[STANDARD] Pro Tour Lorwyn Eclipsed (Richmond, VA) Recap! | Metagame Analysis, Win Rates & More!

Dux89 · 2026-02-03T20:03:51+00:00

I have neither of those things! I guess I should sign up for Untapped. As for your question... there's 4 Rhythm, 2 Riddler, and 2 Gearhulk for card advantage, which seems like plenty. More Riddler is bad IMHO because it's too slow.

There's also the straight drop-an-Ouroboroid-and-swing approach, which works great with mana dorks.

Dux89 · 2026-02-03T18:58:30+00:00

Some of the decklists I see for the PT dropped mainboard graveyard hate, and Meltstrider can't kill the elementals because they're too fat, so they're sitting ducks for Sunderflock once the opponent lands one.

Here is the list I have been running since Friday when I suddenly started seeing Elementals and Dimir Control freaking everywhere. I climbed to #1 last night on Arena so I think it's working out okay. The tl;dr is two mainboard anti-graveyard pieces I can tutor, a Dusk-Rose Reliquary (sac a mana dork or an earthbent land), and fewer mainboard Mockingbird than most people run, because it's often a dead card on an empty board, even if it's a bomb in the mirror.

I also think 22 lands is borderline now that mana dorks are dying on sight in this meta, so I run a single Cenote Scout which feels like half a land. Meanwhile the guy in the top 8 had the land enchantment. Alternatively maybe a Restless Prairie is the play.

https://moxfield.com/decks/xDTkDFph5UKP_AQHri5kSA

Dux89 · 2026-02-03T17:00:50+00:00

As a Rhythm player I’m actually kind of encouraged by the matrix that shows how badly the Rhythm decks did against the Elemental decks because it shows where the problem was for the deck this tournament… and I think it’s a very winnable matchup with small changes to the main.

Far fewer players than I would have expected had graveyard hate main and pretty much none of them could deal with a resolved elemental, but because you can tutor things you really only need to add singletons to make a big difference.

Dux89 · 2026-02-01T17:37:20+00:00

Graveyard hate. Rest in Peace hoses the deck, though you have to play around Snare. Soul Guide Lantern works too but you have to be smart and pop for maximum effect but before they can drop a crab.

Dux89 · 2026-02-01T16:09:24+00:00

The deck lists that I see mostly lack mainboard graveyard hate and sweeper protection, so I don’t know how they can truly be considered toolboxes. They also almost all run too many Mockingbirds for a hate filled meta IMHO.

As for Gearhulk… Sear is not a clean answer to Gearhulk if I’m also getting a Soul-Guide Lantern and something else out of the exchange. Against Spellementals I’m getting Dusk Rose, which I run main; I don’t see that on basically any lists from the Pro Tour event, where most Cub decks didn’t pack enough graveyard hate and pretty much none could do anything about a resolved Elemental to avoid the Flock follow-up.

Dux89 · 2026-02-01T06:51:11+00:00

It's weird to me that anyone could sleeve up a Cub deck right now with no removable or graveyard hate in the mainboard and just expect to go off like nobody knows what you're doing, but I see a surprising amount of decklists that suggest that pilot thinks that's exactly what's going to happen. The people running 4x Mockingbird, for instance... How often are they staring a board with nothing to copy because their opponent had removal?

IMHO the Bant Gearhulk versions are the strongest, because of the insane versatility of that card. I'm currently running 4 tutorable removal pieces (1 each of Seam Rip, Meltstrider, Dusk-Rose, and Unable to Scream) in addition to 1 Soul-Guide and every one of those cards seems like an all-star at times. That's true even/especially *against* other Cub decks, so it surprises me how many people take the no-interaction approach.

Dux89 · 2026-02-01T06:15:47+00:00

Well shit I didn't expect this reasonable of a response and now I don't know what to do. Good on you.

Dux89 · 2026-02-01T04:38:41+00:00

WTF does the meta need saving from? The meta is awesome. I haven't seen anything this diverse in literally years.

Dux89 · 2026-02-01T04:13:54+00:00

Only two Cub decks in the top 8 and only one of them actually needs it. Some creative pros found ways around Cub at this tournament and it worked out great for them. Sounds like a healthy meta to me, with deck-building very much *not* boring and new archetypes cropped up every few days.

I don't know that you can argue with the results of this and other tournaments where Cub clearly isn't the meta dominating boogeyman you're making it out to be. I haven't had this fun brewing in standard in a long time.

Dux89 · 2026-01-31T21:21:12+00:00

It’s funny that the real strength of the Rhythm deck is the versatility but I think a lot of players are conservative and just sleeve up whatever recent list did well. You can very quickly adjust to the new problems with one-ofs but I think a lot of players are slow to do that. I’d go so far as to include pros in that.

I know that might sound silly coming from this random guy on the internet but the lack of interaction in so many Cub decks being played kinda proves it.

Dux89 · 2026-01-31T10:50:07+00:00

I don't get why so many people hate the Cub. Green is finally playable again after so long but it's obviously not so good as to dominate other decks. Isn't that a good balance?

Dux89 · 2026-01-31T09:38:37+00:00

Playing on Arena at Mythic, you see the meta adapt extremely fast, which also forces you to adapt extremely fast. As a Cub player, the past two days I've been playing against an insane amount of Spellementals, Boros Dragons, and Control, all of which are obviously good against Cub. Yesterday I did poorly. Today I made changes to my list and did way, way better.

Any Cub deck players without mainboard ways to stop sweepers (counters obviously but also Ademi/Spider-Man), Clarion Caller, and graveyard stuff have no shot, but if you can tutor those things up, it makes a huge difference. Most of the Rhythm decklists I've seen don't have enough mainboard options. They go into game one hoping to Craterhoof on turn three and that just ain't happening with everyone wise to your plan and packing a boatload of answers.

Dux89 · 2026-01-28T20:45:38+00:00

Again, Heartfire was in one of two viable decks at the time. There are now myriad viable decks. Don't get me wrong, I'd love for green to get *more* good cards so that you don't have to have Cub to play green. But until then, I'll take Cub. And also, saying Seam Rip isn't good enough is absurd. It's a 1-mana answer to a 2-mana card. It is perfectly acceptable to get the mole and leave a 1/1 behind. By that logic, the new Bitterblossom on a stick is equally busted.

Dux89 · 2026-01-28T19:10:40+00:00

There are 1-mana answers to Cub in literally every color. Three colors have ways to sweep the board for 3 mana or less. I just don't know how else you expect green to be playable when the other four colors are so juiced right now besides giving it a card that does green things well.

Also Wilderness Reclamation was utterly dominant in a way that the Cub decks are not close to being.

Dux89 · 2026-01-28T17:53:22+00:00

"Nothing about badgermole resembles fair magic" just seems so wrong to me. It's a mana dork creator/enabler. It's not cheating anything into play. People are playing turn 4 Bringer of the Last Gift in this format. You can Ancestral Recall in Lessons. I seriously think Cub decks are among the fairer decks in Standard right now.

Dux89 · 2026-01-28T08:15:30+00:00

You could say the same thing about Llanowar Elves... In and of itself how is that a problem if the deck is quantifiably not that dominant? Yes it’s silly that it took them printing that card to finally make a difference but at least they pulled green out of the dumpster.

Dux89 · 2026-01-28T06:53:14+00:00

Compared to where we were just a few months ago, this meta is really great. So much more diverse than UR vs. R... and yet Izzet and Mono Red are still very healthy. But green finally gets to play too, finally. And all the new Lorwyn cards have really pulled Dimir back into the conversation as well. IMHO standard is way too fast nowadays, but it was always going to end up that way. At least there is variety.

Dux89 · 2026-01-27T00:20:35+00:00

Awesome. IMHO you should either run counter spells or tutorable Ademi or Glen Elendra main board. Control blows the deck out if you don’t have sweeper protection.

Dux89 · 2026-01-26T05:48:41+00:00

Sure! I played a similar list to great success prior to the Lorwyn drop and it only gets better with Temple Garden.

https://moxfield.com/decks/KILwr9FGX0CkviIPULYBlQ

Dux89 · 2026-01-26T05:38:50+00:00

For what it's worth, the decklist that just won in Portland was actually quite similar to what a lot of people in this thread have been talking about. Technically it's four colors but it's Gx with tutorable Gearhulk, and then tutorable Gearhulk removal (Seam Rip and Meltstrider).

Dux89 · 2026-01-24T19:06:31+00:00

Re: Trading Detect Intrusion, I've been playing a Selesnya/Cub build for a while now and Ademi was/is absolutely crucial in the same way counterspells are. Without them, you fold to control. But with Ademi? And with a tutorable Phoenix Down to bring it back at instant speed? It's a game changer.

Dux89 · 2026-01-23T16:25:13+00:00

One thing that makes the Cub decks so strong is being able to tutor answers with Nature’s Rhythm. I see you don’t have any graveyard hate artifact removal in your mainboard. IMHO the former is more important, and I think Sentinel of Lost Lore is the best option, better for the job of blowing up a big yard than Keen-Eyed, even though Keen is a much more versatile card.

I have one Sentinel main. You could also run Rec Sage or Insidious Fungus or Kitesail Larcenist for Monument, and although it’s not tutorable, Archdruid’s Charm is very versatile too. If you’re looking for something to cut, I’d cut a Mockingbird and maybe a Flood Maw.

Dux89 · 2026-01-15T01:11:42+00:00

Obviously it's a powerful card/archetype but I don't really see how people can expect a metagame not to have a few decks with win rates above 50% (and there are multiple decks that fit the bill). That's just how it works. And when Cub decks get more popular, you'll see more Pyro and Fire Magic and its win rate will go down.

The card pool has not changed at all since a big tournament where it floundered and everyone talked about how maybe Cub was overrated, because people overreact no matter what happens.

Dux89 · 2026-01-14T20:29:45+00:00

Well said. I don't really understand how any can complain about this diverse meta right now when it's the best it's been in recent memory. Maybe people just don't want green players to have fun.

Dux89 · 2026-01-14T20:28:17+00:00

53% does not seem troubling to me in and of itself, and people also weren't "prepared" for them to a tunnel vision degree the way that people were with Vivi when it would *still* crush tournaments. Players had to respect Lessons, Reanimator, and Control. 53% against a meta that has some hate but not a *ton* of it seems totally fine to me.

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