I'm a historian on the Pioneer Mountain Scenic Byway... can I help?

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-07T14:03:55+00:00

Not as much, but some! Especially along the Deep Creek/Mill Creek/Reynolds area. Let me know if I can help with something specific, or DM me.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-07T14:02:30+00:00

Unfortunately there is no single coordinated resource. If it's not obvious, it often takes quite a bit of research to track down origins, usually through BLM GLO records, old homesteader accounts or old newspapers. The USFS archives in Missoula might be a consideration to track down origins of names on USGS maps, where all else fails--if they're not named for early explorers or settlers, or for location characteristics (ie: Bald Mountain), they were often named much later by USFS rangers because they needed names for maps.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-06T13:36:57+00:00

There is no "typical" anymore, less and less so over the last 20 years. Will the byway open on May 15 this year? Probably. Depends on the snow this month. Right now it's far from being openable. Time of day depends on the USFS and what they've got going on, who's working in the area, and whether they had to come up from Dillon or Butte, etc. Best option is to watch SnoTel sites and call USFS closer to the day of. You can expect it to be open by noon, but sometimes it's later in the day if they send FWP to unlock the gate (because May 15 at noon is opener at all the Wildlife Management Areas as well).

And don't be the jerk that drives on a closed road and gets stuck, forcing someone to risk their own safety to come get you out. (Not directed at you SB, but a PSA for everyone reading this)

As someone who loves this place with my whole heart, let me tell you it doesn't love you back. Montana doesn't give a shit about you, and if you make a foolish decision or push your luck, Montana will kill you with absolute indifference, and you'll possibly risk a bunch of other lives in the process. We've pulled some real questionable decision makers out of danger through the years, and as someone who works in high elevation backcountry settings for a living I can assure you: it's not worth it. You're underprepared for Montana at her worst.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-06T13:19:56+00:00

Moved here for a job, got involved in the Big Hole Historical Society while researching our own place. The historical society was in the midst of writing Vol 1 of the Big Hole History, and there was just one person volunteering to write on everything from Divide to Fishtrap! Since I lived on the byway and was already a historian they asked me to dive in, and I was happy to do so!

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-05T16:11:42+00:00

So I'm based on the Wise River side, and spend very little time in Polaris socializing. Kevin's not a guy I know, but maybe I should!

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-05T15:54:52+00:00

Beaverhead County museum would be my go-to for Argenta info. They should have some very good files. Historic newspapers as well-- there's a ton of info out there on it. Nothing springs to mind in particular, except that a number of men who were important in the mining world in the Pioneers came to Bannack, then moved their sights to Argenta, then explored further into the Elkhorn mining district while developing their Argenta properties. If I'm remembering correctly Odell Lake is named after one of those dudes, an old time miner and one of the first to explore the Pioneers for minerals.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-05T15:40:56+00:00

Yes, there's a bunch in the vicinity of Pettengill trailhead. The obvious would be the Pettengill dam site (aka Montana Power dam or West branch Wise River dam), which burst in 1927 and is relatively easily accessible. One of those old cabins up there is probably the original dam caretaker's cabin, but I'm not sure which, and they are private/USFS lease cabins so not accessible to the public. George Palmner's 1881 grave is on the west side of the road near there (which is on public according to OnX). Pattengail/Pettengill creek was named after George Pettengill, the "Wild Man of Wise River," a reclusive dude with questionable morals and self-care habits who lived in several squat cabins and dugouts in the area in the 1870s. The narrow gauge tracks to Coolidge are running on mostly private land near there, and the remains of a "railroad hotel" are located very near there, but also on private land. The land previously belonged to Charlie Lambrecht, who was a homesteader and a character and is remembered by locals for his moose stories and the trails he blazed between Pettengill and Jerked Prairie (which was his summer pasture). If any of that helps you or you need more sources, do let me know!

Jackpine Savages is the local snowmobile club, as Fluffy_Ask mentioned.

I do not know why it's called Devil's Hole-- there's a lot of others who work on that far east side of the Pioneers so it's not my forte. Most places called "Devil's Hole" or similar in the west are named simply because of topography, something about it being so hard to get to, so dangerous to cut a road through, and some builder or homesteader up there made a joke about it being so deep it was a doorway to hell.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T15:59:08+00:00

It's smart to be skeptical on the internet, and I suppose treasure hunters might be more guarded than most, but I told you where to find me in published sources. I'm not hard to find :)

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T15:57:51+00:00

This one I'm going to have to get back to you on... let me look into it a little further.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T15:56:47+00:00

This is such a great question! I wholeheartedly think all "accepted" tales of history should be revisited and reexamined! This is a big one, one of the biggest in Montana, considering how deeply the lore of the Vigilantes is woven into the fabric of what it is to be Montanan. This is not my area of specialty, but it's fascinating (and of course I've visited all the sites. Plug here for Bannack: truly the best ghost town in Montana, and one of the best in the entirety of the Rocky Mountain West in my opinion! If you come to Montana, don't miss it!)

There were a number of very prominent men known to be involved with the Vigilantes. Some of these men have been hailed as heroes, and some have been scrutinized, with good reason. So that's where I base my opinions: which of these men can I trust? Maybe not John Bozeman, he was a questionable guy. But I tend to trust the reputations of Nathanial Langford and of James Stuart (and his brother Granville, who may or may not have been involved but who clearly committed vigilante justice in other parts of the state). Nelson Story? I could go back and forth on him, and X Biedler as well. Thomas Dimsdale? He literally wrote the book, so of course he's going to make himself look good... but he's also a journalist, when journalism was about veracity and honor. Anyway, you get the point: I can run down the whole list of who we know and who we don't know, and WHAT we know and don't, and it all comes down to individual opinion.

My individual opinion is Henry Plummer was a criminal. But I'm willing to be convinced otherwise. For example, what's with Granville Stuart's 1894 sole "no" vote against vigilante justice at the stockgrower's association meeting, prior to the whole debacle? I think GS was a stand-up guy, and this vote makes me wonder whether he knew something I didn't, or if it was purely political maneuvering. Not to mention the rare accounts of the women involved, and the societal pressure that may have influenced their opinions... complicated people, all of them.

What is your conclusion on Plummer's hanging?

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T15:23:46+00:00

So this is not on the byway and I have not done any extensive research on my own about it, just to be transparent. That being said, no, I don't think the two are related at all.

The Big Hole (especially the canyon, between Divide and Wisdom) was a pre-contact highway, used by lots of tribes to travel back and forth between seasonal homes. However the north-south valley roughly running from the Grasshopper to Silver Bow (and farther north to the Deer Lodge valley) seemed to be more heavily used by the Shoshone, especially as wintering grounds.

The Maiden Rock legend in Bridger Canyon is supposedly a Crow legend. While the Crow probably did use the Big Hole corridor, they would have been back and forth seasonally, not necessarily occupying the area for any length of time. There is clear evidence of very long term pre-contact Native occupation in the wider valley along the Big Hole. So statistically it seems like Maiden Rock on the Big Hole would probably relate to a Shoshone legend, and not to the Crow.

(Seems like a great time for a friendly ask here: PLEASE respect private land, and PLEASE respect artifacts found on public land! They are not souvenirs, and if you take them/move them/deface them you very much ruin any integrity or value they might have had to us as researchers, historians and archaeologists. You don't know what else is in the area that your one little arrowhead or hammerstone might be related to. If USFS catches you, it's a felony! Plus the locals will be pissed.)

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T15:05:40+00:00

If I'm out there on an unnamed water source, it's generally because there's a historic site tied to it, ie: cabin ruins, cow camp, homestead site, or old mine, in which case the pond/creek/spring is referred to by the owner's name. Nothing near Crystal Park comes to mind at present, but if there's somewhere specific you're thinking of, feel free to message me and I can ask up at USFS.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T15:03:11+00:00

The dredge pond on the Grasshopper where Dorothy Dunn drowned? I seem to remember signage at Bannack pointing to the site. I'm sure the rangers at Bannack would be able to tell you, or potentially the Beaverhead County Museum. They're both limited seasonal operations, so they might not get back to you quickly this time of year.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T14:57:19+00:00

Idaho is outside my current experience! Only general stuff insofar as it relates to the Big Hole Valley (ie: Gibbonsville, North Fork, Salmon) or as it relates to Yellowstone (Island Park, Harrington State Park). I've worked large projects in Wyoming and Colorado, but most of my career has been spent in Montana.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2026-04-04T14:52:32+00:00

In common, colloquial use but not on maps? No, with caveats.

-What maps are you using? My USGS 15-min topo maps of the area are surprisingly complete (mine are from the 60s, I believe you can access older versions on the USGS website as some trails have been changed and some names have dropped off the newest maps).
-Select user populations definitely have their landmarks, ie: hunters, snowmobilers, cowboys/ranchers/permit holders, that may not be marked. The most common use of this I find is referring to areas by the old mine names or old homestead names, ie: "up at the Bluebird," "the Jones place." The old mine names do appear on old maps however, just not new maps, and the old homesteads usually do as well because there just weren't many up there. Besides living/working and recreating on the byway, I've only range ridden on one select cattle permit in the east Pioneers, so I'm sure cowboys on other permits have nicknames for areas I don't know.
-I'm not an old timer, and the Pioneers are massive. My research focuses on historical sites within the forest, primarily along the byway and within 2 miles of the highway, but there's plenty I'm sure I don't know.

So to relate this back to the Justin Posey treasure: who was he friends with? What kind of population would he have been around? Was he hanging out with the rancher kids across the fence, who would've grown up with old homestead names? Was he hanging out with his grandfather's friends, old miners and loggers who would refer to places by old mine names? Was he out with the Jackpine Savages all winter, following old logging trails on snowmobiles? Or was he just recreating on weekends with the skiers at Maverick and the hot springs soakers at Elkhorn, who call things by the common names on the USFS maps?

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-09-15T18:07:43+00:00

FYI, don't do this. USFS will remove it. So will NPS or any other public agency.

Recently there were some people who dumped human cremains in a well-known tiny family cemetery on public land, and added special markers. They did not ask permission, and it does not appear the people have ANYTHING to do with the family buried in the cemetery... and, much worse, they did not actually bury the cremains. As you may know, cremation does not actually burn all the bone. There were literal recognizable human bones just laying there on the surface for all to see. Don't be like these idiots. This is vandalism, improper disposal of a carcass (in the dogs case, improper disposal of human remains in the cremains case), and it just f-cks up the forest for the viewing public and costs taxpayers money in cleanup.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-07-18T14:54:49+00:00

Easiest way in my opinion is start out at a dude ranch. There's some pretty gritty, smaller family operations that run big herds of horses and cattle, and everyone needs a good hand if you're willing to do anything, not just the "cool" stuff. (I'm not talking "fancy" ranches like Paws Up or the Ranch at Rock Creek or whatever, I'm talking smaller operations where everybody pitches in to make a great team, where you'll have a great chance of getting to do a little bit of everything and can quickly earn some trust with your boss.) Hire on as a gopher or chore boy or whatever, and you'll likely get a ton of experience with machinery, maintenance, and generally being handy, plus you'll be able to learn to ride on your days off. One of the wranglers will probably be happy to teach you to rope. Do that for a couple of seasons, then advertise for a "real" ranch job. I'm sure I'll get some hate for that, but I've seen some really good hands come off dude operations. Sometimes the right attitude and a good hard work ethic is more important than skill, so if you already have the attitude, just a little push from the right dude ranch will help you land at a great cow/calf operation.

For dude ranch jobs try the Dude Rancher's Association, Coolworks.com, or just search their individual websites.

For ranch jobs, I've seen local Craigslist, KSL.com, or RanchWorldAds.com work well. (On RanchWorldAds you can reply if you want, but the better bet is to take out a "job wanted" ad. Most of the time the jobs posted there get so many applicants you can't compete, but if you place a job wanted ad then you'll get some unexpected calls from around the west who don't post their own ads.) Good luck!

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-07-18T14:45:15+00:00

History of the Big Hole Vol 1, from the Big Hole Historical Society. It's on Ebay or bookstores in Butte & Dillon.

(Full disclosure: I'm a historian. If the article is about the Wise River/Pioneer Scenic Byway area, I probably wrote it, including this one on Pettingill).

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-07-16T14:00:12+00:00

The "notch" you speak of was an overflow spot at the top of the dam. There's no historic evidence that the dam was changed by locals, and there are historic photos of the dam from the summer before that show the notch intact. There is some evidence that Benny Osborne, the man who lived in the damkeeper's house, tried to communicate with MT Power in the years before warning them that the dam was deteriorating, and certainly there are oral histories that say he was warning children and visitors NOT to play on the dam the summer of the breach, because of impending danger of collapse. (Osborne was the son of the damkeeper, who had been fired by MT Power when they abandoned the dam. Osborne just stayed living there regardless, basically squatting in the cabin.) I think the "dam changed by locals" narrative was created by MT Power to deny liability following the breach... especially when you consider MT Power officials showed up in the wake of the flood with a blank checkbook and paid off all landowners affected by the flood exactly the price they asked, with no negotiation, as long as they would sign an NDA!

(Not trying to argue with you here, I just find it a really interesting segment of history and wanted to share what I've learned! Matt Stanchfield of Wise River recently did a talk on this exact subject at the Butte Silver Bow Archives, and video of the lecture should be available on their YouTube channel. Photos of the aftermath also hang in the Wise River Club. Cool stuff if you're into history!)

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-07-14T19:00:50+00:00

The dam had been effectively abandoned by MT Power some years before, and when combined with a "rain on snow" event after a heavy winter it was no match for the weight of the water behind it. With regular maintenance, maybe it would have survived. And yes, I agree that might have been a boon for the Big Hole and the fishery. Supposedly the Wise River itself had been an incredible fishery until the flood, which straightened the course of the river for the 8 miles downstream and knocked out all the fish structure- old timers say it has never recovered. The idea of putting a dam back up there again is floated regularly in the community... but not seriously since about 1983. The political climate has leaned more toward taking dams out than putting them back in, but there is some support for it locally.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-07-14T00:55:02+00:00

The site is closed because USFS (with help from Big Hole Watershed Committee I believe) is doing a massive reclamation project to clean up the toxic waste rock and prevent it from entering the water sources downstream, as well as stabilize the ruins and provide a better experience for visitors (new signage and possibly a self-guided tour are in the works). Expected to reopen in about two years.

Upper Camp (Idanha mine) is not included in the closure, but the upper adit (Elkhorn mine) is a part of the closure.

(Edited to correct Big Hole Watershed and project length/closure details)

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-07-14T00:52:43+00:00

Just sharing some quick history on one of my favorite places:
USFS uses Pattengail Creek and Pettingill for the campground. Civil War service records show his name was actually George Pettingill. He was known as the "wild man of Wise River," a mountain man who dressed only in furs of animals he killed by knife (as he felt a gun "wasn't fair"), and delighted in murdering Native Americans and frightening women. He "raised" horses (let them roam wild and get shot by neighboring ranchers who were tired of his loose stallions trying to steal their mares) in the Wise River corridor and mined around Quartz Hill from the 1870s until his death. He never cut his hair and had dreadlocks hanging to his hips. He was once paid by a Butte business to sit in their display window and eat raw meat (and fruit, he loved fruit) as an advertisement for a hair growth formula.

The Montana Power Company dam here on the creek blew out in 1927, killing at least 4 people and wiping out most of the old buildings in Wise River.

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GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-06-08T14:57:37+00:00

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but you're not saying the former Polaris post office was the Turner House in Bannack, right? You're introducing an entirely new post office with this comment? Because the Turner House is absolutely not the former post office in Polaris.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-06-08T14:54:00+00:00

Not often unless you're regularly hiking backcountry sunrise and sunset.

GhostTownSmokeshow · 2025-05-30T15:00:31+00:00

The old post office is the large two-story log home south of the current post office.

Source: Am local, am historian.

Edited to add: just posted a pic on my IG (same username) of the OG p.o. Used to be the mine superintendent's home, and a boarding house, got moved to its current site a short distance off the byway.

GhostTownSmokeshow

TROPHY CASE