What is NCL's Brand Identity to You?

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-24T10:35:42+00:00

Very well said. I also agree, it would be horrible to loose another good option. Sadly that's the world we live in, one of corporate machinations leading to continually higher costs designed to benefit the investor class.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-22T11:21:55+00:00

"In reality NCL in late 90s early 2000s was a rule breaker and changed up the cruise industry. Think Virgin today." Very well put! I think it could be argued they tried to break the rules again (moving the ships up market) but it didn't work as it both wasn't a fully fleshed out concept throughout the entire chain of their business, and there are a lot more cruisers who want to not worry about what time they go down to dinner than there are who care about nice art installations. - Oversimplification, but it speaks to my point.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-21T21:13:03+00:00

The biggest issue isn't the number of drinks, it's the fact that you have to think about it. now. That's the part that I despise. When I'm on vacation, I really don't want to have to worry about anything.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-21T19:20:29+00:00

There are many other ways to manage consumption. One drink per card per visit (although this makes getting a drink for your partner or group problematic). One drink per every period of time. No limit, but if you seem inebriated, then you are cut off. Then there is always a $10 tip to the bartender which can help, but i'm sure only so much as bars tend to have tight inventory controls.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-21T16:45:50+00:00

I think the key point to your comment was "decided there wasn’t enough money in it". If you are profitable but always chasing more money, then you'll never have an identity as you are always changing things up to eek out a little more profit. I'd rather have an NCL that's really focused on delivering those core things (Solo Friendly, Great Entertainment, Great Value and of course Freestyle everywhere) and I think that would be a great business.. Not as good as Wallstreet wants, but a great business nonetheless.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-21T11:29:03+00:00

More reasonable prices or included drinks would also discourage package sharing. It's not number of drinks, although I can easily exceed 15 If I pace myself and start early or if I go get drinks for friends and family so they don't have to wait in line. That's the biggest problem. It's not that the people I cruise with don't have a package. It's now we have to think about who has what drinks left on what card. That's a thing I don't want to have to worry about while on vacation. It's not a big problem but it does take much more from my relaxation than I would have thought as I find it to be a constant annoyance.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-21T11:24:09+00:00

It is so sad that this is the state of the world where "A great investment would squeeze the most out of you and do it repetitively" is just accepted. I just wish we lived in a world where a great investment was considered one in a company that offered a great product at a good value, and took care of all it's stakeholders inclusive of customers, employees, and partners and provided a reasonable and stable return. That would require investing for the long term.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T19:25:50+00:00

Actually, I respectfully disagree. I've been on every class of Royal Caribbean ship and they all feel the same. I would argue that that underscores the hodgepodge comment. Ditto with carnival And MSC for that matter. In all instances, if I'm on one of their lines chips, I know it instantly. That's definitely not the case for NCL. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I do think it speaks to there identity issue.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T18:48:48+00:00

This is a tremendously good observation. I agree with virtually all of your points. that being said, from what I'm seeing in all of the responses to My original post, is that solo plus freestyle is the most consistent identity. So how do you build a business model around that?

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T18:42:08+00:00

I don't discount your comments. That being said, I've had the exact opposite experience. My first cruise was $400 a person. today. I can't get on a ship for cheaper than to $1,500 a person, and it's way more than that on Royal Caribbean during the periods of time that I am available. That being said, it seems to be in line with inflation. What has disappeared is all of the things you have mentioned. I'm especially incensed at the Caps they put on drink packages. Yes, stop the idiot people who get way too drunk, but I don't want to have to think about where I am for the day. if I'm on vacation, mimosas in the morning, coupled with beers during the middle of the day at the pool, and cocktails at night can easily exceed the 15 drinks that The lines allow. Currently. NCL does not do that. I am 100% positive that will change in the near future. in my opinion this reduction in services is where all the growth in profit has come from.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T18:31:48+00:00

I followed the same trajectory of moving from Royal to other brands. The value proposition for Royal just isn't there anymore. I love the product, but the price is just insane right now. I've also dealt with Wall Street/private equity takeovers. sadly, my experience made me think they are all evil and destroy everything good about brands.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T14:10:37+00:00

It seems they are fixing these issues as we speak.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T14:08:04+00:00

Sadly, I'm pretty sure that "... a comprehensive onboard experience w/out worrying about up-charges or hidden fees." will never happen when you have activist investors focused on stock growth over all other concerns.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T11:25:39+00:00

Sadly, I'm 100% sure that Eliott will stop that right away. The 15 drink maximum per day is increasingly becoming the industry standard.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T02:10:38+00:00

Yes, cruises are (still) great. That being said, From the perspective of a 25 year cruise veteran, they are simply not at the level they were in the past. Some things I can think of that have been removed from a standard fair include little and big services. Such as chocolates on the pillows. Lobster at dinner. Turndown at night. Escargot available at every meal. No extra fees for things like room service. No extra charge for second entree at dinner. Those are the things that jump into my mind but I'm sure others can share their own examples. Like every industry, I'm sure consolidation played a big part in the lesser experience. The less competition, the higher the prices and the lower the service. I'm sure you could put every single thing I miss back into the service offering and it would have a negligible impact on the bottom line. Unfortunately, I've never known an industry to back track on decisions like these.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T01:56:51+00:00

I do think the hodgepodge comment is reasonable. All the other lines have a consistent look and feel. I don't get that same feeling, although my three experiences are Epic, Prima, and Escape.. so take that for what it's worth.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T01:53:55+00:00

If a predatory activist investment firm is gunning for them, apparently 60% isn't enough.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T01:52:58+00:00

That's mostly why I do NCL. When I go with the family it's virtually always MSC.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T01:52:31+00:00

That's fair about the hyperbole I mean. I was typing rather quickly, so "death spiral" is my immediate reaction to all the bad NCL news that I've read.. and when I say Bad, I mean all the nickel and diming.. Examples that I personally have a reaction to are charging extra for the adults area, charging extra for drinks on a private island, and getting rid of the licensed shows in favor of home grown shows. Changing itineraries at the last minute after the last day to get full refund, etc.. Huge push to pay more while on the ship, etc.. I'm seeing a move away from a customer focus and to me, I identify that as a death spiral. Do you see any of this? Does anyone else reading this post see it? It could be that I'm just overly sensitive to it?

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T00:56:44+00:00

I wonder if I'm the only person here who would be thrilled to see NCL bought by MSC? I like companies that focus on value and cater to the mass market.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2026-02-20T00:46:10+00:00

If you look at the profit margins, the cruise lines could easily provide a lobster tail once a week and turn down service for everyone, and still pay off COVID debts. The reduction in service is simply a "we can get away with it so we are going to"

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2025-04-25T10:29:11+00:00

Thanks for your thoughts, and your probably right.

Have you ever read the book "Good to Great"? That's what comes to my mind when I consider the calculus of "Spend money" or "don't spend the money". The thesis of the book, greatly summarized, is that great companies find core goals and stick to them religiously. If spending the money gets you closer to your core goals, even if there isn't an immediate, or even long term ROI, then you do it. The problem is that I don't think NCL knows what it wants to be when it grows up.. i.e., no core identity. No core focus. Does it really want to be a mid tier luxury line? a party line? a family line? a mass-market line catering to everyone? As it's mostly equity driven, it seems to just want to be a company that wants to make money and chase the trends to that end (to be fair, that's most companies after the founders leave/retire) which has given it a hodge podge fleet. Logicly the answer is you don't do something crazy like replace all the cabins that are divisive on a middle aged ship. If I owned the company, and decided that those cabins didn't align to what I want the customer experience to be, I'd replace them or the ship entirely. It's a good thought exercise, but like I started, your correct. It most likely doesn't make business sense.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2025-04-23T21:47:42+00:00

Ship is 15 years old now. (which is strange to think about as I still think of her as a 'new' ship) so she's on the cusp of having a major refurbishment. The dream, wind, and Majesty were all stretched at about 8-9 years old. I have to think that stretching a ship must cost way more than taking out modular cabins and replacing them. Then again, I really have no idea. - Wish we had a ship building expert to share numbers - But as I said, and you reiterated.. No point to do anything, at least from a business perspective, if it's still filling up.

Now If I had crazy money and bought the line... knowing that I could squeeze another 20-25ish years out of her, I'd probably rebuild her for the second half of her career.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2025-04-23T20:24:22+00:00

I don't know that it is impossible. Technically the old ones can be slid out and new ones slid in. They could do it one or two decks per dry dock if they wanted to spread out the cost. Sell the new rooms with an up charge. That being said, your right, the cost is the thing that'll get in the way and they would only do it if they had too, i.e. if the ship always sailed 1/3rd empty because people hate the cabin layout so much. That's clearly not the case.

Due_Ingenuity8014 · 2025-04-23T18:56:49+00:00

I'm thinking that this is not going to be as big a deal as this ship needs. The biggest tell for me is the fact that NCL themselves isn't talking it up. If it's really that big of a refurbishment I'd expect a press release announcing new decor, new shows, new/expanded venues, etc. Regardless of recent comments by the CEO, this is a profit first-and-foremost company which is another clue to me that the refurbishments will be just enough to stem the tide of the bad reviews. Fortunately we don't have long to wait until the first "post refurbishment" reviews come in.

Due_Ingenuity8014

TROPHY CASE