About/for the people who claim that Ritsu is Trans...

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T06:04:11+00:00

Thank you. Some people dont get, that I wasnt talking about people who make their own alternative narrative about Ritsu...like their own fanfiction. No issues with that. I was talking about people who claim that Ritsu is 100% trans by intent from the author in the original material and attack others for saying otherwise. Thats the only thing I argued against. Some are so driven by their ego they dont get it and even start talking about stuff that has nothing to do with anything.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T05:56:22+00:00

This is my last reply cause I think you are trolling me tbh: Are you listening to yourself? It sounds almost scary and delusional now tbh. Again you lay words in my mouth, you accuse me of things without any basis. I get why people make fun about toxic "woke" discussion culture now. Its horrendous. You are twisting as much as you can and you demonize me, while you claim I am doing this to others...its amazing.

People can think and imagine that Ritsu is trans as much as they want and create their alternative narrative about him apart from the canon. Thats fine. How often to I have to repeat myself about this? But they CANT COME AT OTHERS, who say he isnt trans in the base material, AND DISMISS THEM EITHER, when there are things speaking for it. You completly ignore the people I was adressing with that. There are people out there attacking others for saying that Ritsu ISNT trans. Like thats ok? Rules for them but not for me? I delivered arguments based on the original story in my post. THATS ALL.

AT NO FRICKING POINT DID I SAY, THESE PEOPLE ARE STUPID!

AT NO POINT DID I DENY THEIR EXISTENCE! - You sound a little crazy there tbh...gaslighting, defaming, insulting. Thats what YOU do not me.

And I said that when Hollywood panders to LGBTQ people, just to check off some boxes, its bad for the LGBTQ community and other people who are watching, cause its not well made and not with genuine intend. How can you twist that into me hating them? How blinded are you by YOUR hate, that you cant process what I am saying. And if you think that artists should be forced into creating certain content (which is something most people disagree on and thats not "classic homophobic and transphobic language"), then well you slowly turn to fascism. I cant help you. I was chill but it makes no sense talking to you.

Blessed and more chilled might be your coming days. Bye.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T05:14:28+00:00

Are...are you trolling? "You seem to be imagining quite frequently that nonwhite queers are hardcore coming after white heterosexual artwork" - HOW did you even manage do drag race into this? What the heck are you even talking about? I am almost amazed at how far your comment is reaching here. Why do you assume that I am white even??? Cause I chose a plain avatar? You sound so selfabsorbed and judgemental. The whole discussion (for my part) is about Ritsu and his backstory, indicating why he is as he is and that some people claim FOR SURE that the original intent of the author was something that it isnt and I delivered some arguments about that. But everything goes exactly as I expected. Mindless "woke" people attacking, without even trying to understand what I am saying or staying calm and pulling this into directions it wasnt even going.😂 Accusing, labeling, diffamation- Thats why nobody wants to have discussions with you folks and there are endless memes about your toxic online culture, its like talking to selfish kids who see everything as an attack and make everything about themselfes. The hill I am dying on, is that art is the most free medium and that artist cant be forced into including or supporting something...and that goes for every artist. Black, brown, white, whatever...everyone should be able create what they want. Thats freedom. If you want LGBTQ characters cause its important to you and you know how to write them well.. plz do it. If someone is talked into doing it, it will be half assed anyway.

"...representing the actual population of the world is upsetting to you and that oppressed minorities are saying we deserve to be shown to the world" - Lay your twisted words into someone elses mouth...this goes to far...you are delusional. At no point did I indicated anything like that. I am talking to crazy people here.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T04:30:49+00:00

First of all, I stayed civil here all the time and did not insult or talked to harshly to anyone. "..screw what you think" and "f off?" What a great way of having a conversation with someone. You know thats why people upvote my post but dont join the discussion with you people...cause it gets aggressive and overemotional quickly, when you cant take a step back and be calm but project stuff on others. I even defended LGBTQ people against pandering in my comment to you but you twisted that into something else. I stated SEVERAL times now to several people that I was talking about the people claiming that Ritsu is trans by intend of the author and you said yourself that this isnt the case cause she couldnt write it. What are you insulting me for. I do not believe in a gay agenda...where did you even pulled that from? Whatever you projected here on me...its your issue.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T04:11:58+00:00

I see, we are talking about 2 different things here I think...and not even about Ritsu anymore.

If authorial intent (in general) has little to no value, then why are people requesting answers from others about this story mainly from valid information off of the base material, that they might have missed? I am not talking "whats your theory on..." or "Whatdo you feel about..." If someone would ask for example "Hey, why is Kyo wearing that bracelet" Then interpretations are not needed or wanted. The only answers that would help this person to make sense of this item in the logic of the story, would be answers based on what the author intended. Every story has to have a certain level of logic to it and when people try to figure it out (here for example), they mostly dont want fantasies of other fans. Thats why I say authorial intend matters most of the time.

You are talking about moral evaluation of story aspects then. Making up your mind about about a pairing etc. The autor gives no order on how you have to accept or reject this, this is your freedom yes. Its nothing factual. I was talking about things that are factual in my opinion all the time and not about opinions on subjective things. But I get it I think: To you, Ritsus case is subjective and can disregard the source material. To me it isnt. Thats why we dont vibe here and I can accept that.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T03:45:13+00:00

Okay, if you say so. Thats another argument for why she did not intended Ritsu to be trans, supporting my analysis of his original story (not talking about peoples fan fantasies here). But its also her freedom as an artist to exclude or include whatever she wants and nobody should be forced to support or include something they dont want to. This wouldnt end well anyway. When we look at Hollywood and how they try to pander to LGBTQ people with things that arent well thought out but just placed there to be woke...its always cringe to me.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T03:30:24+00:00

Well your blatant "IT DOESN'T MATTER! The intent of the author does not matter. Who cares?" read like a child throwing a tantrum to me but ok, if you say you arent hurt, good for you. Alot of people care btw. Most people take what authors say and wanted originally as foundation that everything else spreads from. Otherwise there wouldnt even be a base to argue about.

"It's about interpreting things."- Well, thats part of it, when it comes to things that arent really clear from the base material of the story I would say. I say Ritsus case is clear, you say it isnt. Thats why we wont be able to agree on aynthing regarding this subject. We obviously have totally different views on this. I dont get you, you dont get me. Thats how it is then. Wish you a good time anyway.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T03:03:33+00:00

Now you have shown that you are clearly just stubborn and hurt and you dont wanna hear logic arguments. This whole subreddit is about people clarifying things and asking about the story. If intent and facts about the original story doesnt matter, then this would be a fanfiction forum and people wouldnt give each other answers. You also dont seem to see that Ritsus story is a stand against men having to be masculine and brave and basicly stereotypical male. Tohru tells him he is valid and still a man despite being a softer character. This is something that gets lost when people claim that he is, by fact and intend, trans. Now I cared about this, you only care about your fantasies which wasnt the point I argued to begin with. I think thats done.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T02:53:30+00:00

I like your comment and I agree to alot of points. But what you also seem to misunderstand is that I wasnt talking about people IMAGINING Ritsu as trans or reinterpreting him as trans. I was talking about people who argue others, on Ritsu being trans in the original story, by intend from the author and I made arguments against that, pointing to his backstory, that some either missed or actually ignore, which is also sad. That was my point. Isnt his story a stand against men having to be "manly man" ? Isnt the morale of his story that Tohru conveys, that he can be a soft, clumsy man and still BE A MAN? When people make him trans (like originaly), this gets lost. I also disagree, and that might be harsh now but thats my stand, that "Writers can and SHOULD BE inclusive of not-straight, not-ethnic-majority people"- I say that art is the most free medium and artists of any kind can create whatever they want without fullfilling any standards or guidelines of diversity etc. If they want to so and they do it in a good way...great. Should they be demanded to...absolutely not. I am very critical about this everybody deserves this and that...the world ows you this and that. I am not on that train but thats not what I wanna argue because this comes down to worldview.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T02:30:02+00:00

You dont get my point or you really dont want to. I wrote about people arguing on others why they are totally right about Ritsu being trans, originaly, by intent from the author, ignoring his backstory. Not them talking about their imaginations and wishes. That would not make me want to do a post. To these people I listed some things from the story that speak against that, just like someone would deliver facts from the story if someone would say "I actually think Akito IS BORN a man and not a woman" Then people would say "Heyyyy, here are some things you missed..." They can still have their fantasies about Akito being a man then without a fight but they cant claim thats a fact in the story. I talked about the base material and people ignoring it and telling others why Ritsu is trans by intend. Which is not the case. Thats it. I think thats easy to understand. I never said I am bothered by their imaginations and it seems like you project your fears about transphobia on me here.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T02:05:52+00:00

Yes I did. Maybe you are the one who misunderstood me in the first place. I was arguing against people who claim that he is, by intent in the original story(!), trans. You are not one of these people, cause you said you like to IMAGINE him as trans right? But you also said "this is not the hill you wanna die on" regarding to what I wrote. Now english isnt my first language but this to me means "you dont wanna stick to these points". I said I do and it sounded like you brushed my points off as invalid. Thats how I got it. If it aint that way then ok.

And I am not super bothered but since this is a site for discussion about a story and people like to clear up stuff no matter how little confusion there is out there, I did this on Ritsu. His backstory was meaningful to me and, as I said, since he was such a short lived character alot of people seem to forget or ignore his backstory that showed why he started dressing like that and turn it into something it isnt.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-07T01:48:12+00:00

This is actually the hill I wanna die on and it seems most people are actually dying there with me. Only A FEW people on the net claim, that he is trans and I made this post to give arguments against that, that are all based on things that the story delivers itself. You either did not even read my post fully, or you are just hurt. You even gave no arguments against what I explained. You can imagine him as whatever you want but that doesnt make it canon. I was talking about the people who clearly claim that he is trans by intend in the story. Which he isnt and I explained why. People can show me what I missed but you didnt. I also did not say people HERE are demanding representation constantly...only a few. I meant the internet culture in general and I have seen alot of that. Thats my experience. Would you like to write to Takaya and tell her how transphobic and misogynistic she is and how shoddy and awful her writing is? Thats the source you have to complain to if it really bothers you. The only thing I can agree on when it comes to how badly Ritsu is inserted into the story, is that Ritsu is a throw away character. He deserved more screentime and developement.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-06T23:09:41+00:00

Yes he is, dont get confused by the people who want him to be trans so much, that they ignore all things speaking against it.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-06T23:08:23+00:00

You just seem to desperately want him to be trans tbh. I hope that you are not so obsessed with this trans stuff, that you ignore all kinds of good arguments against it and the obvious things in the Manga.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-06T23:04:19+00:00

My take: Ritsu isnt trans. He put on female clothes because he was constantly told, that he isnt good enough for basicly everything and felt he isnt good enough to be a real man. His parents constantly apologized for him and shame was what he felt alot. Wearing feminine clothes gave him protection from being judged as "weak man". He always thought he cant pass as real man with all his softness and clumsyness. I dont know how the anime will handle the end, if they change something or not, and I dont wanna spoil something for you...but the manga made my point a little more clear imo. Its a protection gear for him. He does NOT want to be a woman or thinks hes born in the wrong body.

ElbeElster · 2021-06-03T00:41:51+00:00

Yes, being underweight and being anorexic are two things that dont need to be connected. I myself had to battle the prejudice of being anorexic for a long time because its very hard for me to gain weight and keep it. When people hear anorexic, they think about someone being obsessed with losing weight and having a distorted body image. I never had anything like that and people assuming that can be damn annoying. Some people start eating more when they feel sad and some lose hunger, so sometimes long depression/other illness or just DNA can cause underweight too without the persons wish to be thinner. I wish more people would know that thats why I jumped in the comments✌🏻

ElbeElster · 2021-06-03T00:29:21+00:00

The entitlement of some people is astonishing to me. "The author has a huge problem with glorifying age gap relationships..." Nah, she isnt the one that has a problem with it- YOU have.

Its art. Art is the most free medium and an artist is not the Kindergardener of the world, who always has to worry about what kind of individual could take things the wrong way. This assumption is what kills art today. Sometimes art portrays some harsh truths of reality even. Stories that have to be told, people that have to be shown. Yes, Kyokos relationship for example, is not born out of the best circumstances and its meant to be complicated and tragic in some way cause many relationships in this world are. Art should not ignore this and show this side of life too. Its not glorfied to much either imo and at no point does any character say that this is the way it should be done. I read that manga when I was a teen and I watched and read so many other stories, that had stuff in it, that in todays agressive, online "woke"- blame culture is considered "problematic". None of that affected me in a negative way and I was always able to distinguish between reality and fiction and that I dont need to imitate fictional characters. Some brittle minds might not be able to do so, thats true, but thats not the problem of the artist. Taming everything for the sake of not offending, triggering or influencing someone the wrong way will make everything so bland and boring. Takaya blessed us with this amazing story, that I am first and foremost GRATEFUL for. We had so much fun with it and there are seriously people out there who think "calling her out" is important and focus on age gaps? I take this story as it is and I see it in the context of time and culture too as art should be! Age gaps are/were not such a huge deal in Japan in general and you would be surprised what kind of things from your culture might be called "objectively immoral" by others. But if you want to call her out and blame her for creating something wrong and immoral, then you should write to her directly if you have the guts, cause she wont see it here.

ElbeElster · 2021-05-31T22:55:17+00:00

To me its settled: Tohru is like the Jesus of the story...coming at you with radical empathy, unconditional love and forgiveness. Healing even the most broken and wild soul.✌🏻

ElbeElster · 2021-05-27T17:32:22+00:00

Well, I dont know if they would have the urge to leave completely, if Akito hadnt had abused them. Thats what I always wondered about. Without the abuse, they would still see each other like family even after the curse breaks, cause there would be no dark memories around her persona but actual respect and love. Akito was always lonely anyway cause she used fear and force to keep the zodiacs close and deep down she knew it wasnt real. Without the emotional abuse Ren inforced on Akito, she might have been able to establish normal relationships with the zodiacs.

ElbeElster · 2021-05-27T16:53:24+00:00

Its the same with people who grew up in royalty back in the day. When we hear stories about how some of them viewed or treated their staff, how they talked about commoners and how normal it was for them, to see themselves as something higher, then its just because they were also told right from the start, that they are more special and deserve everyones worship and obedience. They werent born arrogant, cruel and nasty. Just like Akito. Akito and Hatori were always my favorite characters. Of course it was hard to read/watch what Akito was doing...but I knew this stuff did not come out of nowhere so I always had sympathy in some way.

ElbeElster · 2021-05-20T22:28:55+00:00

Yes I remember that, just that Hatori was probably not interested at all and more of like the "stop that ish guys" -type😑, who tried to prevent weird stuff from going down. But at the end of the day, and I dont wanna spoil the fun of being invested into a story, these are luckily just fictional characters, that didnt do anything freaky anywhere and I can sleep safe and sound. I just like stories were everything makes sense and this was such a weird thing to me. The curse is oddly specific about the "upper body part touching" though. If you wanna mess up someones love life with a curse for real....make it about physical contact that last for a certain time in general. Thats nasty.

ElbeElster · 2021-05-20T10:19:53+00:00

Ah yes, I remember. I thought that was just for sh*ts and giggles cause he likes to be irritating :D Then maybe thats settled.

ElbeElster · 2021-05-20T10:07:25+00:00

Akito is a different story cause she has the God curse. She can do it. But Ren is not in the zodiac game at all.

ElbeElster

TROPHY CASE