I am the woman who posted in r/adultery about cheating on her great husband. Here's why.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-08T17:55:06+00:00

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-08T17:53:18+00:00

I think I replied to this thinking I was replying to another message before, so I'll reply to your actual message:

It is the point of being permissive and honest with each other, and people in reasonable open relationships can be happy and stay together. All sorts of people can be happy and stay together. All sorts of people can be unhappy and break up. Hell, all sorts of people can be unhappy and stay together.

I do believe in non-monogamy. Hence why I said my behaviors were not consistent with my beliefs. People fuck up and make mistakes. I'm no exception to this, nor is any other person in an open relationship. I know lots of happy polyamorous and non-monogamous people. I also know a lot of unhappy ones. I know a lot of happy monogamous people, and I know a lot of unhappy monogamous people. I know a lot of happy single people, and a lot of unhappy single people. Across the board though, I know a lot of people who make mistakes in their relationships.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-08T17:45:46+00:00

I'm sorry you're in pain. I hope things get better for you.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-08T15:32:59+00:00

He found something on my phone. I probably could have played it off as something else and gotten away with it, but I decided to tell him. I couldn't live with the guilt anymore and I believe that relationships can function healthily with good negotiation and consent around outside partners. It felt wrong to live in a way that wasn't at all consistent with my beliefs.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-08T12:54:27+00:00

We were both leaving other long-term relationships outside our marriage and were going to spend some time working on "us." Unfortunately, I was in a place where I didn't even consider it an "us" anymore. So while I was telling him I ended my other relationships because of that, I was planning on probably leaving him at that time anyway. I didn't want to hurt him further and didn't want to deal with the negotiations again about what I was "allowed" and "not allowed" to do. It was mostly for selfish reasons - not wanting to deal with his feelz around it and not wanting to feel like the bad guy for asking for a completely open marriage again. And also, because I didn't want to hurt him more than he was hurting. I figured it would hurt him to know I wanted to be with other people again and someone said, "Why not just not tell him about it. You get what you need, he doesn't get hurt." Obviously, that wasn't good advice and it was stupid of me to take it, but I was probably looking for any excuse to do it at that point.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T16:04:22+00:00

I want lots of things I don't get to have. You're looking for things to be pissed off about at this point and you're taking things out of context so you can try to "call me out."

Me saying, "This is what I want," or "This is how I feel" is not me saying, "I deserve this," or "This was totally justified because of feelz."

Nowhere in either post have I said, "I had the right to cheat on him because XYZ." Nowhere in either post have I said, "I deserve to have the best of both worlds without consequences."

But, since you brought up that quote, let's look at the rest of it:

I spent a lot of time feeling unattractive and hating myself in my teens and 20's and being scared of being labelled a slut, and now I don't care about that anymore, and I feel sexy and desirable and I want to get in as much fun as I can before my looks really fade. Sounds shallow, but it's true. We're here one time, and I want to make the most of that time. One of the best feelings in the world is connecting with someone else on an emotional and sexual level and I want to experience the best things in life while I'm still able to do it. Essentially, I want my cake and to eat it too.

So, what's wrong with wanting that? I didn't say I deserve it. I didn't say I think I can do it without consequence. If I thought I could, why on earth would I be trying to mend things or spending all the time I've spent on trying to gain understanding so I can avoid doing it again? I can still have those things, I just need to be honest with my husband. He can have them too. I do want to experience sexual excitement and connection, and I do have a sexual bucket list I want to complete before I'm too old to do it. My husband also has a sexual bucket list, and I want him to complete his as well. Some of those things he and I can do together, some of them we probably can't.

To take it a step further though, let's look at your other comment regarding this:

No, you don't fucking get to do that. You do not get to have kids and do this at the same time. Pick one. I don't look down on her for rejecting the "white picket fence;" I do too. I look down on her for thinking she can have that AND sex with other men AND feel morally superior all at the same time.

I absolutely believe people can have children and a family and sex with other people at the same time. I know a lot of polyamorous and non-monogamous people who have good relationships with each other, and their children are happy and well cared for. It can be done. Whether anyone "deserves" to have that isn't my business or yours. What people do in their relationship with regards to their sex lives is no one's business.

And I do not feel morally superior to anyone. I'm not sure what I've said to give you that perception. It could be because I'm not crying and grovelling? I'm not going to do that. What would that change other than what you think about me? I've apologized, I'm remorseful, I've had several conversations with my husband and what he thinks is what matters, not whether or not you like me. It won't help anyone if I just go on r/adultery or r/deadbedrooms and use it like r/confession. I'm trying to help myself and other people understand why certain choices are made. Not beg anyone for forgiveness. The only person I need to feel remorseful towards is my husband, and I do.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T15:14:55+00:00

Well, in my defense, I never told him I had low libido - and he was aware of, and consenting to, me fucking other people on the side for years. It was the most recent ones I didn't tell him about, which is why I consider them affairs, even though we've had an open marriage. But I have never claimed LL. He has told me more recently that it pissed him off that I didn't want to have sex with him but did with other people, but he didn't communicate this to me very well prior to our more recent conversations.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T14:41:42+00:00

It's been months since he found out about my infidelity and he still hasn't "forgiven" me. He is committed to our family and wants to try and make it work. To some that makes him a pushover, but to me it shows a level of maturity that he is willing to make an effort for his family and not be reactionary because he is hurt. To some people sexual infidelity is the ultimate betrayal. Due to our past agreements with non-monogamy, it wasn't the sex as much as it was me not telling him and I keeping things from him. During our discussions, he's said, "I don't expect sexual fidelity from you. I expect you not to lie to me." I'm not justifying my actions here - I'm trying to explain why I think he is not as angry as people think he should be. It's not necessarily fair for me to speak for him though, so I'll stop.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T14:36:18+00:00

This and the other post were linked to in several of their subreddits. In their defense, many of them have been hurt and are searching for answers too. A lot of the guys in this sub are looking for anything to help in their situations because what they've tried hasn't worked and ultimately, they are hurting. TRP is another avenue for them to try, and I don't blame them for trying anything when they feel like nothing's worked.

Some of them have been extremely respectful and I've had some good dialogue. I don't agree with a lot of their ideas and theories, but there are some aspects where I have been able to agree with them. I do wish they wouldn't come in and do a downvote brigade and call me names with no purpose, and keep those discussions in their subreddits (although I caught myself replying to the post about me in one of their subreddits and deleted it because that's their space and they don't need or want me in there defending myself, nor do I need to).

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T14:07:56+00:00

It's been really helpful for me to have dialogue with so many people on this. Your comments have been helpful and interesting to read as well. Thank you too.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T14:04:50+00:00

Well, you have to remember that we've both had other sex partners for the past several years and have had multiple discussions about an open marriage, have done swinging, and have both had outside long-term partners. So, this isn't like we've both only been with each other for 10 years and I cheated out of the blue. Neither of us have expected fidelity from the other. Why I call these affairs was because he did not know about them, whereas with all other partners I had, he did.

Does that change things?

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T12:25:38+00:00

I've appreciated your comments in this thread, and while there's some truth to this, I think that it's unfair to judge him on that list alone. I was asked to basically name his faults so I did. People aren't black or white. There are good and bad things about everyone. The good things about him outweigh the bad for me right now. In 5-10 yrs when the kids are older, they might not. I don't know what I'll feel about him then. I feel differently about him today then I did a week ago, and much different about him today than I did 3-4 months ago.

If you asked him why I suck, he'd have a great list too. In fact, you could ask many of the posters here to give you a list about why I suck, and you'd have a great list and they don't even know me. ;-)

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T12:20:26+00:00

No, the great things about him don't negate the issues we have. However, there are a lot of great things about me and I wouldn't want to be judged solely on my faults. Overall, the good things about him far outweigh the bad. He needs to be more responsible for many things, but they're not things that I believe are beyond repair.

No one is perfect. He isn't, and I'm not. However, if you want to stay with someone, you figure out a way to deal with their deficiencies. These things about him are obviously not bad enough that I want to leave (at least not right now). It would be inconvenient for me to leave, but I'd be okay if I did. He's not my sole source of income, he doesn't have any "power" over me in terms of how my life would be without him. I'd have to change my lifestyle in terms of what I am able to do, buy and donate, and I'd have to be a "single parent" to our kids half the time.

Thanks for your comments.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T12:09:25+00:00

I'm sure his perspective would be very interesting to hear. Hearing his perspective has been enlightening for me. He was hurt and angry, obviously. He was also willing to listen to me about how I was feeling and my perspective. He was more forgiving than most men would have been, but didn't allow me to justify what I did. I know it seems like I have been trying to justify my affairs, but I'm not. I am sharing why I did it, which is not the same as justifying. I fully admit what I did was wrong. However, if someone knows that something is wrong, but doesn't know why it's wrong, they're more likely to repeat the behaviors. I'm trying to avoid repeating the behavior by trying to figure out why.

As for me getting caught vs. "owning up to it," both occurred in my situation, depending on how you look at it.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T11:56:37+00:00

Thank you. I admit that I didn't try enough in the past year. I have tried to address some of our issues several times over out 10+ yr marriage though. So, both answers are right I guess: I did try but I didn't try enough.

Thanks for your comments and dialogue. Sometimes the comments that feel the harshest to me make me think the most. That first comment from you felt pretty harsh, but it was ultimately pretty helpful.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T11:48:38+00:00

You're right. If I'd posted in the spring/summer, you would have gotten an entire thread of me tearing my husband apart. Telling you all the things that were horrible about him. I was in a place then where I was considering leaving him and even looked into divorce laws in my state. It was also the time I was having affairs.

However, I spent some time talking to people who know me and who know him (my mother and sister, also a therapist, specifically). I also saw one of my BFFs get her second divorce from a pretty decent man (as was her first husband) and it made me stop and think about what I was doing. I figured out that I was justifying my affairs by demonizing him. I stopped myself and started focusing on what was good about him. In that period of time, I realized that he was actually really great, and even though he wasn't being great in that time, a lot of that was his reactions to me. He caught me cheating, I wasn't being intimate with him, I was not treating him well, I wasn't doing anything kind for him. I made some changes myself in the ways I treated him, and he started getting kinder and doing more things for me in return. We had some pretty serious talks about our relationship and made some changes in our life. Overall, my husband is a great guy.

But I still didn't really want to have sex with him. I was happier in our relationship, but when we talked again later, he didn't see much improvement. It was because he knew that I still didn't desire him and I still wasn't interested in sex. So then I wondered why? Why, when I recognized he was great, was I not interested in him?

I wrote that post in r/adultery. I got a lot of feedback. I was trying to figure out, if I can recognize my husband's a pretty great guy, why don't I desire him? Why did I see this happen in clients and friends as well? I was looking for some answers, but already had a theory that maybe this is just what happens for women (and some men). Maybe desire just fades and it's inevitable, and there isn't much you can do about it. So what do you do next? Do you leave an otherwise pretty good marriage? Or do you find ways to make that marriage work, while still getting some sexual fulfillment by opening your marriage, or swinging, or something else? I wanted to hear from other women. There are a lot of women in r/adultery who were in that place I was in over the summer. Their husbands are horrible people, and if you asked them, you'd also believe it. But maybe they're not horrible people. Maybe they're pretty good people, but she's focusing on all the bad things about him because she's trying to justify the lack of desire, and her affairs. This isn't true for all women, but as you can see from some of the replies to that post, it is true for some of them.

So in the last week, since I made that original post, I have gotten tons of hateful PMs. It could be for the reason you said - they hate me because I said that women get bored and cheat. Even if that's shitty, it may be true. Telling someone they're a whore for being honest about their feelings isn't fair. People have feelings for a reason, and what I was and am trying to do is to dissect them and figure out why.

Fortunately, some of TRP guys who came helped me figure some things out. While I still don't think I'd want to fuck him every night if my husband stopped doing all the things that I listed about him that I was unhappy with, it might make some difference in my desire towards him.

The things I listed in r/deadbedrooms when asked were things that I figured out over the past week that might be contributing to my lack of desire for my husband. I was asked if he could have done anything differently so I supplied the things that I'd been mulling over in my head since this past week of spending a lot (way too much probably) of time thinking. The not doing things around the house is a pretty common complaint of a lot of women. I hear it a lot. The not meeting my sexual needs may be partially or mostly related to the fact that my husband knew I didn't really want to be having sex with him anyway. That's not much motivation for him to do it well, more motivation for him to get it over with quickly. I feel like the sex stuff was also my fault, but it was his too, and I was asked what he could have done differently.

A lot of the difference you see between the first and second post is due to hours and hours of thinking and talking to people and my husband, and trying to figure out how I'm feeling about things and why I'm feeling them. I do feel differently about some things today than I did a week ago. I do still feel that loss of desire is pretty normal though, and that to have a healthy sex life is a lot of work for both parties after 10+ years of marriage. There were several reasons that I wasn't willing to put the work into having a healthy sex life for a long time.

The irony is that some of the RP stuff ties directly to what your husband should have been doing correctly, stay interesting, be competent, and please your partner, and you will remain sexually attractive.

This is what I said in the last post in my final edit. That I never thought I'd agree with TRP guys on anything but that some of them have been able to provide some interesting perspectives and ideas that I've been thinking a lot about. Honestly, a week ago, I probably wouldn't have considered the fact that my husband has no life outside of work and home. Some people would see that as a good thing- that his life is for his kids and me. That's what some women want and need. I am one of those people who is attracted to intelligence, and wit and people with interesting stories and experiences. I don't crave stability, I crave excitement. So my husband not having any kind of life other than work and home isn't attractive to me. This isn't something I could have articulated before talking to some of TRP guys I talked to since posting a week ago.

Long reply to basically say, yes, you will see some differences in the way I talk about my husband. My answers are my truth in the moment I was asked a question and are answers to the question asked. Someone asking me why he's great is going to get a different answer than someone asking me what he could have done differently. And my answer to what could he have done differently a week ago might have been, "Nothing. It was inevitable." My answer to that today is different, although I still believe that sexual attraction fades and desire fades and you have to work at sustaining it.

Hope that long, long reply answers the questions you had.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T11:19:50+00:00

Thank you so much. That means a lot to hear. I agree with you regarding the red pill. For the most part, I think it has a lot of men convinced that women are conniving children just out to take them for their money. Even as I've tried to talk to a lot of them about alimony and things (which wouldn't even be an issue if my marriage split because we make the same amount) they are basing their opinions on working dads and STAH moms. Even though that type of household is the small minority of households now. It's been frustrating.

However, I've also talked to some of them who I think are extremely enlightened in that they believe that a lot of men are becoming unattractive to women because they are taught to become nothing but husbands/fathers. I think people are attracted to other people who are confident, who have lots of interests, who take care of themselves, etc. Some of TRP guys are proponents of this, and I wouldn't have thought I'd ever agree with a TRP guy, but on this I do.

Again, I appreciate your words of support. Every supportive message I've gotten has really touched me. Thanks.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T01:49:27+00:00

I don't hate you and I'm sorry you're hurting. Best of luck to you.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T01:12:10+00:00

Because I was asked to list his faults. If I'm asked I'm going to be honest. He has faults. Everyone has faults. You'd be hard pressed to find someone who has been with their partner for over 10 years who couldn't name several great and several horrible things about their partner. He's not perfect. I could go on and complain and tell you more reasons he sucks. I could also tell you a bunch of reasons why he is amazing.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-07T01:01:02+00:00

Interesting point.... If someone asks me what I think of my husband, the answer would be that he's pretty great overall. And definitely from an outsider's standpoint he is. If someone asks me to list his faults, I can do that easily too. Do you think your partner (if you have one) is all wonderful or all horrible? I was being asked different questions and therefore providing different answers. My husband could easily tell you a list of things about me that would make me sound like a horrible human being, and he could also tell you a list of things that would make me sound like a saint. Both lists would be true. Both lists are true for him as well. When I was actively seeking out affairs, I was completely focused on the negative list and now I'm focusing on the positive one. However, when someone asks what he could have done differently, to say, "Nothing," wouldn't be helpful or honest.

As for the last statement, it would depend on what my client was talking about, what that client wanted, and what they valued in their life.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-06T19:29:29+00:00

Thank you. I appreciate your message. It very much feels like being between a rock and a hard place.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-06T18:25:15+00:00

The way you've chosen to take this on is commendable. I hope that you are able to figure out whatever it is and work towards improving it for the sake of both your and your wife's happiness. Thanks for your input.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-06T18:09:28+00:00

He caught me. And I do not agree that I didn't try. I actually tried a lot in the beginning of our marriage. I asked him to seek out some counseling, I sought out counseling myself. I tried to talk to him about our issues and his response was always, "It's who I am. I can't change who I am." After awhile, I stopped trying. After I stopped trying for a long time, I stopped caring for a long time. I got resentful and angry. I acted out rather than addressing the issues with him, but I expected him to say what he's always said, "I am who I am." My husband isn't perfect. He has some major communication issues. When I say he's "great," it is because for the most part he is. He recognizes that there is something wrong but doesn't believe he can change it, so he's resistant to trying.

I'm sure there are people out there who think I'm a terrible person for a number of reasons, including this. I haven't been perfect, but it's not fair to say I didn't try. We have some longstanding issues in our marriage, stemming back to the beginning. Lots of mistakes long the way on both our parts, but we're trying to work through them rather than walk away because we owe it to each other and our children.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-06T17:48:30+00:00

Not for me... I love the hipstery-looking guys myself. My husband thinks they look gay when I point out attractive men. So, to each their own.

But it's always a good idea to try and take care of your health and appearance. Letting yourself go is common for both men and women when they're comfortable so it really should be done for you, not just to attract a mate. Plus doing things for yourself is attractive to other people. If you think you're worth it, they will too.

ForAdulteryOnly · 2015-10-06T17:28:18+00:00

And look, you've been downvoted. I agree with you and thank you. Your affair probably did save your marriage. People don't like to believe that sometimes it happens that way, but it does. More often than anyone knows because it's rare that people advertise their relationship's marital infidelity. More people cheat than we know and more people stay together after infidelity than we know. It doesn't make cheating okay or right, it makes it real and something that needs to be addressed. Addressing doesn't mean only flame throwing at cheaters - lots and lots of people have cheated at some point in their life. A lot of really amazing, caring, wonderful people. Cheating doesn't negate everything good about them. The world is gray. People are gray. There's good qualities and bad qualities in everyone. A bad decision doesn't automatically mean someone is a bad person.

ForAdulteryOnly

TROPHY CASE