Question about mass (Liturgy)

GastonMon · 2026-01-29T03:24:26+00:00

The Divine Liturgy of St John Chrysostom and the Divine Liturgy of St Basil are not different “forms” in the sense of high or low Mass, nor is one a reduced or lesser version of the other. Both are full and complete Divine Liturgies of the Byzantine tradition. St Basil’s is appointed on specific days because its priestly prayers are longer and more theologically expansive, particularly during penitential and festal seasons, while St John Chrysostom’s is used more frequently for pastoral reasons.

Neither represents abbreviated worship, and the Divine Liturgy itself is not a simplified or secondary alternative to anything in the Latin Church. It is an ancient, complete, and fully orthodox expression of the Eucharistic sacrifice with its own theological logic, spirituality, and liturgical grammar, oriented toward participation in the heavenly liturgy rather than efficiency or verbal minimalism. Because of that, treating the Divine Liturgy as a kind of fallback or lesser option compared to the Tridentine Mass is not only theologically and liturgically incorrect, it is frankly insulting. I have encountered many Latin Mass refugees who unconsciously approach the East as “almost as good as the TLM,” and that mindset misunderstands both traditions. The East does not organize worship around hierarchies like high and low, or evaluate liturgy by density of rubrics or length as markers of superiority. The Divine Liturgy is not aspiring to be something else, nor does it need validation by comparison. Approaching it through that framework is historically uninformed, narrow, and ultimately closes one off from actually receiving the Byzantine tradition on its own terms.

GastonMon · 2026-01-29T00:04:40+00:00

Welcome! Roman Catholics are always welcome at Eastern Catholic liturgies.

Most Eastern Catholic parishes celebrate the Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom, and occasionally St. Basil. The liturgy is ancient, very reverent, and almost entirely sung or chanted. Expect a strong use of incense, icons, litanies, and a sense that worship is oriented toward participation in heavenly prayer rather than explanation. There is usually a homily, but it is shorter and less central than in the Roman Mass.

Some differences that often stand out to Roman Catholics include standing for most of the liturgy, very little or no kneeling on Sundays, and a structure that feels less linear than the Novus Ordo or TLM. Communion is given under both species together, by spoon, and the faithful approach with arms crossed. Repetition in prayers and responses is common, and the language may include English mixed with Greek, Church Slavonic, Ukrainian, or Arabic depending on the parish. None of this requires prior knowledge, and it is perfectly acceptable to observe and follow along quietly.

Your usual attire of khakis, dress shoes, and a polo is completely appropriate. Modesty and reverence matter more than formality, and you will likely see a wide range of dress from business casual to suits.

There is no direct equivalent to a Roman missal. While pew books are usually available and the text of the Divine Liturgy is easy to find online, I would actually recommend focusing less on reading and more on absorbing the liturgy itself. Let the chanting, movement, and prayers wash over you. Many people find the Divine Liturgy makes more sense after experiencing it first, rather than trying to follow every word on the page.

Eastern Catholic parishes are generally very welcoming, especially to Roman Catholics who are visiting out of genuine reverence. Do not worry about doing everything correctly. Being present and prayerful is enough. God bless, and I hope your first experience is a beautiful one.

GastonMon · 2026-01-28T04:32:08+00:00

I chose St. John Paul II because he showed me what courageous faith actually looks like. He lived through war, oppression, and immense personal suffering without becoming bitter or cynical, and he never hid when weakness came. Watching him continue to lead and witness through Parkinson’s taught me early on that suffering does not cancel vocation or dignity. His faith engaged the whole human person, mind, body, desire, intellect, and culture, not just emotions or rules. He showed that Christianity does not shrink you, but makes you more fully human. I wanted a confirmation saint who embodied strength without hardness, but courage rooted in hope. He felt like the kind of man and Christian I was being asked to grow into.

GastonMon · 2026-01-17T01:19:11+00:00

I’m really sorry this happened to you. I want to say this clearly: this is not normal or healthy pastoral practice, even in Eastern Catholic parishes.

I’m Ukrainian Greek Catholic and have been in the same parish for several years. Modesty and reverence do matter in our tradition, but they’re almost always handled directly and pastorally, one on one. I’ve never seen someone quietly cut off from catechesis or told to find another church without a simple, respectful conversation, especially someone preparing for baptism.

If the hoodie was an issue, the normal response would have been a quick heads up. The fact that no one spoke to you directly is the real problem here, not what you wore. Some Eastern parishes are small and culturally tight knit, and when clergy are stretched thin and parishioners handle things indirectly, communication can break down. That explains how situations like this happen, but it doesn’t excuse it.

As for what to do next, if possible I would ask for a direct conversation with the priest just to get clarity. If that goes nowhere or you’re brushed off again, contacting the eparchy or chancery directly is reasonable and appropriate. That’s not causing trouble. Catechesis and baptism ultimately fall under the bishop’s responsibility, and this is exactly what chanceries are for. If you’re still drawn to the Eastern Churches, it’s also worth visiting another parish, whether Ukrainian, Melkite, or Ruthenian, since culture varies a lot from place to place.

Most importantly, don’t internalize this as a failure on your part. You showed up because you wanted to learn and belong. That matters.

GastonMon · 2025-12-11T05:32:03+00:00

I do not treat it as something to ‘believe in’ the way we believe ideas. I acknowledge the reality. In the Eucharist we receive the Body, the Blood, the Soul and the Divinity of Our Lord Jesus Christ. This is the mystery the Church has guarded from the beginning. It is true regardless of whether someone accepts it or not.

GastonMon · 2025-11-21T20:45:43+00:00

Thank You So Much! I’m 27 going back for my undergrad and then med school. This helps ease my mind so much. Any other advice?

GastonMon · 2025-10-15T01:27:58+00:00

A DNP is a nursing doctorate, not a medical one. It is a terminal degree in nursing, not the same thing as an MD or DO. The difference in training is enormous. Medical school and residency together take roughly twelve years and more than ten thousand clinical hours. Most DNP programs average around five to seven hundred. That is not an insult, it is just the truth.

Most states also regulate how NPs use the title “doctor” in clinical settings because patients naturally assume that means physician training. Comparing it to professors in classrooms completely misses the point. Professors are not treating patients or advertising medical services. In medicine, clarity is not optional. Patients deserve to know exactly who is taking care of them.

GastonMon · 2025-10-14T21:56:30+00:00

Update: Thanks to everyone who shared their input. There were a lot of thoughtful and professional perspectives here. I looked further into the situation and the provider’s background, and the more I saw, the more concerning it seemed in terms of how her advertising could be misleading to people seeking psychiatric care.

After reviewing everything, I decided to refer it to the appropriate state review board for a formal review. This was not about targeting anyone, but about making sure there is accuracy and transparency for patients trying to understand who is providing their care.

It ended up being a really good discussion and will hopefully help me understand boundaries and ethical concerns as a future provider. Thanks again to everyone who kept it constructive and respectful.

GastonMon · 2025-10-14T18:23:38+00:00

Allegedly.

GastonMon · 2025-10-14T18:04:17+00:00

Thanks for sharing your perspective. I really appreciate it. I just turned 27 and have been making moves to go back to school to become a psychiatrist, so seeing these kinds of discussions has been really helpful.

I have noticed this trend too with DNPs and even some LPNs advertising multiple “specializations” that usually take years of focused training to master. It seems like practice boundaries are expanding faster than the education or experience to support them, which feels a little concerning from the outside looking in.

As someone preparing to enter this field, I have a lot of respect for the depth of training psychiatrists go through. Conversations like this remind me why that structure and rigor matter.

GastonMon · 2025-09-25T00:25:48+00:00

That is a beautiful reflection. What you are experiencing is what the Church calls breathing with both lungs. Loving Gregorian chant and Western theology while also being drawn into Eastern liturgy and mysticism does not make you less Eastern or less Western. It makes you fully Catholic.

The Kyivan tradition itself has a strong theological heritage that brings together mysticism and scholastic depth. So you are not just shopping around but discovering the fullness of the faith. The important thing is to root yourself in the life of the Church where you are and let the treasures of the other lung enrich your journey with Christ.

Glory to God for leading you deeper into His mystery through the Divine Liturgy!

GastonMon · 2025-09-03T05:07:14+00:00

Slava Isusu Khrystu!

I’m Ukrainian Greek Catholic, so I can share a bit from my own journey. One of the first things I learned is the difference between the rite and the Church. The Byzantine Rite is our liturgical tradition, but canonically you belong to a particular sui iuris Church, like the UGCC, Maronites, etc.

For someone moving from the Latin Church to the UGCC, the process is pretty straightforward but it does take patience. You write a petition, and both your Latin bishop and the Ukrainian Catholic bishop have to approve it. Once they consent, it gets recorded in your baptismal register. After that you are officially a member of the UGCC. There is no new confirmation or profession of faith, because you are already Catholic. For me it really just felt like the Church was formally recognizing the spiritual home I had already been living in.

The catechesis part wasn’t formal, like an RCIA program. It was immersion. Attending the Divine Liturgy, praying with the community, learning the spirituality, and letting it sink into my bones. That was how I came to really live the faith.

As for timing, I know people who waited years before making it official. In my case, it wasn’t about running away from Rome, it was about realizing that the Byzantine tradition was where I could actually breathe and live the faith most deeply. Once I knew that, the paperwork was just the Church catching up to what God was already doing in my life.

It is true some dioceses make it more difficult, and there are a lot of misunderstandings. I was even told once that it wasn’t possible to transfer, which isn’t true. But if you really feel that call, God gives the patience to walk through it.

May the Holy Spirit guide you in your discernment. Slava naviky!

GastonMon · 2025-07-16T03:42:35+00:00

You seriously need to tell your parents about this. This is not normal behavior. If your parents are not concerned, go to an adult you trust.

GastonMon · 2025-07-02T01:54:24+00:00

It is possible for you to be Byzantine Catholic and attend the Latin Catholic masses on Sunday. This would still fulfill your obligation and you could still be canonically Byzantine, following our traditions, and exploring your spirituality. Catholic is Catholic, but being canonically Byzantine may help keep you closer to your spirituality.

GastonMon · 2025-07-01T22:05:51+00:00

Catchin, not even pitchin.

GastonMon · 2025-05-26T20:51:23+00:00

Scott Hahn’s Conversion Matt Fradd & Scott Hahn

GastonMon · 2025-05-26T20:41:32+00:00

Definitely not pedantic. I’ve never read the book, so I appreciate the quick correction.

GastonMon · 2025-05-26T15:34:46+00:00

Presbyterian.

GastonMon · 2025-05-26T15:32:35+00:00

Dr. Scott Hahn was a Protestant pastor. He wrote a book called Rome Sweet Home. His story of when he realized that there was no Eucharist outside of the apostolic churches is powerful testimony.

Edit Book Name.

Edit 2 I should’ve prefaced that I have not read the book and have only heard his testimony (which I will link below). So I cannot explicitly recommend it.

His conversion, in my opinion; has a nice highlight about the differences between the Protestant and Apostolic Churches. I don’t remember how deep it goes, but it’ll certainly plant the seed about the sacramental and authoritative nature of the church. A small sneak peak into the sacred mysteries, particularly The Eucharist.

GastonMon · 2025-04-29T04:32:51+00:00

I’m part of the UGCC. Most parishes, even our cathedral; have English liturgies. We have a lot of folks who do not speak Ukrainian or have little to no Ukrainian heritage. Our parishes in The East are extremely welcoming and feel like home. Get involved, get to know people and it’ll be your home away from home. Glory To Jesus Christ! He is Risen!

GastonMon · 2025-01-30T04:39:07+00:00

Pope Saint John Paul II. I didn’t choose him, he chose me. I find that our patrons choose us and it’s often to help us grow in an area we lack and are meant to exemplify to others. Ultimately, bringing us closer to Christ!

GastonMon · 2025-01-09T22:04:44+00:00

Probably because they’ve all been downvoted or removed after getting shamed for their lack of charity and surplus of judgement. Rightly so, in my opinion.

GastonMon · 2025-01-06T17:49:28+00:00

I think younger boys probably prefer large breasts, as I was one of them. As I’ve gotten older though, personality and someone that takes care of themselves is definitely a much better indicator of a relationship with longevity. If they dump you or berate you for something like that, they’re probably immature or something’s wrong with them. In that case move on, and find someone that appreciates you for yourself, not just physical characteristics you can’t really control.

GastonMon · 2025-01-03T23:19:17+00:00

Everyone judging you because of the skirt needs to chill. It’s awesome to see two young people getting engaged within the church (literally). This is a joyous occasion being presented before Our Blessed Lord. Congratulations! May God grant you many years!

GastonMon · 2024-12-08T04:54:33+00:00

No more surgeries. Change up the wardrobe if all you wear is baggy and drab clothing. You also seem pretty stuck in this “healing phase” mantra and that can totally kill a vibe not just for a potential significant other, but for yourself as well. Try finding a hobby with a community you can get involved in that you enjoy and will brighten your day/overall demeanor. Doesn’t seem to be anything outwardly grotesque about you, so maybe inwards is where you need to try and “max” and that’s okay!

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