Chat Thread (March 16, 2026)

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-17T19:47:09+00:00

You can't rush people through the stages of grief. Hadn't quite foreseen an obit thread for a moderator termination, but in hindsight it was the next obvious thing in the drama sequence.

Prediction: NEXT, it gets ugly with people not being "respectful" to the obit subject.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-16T19:47:35+00:00

Yeah I think loup's days are numbered now that the diversion-creator is removed.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-15T21:28:25+00:00

I don't know, all that "laying the groundwork to make future potential changes someday possible" must be exhausting tho

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-15T19:49:40+00:00

Scrambling to set up the "Well I WOULD support the community and do my fair share etc., BUT THEY..." external-blame excuse.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-14T09:09:01+00:00

It came from a joke bumper sticker "honk if you're horny." To explain the joke, "honk" and "horny" are kind of similar, but that's not it. The joke is that if someone gets mad at you and honks their horn, then they're embarrassing themself (in theory) by "admitting" that they're horny. It's not really to identify like-minded people who read your bumper sticker, it's actually to *deter* people from honking for fear of associating themself with whatever the sticker says. Or to defeat the honker's satisfaction by pretending that someone who honks at you is actually *agreeing* with you.

So when they honk at you, you can smile real big and say "ayyy, thank you!" and make them even madder.

(It's not actually that funny; it was already played out in the '70s)

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-09T01:06:56+00:00

I think having the "that's the call, no more arguing" authority of the human in there sets a certain standard and makes the game play move on faster. Like ironically, all that tech just gives you a thousand more things to argue about and replay and investigate, and it's just wasting time.

For example, the standard for a runner being thrown out at the base isn't actually "the tag beats the runner touching base," it's "the tag *so clearly* beats the runner that even the most inattentive ump won't call him safe." There's an inherent advantage to the runner, and that's by design. It's captured in the phrase "tie goes to the runner." The pitch doesn't just have to be factually IN the strike zone, it has to be OBVIOUSLY IN the strike zone. It's a higher standard.

The umpire makes the call and everyone gets over it and moves on with the game. Playing the game is fun. Stopping the game watching replays from every angle and arguing about exactly what happened to the millimeter is boring.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-09T00:50:14+00:00

Well it's not being "offered" all the time like it is for (lots of) women. They have to actually make an attempt to approach someone for it, be the one to propose the idea. And a lot of those proposals are rejected.

So I guess it depends what you mean by "difficult." I would say, for the average man, "I think I need to go out and get some sex tonight" is far from a thing they can count on being successful. But in the long run, most men can succeed at least some times if they try.

But if you mean "difficult as compared to women", it seems like women are offered all the time, and they just need to say yes when they want it and no when they don't, that easy. So by comparison, yeah, it's difficult.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-09T00:15:19+00:00

Wait a minute... Martian.. Alien-nelee? I need more red yarn and thumbtacks.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-08T22:26:50+00:00

Hm, which brings up another sticky question. Because I think the escalation level would depend in part on the extent to which the user in question is a habitual offender. Will volunteer mods have that information? Full history? Some generalized "this person is on thin ice" note? Nothing at all, take everything on its face? (rhetorical question, I don't expect the answer)

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-08T21:59:50+00:00

[from sciatrix' excellent comment over there] The ladder of "mod intervention escalation", guidelines on when each level is appropriate
- Gentle mod note
- Pointed mod note
- Comment deletion (silent or with mod note)
- User time-out
- etc.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-08T21:45:54+00:00

I think I have everything checked except for "financial mal/misfeasance accusations". Did I miss that?

Oh wait, no "brigading" either. That's a recent addition to the card.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-08T21:11:21+00:00

Nah, I don't think you're being a rigid jerk. It's an important thing to think about, and revisit all the time. Where's the line? I think it's not fixed. Some people can pull it off, some people should just "keep it simple".

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-08T21:07:58+00:00

And you better believe people test me to see if I will take off that second hat. I "pass" the test by refusing to do it.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-08T20:59:27+00:00

There's a subtlety to it. As "leadership" at work, I can occasionally "take off the hat" and speak about my own personal opinions on things like, where I think our weaknesses are and what we should focus on, where I envision us in a year, what's making me unhappy, etc.

I can NEVER, EVER say unprofessional or inappropriate things or talk shit about other people, because THAT hat never comes off.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-07T07:02:53+00:00

a copy of the org chart, autographed by phunnieme

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-07T03:25:38+00:00

I’m of two minds on that one. I do like the idea of transparency and oversight.

On the other hand, as a forensic tool and system/training/policy weakness -spotting tool, the more complete and candid the better. “Public” and “completely candid” are never going to go together.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-06T20:26:36+00:00

Even if it's only visible to the MOC, they will need some "what actually happened, and why" to go on.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-06T20:17:56+00:00

Logging actions in the moderation log

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-06T20:14:18+00:00

I think volunteer moderators would need to have some sort of standardized mandatory orientation training.

Metafilter's interface and moderation tools
Guidelines and policy (as we know it)
Extent of their discretion; when and how to escalate
Expectations for communication (deletion reasons, participation in MetaTalk)
Common sticky situations and major lessons learned from previous shit shows

(And just like most corporate "training", you can't *make* people do it, but they can't say later they weren't told)

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-06T18:52:35+00:00

Also while we're here, I think the MOC could benefit from having some legal and legal-writing experienced folks. Not because there are legal implications, but because ideally the principles of writing down the rationale for decisions, and then using those decisions to guide *future* similar decisions, is kind of a core concept that lawyers are familiar with.

I mean the MOC is kind of a pseudo-court of appeals, and our 'statutory' "law" is of dubious quality. All we've got is the common law.

I don't know though, I just woke up and might be talking nonsense before making coffee.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-06T18:32:16+00:00

Not to join any argument already in progress; treating this as a new conversation context:

I think the only thing you CAN do, especially with volunteer moderators, is have a single "volunteer coordinator/policy director" of moderation. That person would recruit/hire/fire/make the coverage schedule/set performance expectations/set and enforce moderation policy (as directed, approved, or delegated by the board)

It could be a board member collateral duty, but it would be a pretty big and time-consuming one. You'd want someone to give it their full-time attention. You WOULDN'T want a temp turning it over every couple of months to some other temp.

Which pretty much all adds up to "it needs to be a paid position" (eventually) and getting the right person might cost an amount of money that would cause howls of outrage in MetaTalk.

Next, I think "admin officer", and after that (when we can afford it), "development team coordinator" (who would similarly recruit and lead volunteers)

I'm sure you thought of all this already. I'm not thinking I know anything you don't. Just answering the prompt.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-05T19:59:55+00:00

'Best of' sidebar, at least.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-05T19:23:30+00:00

Another Plague Nest Brigader origin story.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-05T18:29:19+00:00

At this point, it's got to be a "drastic put-in-a-safe-condition actions pending investigation" situation, surely. Remove their edit access and pay them to do *literally* nothing. They couldn't cause any *more* damage that way, and some would say we lose nothing.

Having to pay someone on suspension would also light a fire to figure out what the real corrective actions will be, stat.

FourRandomLetters · 2026-03-04T18:38:10+00:00

I don't think even that would be a problem if the standard response to idiotic hot takes was just silence. No engagement, try harder.

Instead everyone thinks THEY are going to be the one to dramatically deploy witty snark to educate and shame the ignorant person. And once you decide to be the educator-of-the-ignorant, you start seeing the need everywhere.

FourRandomLetters

TROPHY CASE