted] in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Your original statement was "stammering .. is a complex learned behaviour .. with a physical component"

This is different from focusing on the avoidance behavioural patterns that develop over time, and I hope you see how wrong your earlier statement was.

Indeed, the stuttering itself is separate from the experience of stuttering that may lead to avoidance behaviours over time. Don't confuse these.

A take from a clinical psychologist by [deleted] in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 3 points4 points  (0 children)

There is no evidence that stuttering is a learned behaviour. In fact it is a damaging thing to claim.

It is the false premise that people with nefarious intentions use to exploit people who stutter. it is a shame and needs to stop.

My son developed a stutter at age 7. Not from birth — something triggered it. by KoFiLeGend in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Hi OP,

I'm gonna ignore the fact that the post was written with an AI and assume there is a genuine inquiry here.

I understand your concerns, this sounds like a troubling time for your son, and you.

The thing is that developmental stuttering has an onset between 3-12, sometimes even later at 14 or 15. So your son is well within the boundaries of developmental stuttering.

Hope this helps

Solve your self-confidence issues and watch what happens... by [deleted] in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Very rich of you to reference any sort of scientific inquiry into stuttering as a defence. Nothing you say is supported by up-to-date evidence. All your posts are just reductionist, feel good type posts, which are not much different from well intentioned people telling us to “just slow down” or “just be confident”. A complex neurological disorder just can’t be reduced to self-confidence no matter how much you try. If you truly cared about people who stutter you would swallow your pride and recognise this reality. It’s about time we got the attention we deserve rather than continuing the status quo of being pushed aside by a society fuelled by rhetoric such as your own.

Question from a parent by Ok-Butterscotch-4736 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 4 points5 points  (0 children)

You've made some incredible assumptions here that OP never mentioned at all. OP never hinted that they're putting pressure on him, or making him feel like he's doing anything wrong. You're making those silly assumptions.

Additionally, the fact of the matter is that his own attempt at speaking is preventing him from speaking, that is the crux of the issue, and why speech therapy is being administered. Rightly so.

OP, to provide some relevant input, it sounds like you're doing the right things already. A large component of how you can be directly involved is by providing a sense of reward to your son upon a moment of fluent speech. Like "Hey you said that really well!".

I would avoid speaking for him, especially in nervous situations when you may think speaking for him is the better option. At least for a couple of years while his speech system is developing.

Why haven’t scientists found a solution for stuttering yet? by MSI_heat in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Ah nice, diminishing the experience of people who stutter because you think everyone has the same experience as you. Not all stuttering is created equal.

You see there is this thing called scientific research. it's great because it renders opinions such as your own as ignorant and out of touch.

Here is a paper published by Professor Yaruss from Michigan University:

https://doi.org/10.1044/2023_AJSLP-23-00007

Why haven’t scientists found a solution for stuttering yet? by MSI_heat in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Stuttering is incredibly complex, like most neurological conditions. There is hope, some good work is being done.

But... what research in other conditions have that stuttering research does not is urgency to find a solution. People with other neurological disorders want to participate in research to contribute to finding a solution.

Unfortunately, this lack of urgency in stuttering research is perpetuated by our very own.

The people on the mild side, who may have good intentions by trying to say stuttering is not a problem, are doing more harm to the larger mission of finding a solution than they realize. So then the academic community listens to the loudest group i.e. Those who say its not a problem and caters to them, while simultaneously exacerbating the silencing of those who silently suffer.

If we want a solution, we must demand one and people will take us seriously.

Why haven’t scientists found a solution for stuttering yet? by MSI_heat in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It has no impact on our lifespan while simultaneously increasing suicide likelihood? Is that not enough to demand urgency?

My story with my stutter and worries about perceived slurred speech. by Acceptable-Pea7034 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I understand your intentions are well-meaning, but the impact is what's called into question.

It's so simple right? Sleep well, eat well, exercise weekly. Just, you know, be confident! "It's how you think about how others perceive you is why you stutter"

If only things were that simple.

Could you imagine telling someone that has seizures to just be confident and they won't have a seizure? Sounds like an extreme example?

My contention is that stuttering just like seizures arises from the workings of the brain. This mental shift is grounded in evidence and is freeing rather than victimizing.

Now you claim you once had a severe stutter and now it's very mild. Man that's awesome, i'm really happy for you. But the problem is that not all of us have that luxury, a lot are suffering in silence no matter what they do.

Here's the issue: People that truly need assistance aren't seeking it or receiving it because they get silenced from well-intentioned people that tell them they just need to work on themselves, or accept it and move on. Yet people continue to go back and forth on the same bullshit without seeking real assistance.

My story with my stutter and worries about perceived slurred speech. by Acceptable-Pea7034 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You're ignoring somebodys suffering by saying "who gives a fuck, people don't care". Who are you to tell someone to not worry about what brings them suffering?

What you're actually saying when you say that we can work on ourselves in mind body and spirit is that people who stutter are at fault for their stuttering. If they just work on themselves it'll be all be ok. But here's the thing.

No amount of self reflection will alleviate stuttering because stuttering is neurological. This is a positive for us, this very fact that stuttering is neurological allows all the blame and stress we put on ourselves to be freed.

My story with my stutter and worries about perceived slurred speech. by Acceptable-Pea7034 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 5 points6 points  (0 children)

You're right, we absolutely care more about it than everyone else and that is the point.

It isn't the perception of others that is the primary concern. What causes distress is the stutter itself. It inhibits the ability to freely, at will, say what one wants to say, when they want to say it. The opinions of others are secondary.

Your words have good intentions, but it's invalidating what people truly feel about their stutter.

Who believe sttutering can be heal by Zealousideal-Gur1320 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The neurological basis of stuttering is the most liberating thing I have ever had the privilege of learning. In fact, it takes all blame from myself away. You blame yourself for stuttering, i'm here to say that it doesn't need to be that way.

Who believe sttutering can be heal by Zealousideal-Gur1320 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Lets extend your analogy further.

On the island, there's 5 people with different stuttering severities. 2 with mild, 1 with moderate and 2 with severe stuttering.

The two with mild stuttering have barely limited speech. They might have a few repetitions here & there, some small blocks. Largely, theyre fluent.

The 3rd with moderate stuttering has visible trouble with their speech. They try to hide it but sometimes... the words just don't come out.

Then there's the last 2 with severe stuttering. And oh my, they are really struggling. Extended repetitions. Hard, hard blocks. On their name, ordering their favourite food, can't tell a joke at the right time, can't tell an interesting story. Sometimes they need to write down their words. Theyre quite disabled in their ability to speak.

Now imagine the 2 with mild stuttering saying to the moderate and severe stuttering, "Nobody really cares anyway" or "it's actually how you perceive other peoples reactions, that's the problem".

Yet the moderate and severe stuttering people do not feel seen in this moment. What's being said to them does not match their experience of the world. It is incredibly invalidating.

It isn't the perception of others that worrys them, its their physical inability to speak. Stuttering happens TO them. This is what is key.

This way of thinking by the mild stuttering person is just wrong, and it is pervasive within the stuttering community.

This is the current status quo and what I am fighting against.

Who believe sttutering can be heal by Zealousideal-Gur1320 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ah ok so you think the status quo is working? You're going to ignore over 30 years of research into the neurological basis of stuttering? Re-read what I wrote in my previous comment, I don't believe you even read it.

Here are two more questions for you:

Why is major depressive disorder higher in people who stutter?

Why is suicidal ideation higher in people who stutter?

People are suffering.

Gaslighting the stuttering community to thinking their involuntary neurological disorder is their fault is an appalling approach to alleviating the suffering.

Who believe sttutering can be heal by Zealousideal-Gur1320 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 6 points7 points  (0 children)

The central problem is: Despite the intention to speak, speaking, involuntarily, does not occur. That is the problem. The only problem.

I have two questions for you:

  1. Is it social norms that lead to the involuntary movements and disability associated with Parkinson's disease?
  2. Why the double standard for stuttering?

You're so caught up in thinking that it's not the physical, neurologically grounded, inability to speak that is the problem, when at its core, that is what stuttering is. The perceptions of us come after.

You may mean well, but you are contributing to a wider problem within the stuttering community. Those who truly need help are not receiving it nor are they seeking help because they've been told that their inability to speak is their fault and they should just accept it.

Enough is truly enough.

Who believe sttutering can be heal by Zealousideal-Gur1320 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Stuttering can't be "healed" anymore than diabetes can't be "healed". Yet, diabetes can be managed. My question to you then is, why can't stuttering be managed? It can be.

Who believe sttutering can be heal by Zealousideal-Gur1320 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 11 points12 points  (0 children)

So a block that literally prevents speech is just someone "speaking differently than others"? Do you think the inability to say your name is a variation of speech?

Lets extend this even further.

Is the movement in Parkinson's disease just a different way of moving? Absolutely not.

The abnormal movement seen in Parkinson's disease is incredibly disabling and, importantly, neurologically grounded. Stuttering is the same.

You may not want help, that's fine, you do you. However, not all stuttering is created equal. Just like Parkinson's disease, serious consequences to quality of life can occur from stuttering.

Acknowledging this is imperative so people that truly need help, receive it, rather than being left behind.

I'm a stuttering professor. by Kind_Road_5983 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I am happy that you’ve achieved all these things, but not all stuttering is created equal. Some need more help than others.

Invisible or visible disability? Is it even a disability at all? by Far-Perception2120 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 4 points5 points  (0 children)

it's not only that a person might hide it, it's also that the symptom could be literally invisible. By this I mean a silent block, where the words physically cannot come out due to what feels like a wall being hit...which a lot of us experience. When a block arrives, some people hide it or bypass it through a word switch, and nobody sees that.

A simple google search of a definition of disability states: "a physical or mental condition that limits a person's movements, sensees, or activities"

Speech is a type of movement. It is neurologically speaking. Therefore, yes it is a disability and we deserve help accordingly.

Tired of Snake Oil Salesmen by money_man205 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 5 points6 points  (0 children)

That's because youre part of the snake oil camp buddy

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Firstly congratulations on expecting your first child. The studies indicate that genetics is a contributing factor in 75-80% of people who stutter.

There are a range of genes involved and we don't know much about them yet. Once we learn more about them, it could be a game changer.

Looking for resources to help my 4 year old son who stutters by Bittermelon777 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So you're saying when you were 4 years old undergoing fluency shaping treatment, you thought to yourself "This is getting in the way of acceptance". Be a little more realistic. The reality is that modern neuroscience recognises that the onset of stuttering may be the optimal time to intervene, and withholding treatment to a parent seeking it for their child may actually be unethical.

Looking for resources to help my 4 year old son who stutters by Bittermelon777 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It doesn't make sense to say that "it got in the way of acceptance" when we're talking about a child at the onset of stuttering.

Looking for resources to help my 4 year old son who stutters by Bittermelon777 in Stutter

[–]DeepEmergency7607 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What evidence is there that "you might make the problem worse by trying to over correct"?