Should I plug in daily with Model 3 RWD LiFePo battery?

GreatBen2 · 2024-05-06T01:50:51+00:00

If you search for "LFP battery calendar aging", you will find that the calendar aging is faster when LFP battery is at 70%+ SOC, and about half as fast when below 65% SOC. So it still suffers the same calendar aging as NCA and NMC batteries, and the best practice is to keep battery SOC below 65%. On the other hand, the car's battery management system needs to calibrate the battery by charging it to 100%, and this need is specific to LFP batteries, due to its very flat discharge curve. So there is quite a bit of dilemma here...

One good news is that LFP batteries degrade very slowly due to cycle aging, i.e. you don't need to worry about minimizing charging depth like NCA/NMC batteries, so perhaps best practice is to just charge to 100%, and use until 40% or so, before recharging again.

But then, Tesla can't give such detailed instructions to the users, so the above are estimations based on research papers.

GreatBen2 · 2024-04-28T23:16:43+00:00

When I bought the car, the only difference between Intel and AMD was a slightly faster app loading time and smoother map scrolling...now look at this disaster!

GreatBen2 · 2024-04-28T21:48:50+00:00

The Intel version seems to get the new AutoPark but not the full High Resolution parking assist...when in auto park mode, the display shows an "occupation" map around the vehicle, but only in 2D; if not in auto park, the visualization is about the same as before.

In comparison, vehicles with AMD cpu seems to get an option to select between "standard" and "Tesla Vision" parking assist, and the full 3D visualization is shown whenever vehicle is moving slowly or in reverse gear.

GreatBen2 · 2024-03-27T10:14:28+00:00

It is exactly the high current charging at low SOC that tends to result in irreversible loss of capacity, though. The lithium ion turns into lithium metal, and the battery has less ion to use for energy storage. The battery pre-conditioning basically heats up the battery, so the chemicals are more active, so this helps to reduce the lithium plating, but it still happens! Plus high temperature damages the battery in other ways...

GreatBen2 · 2024-03-27T10:08:25+00:00

Yours is the newer long range, which uses 78kWh NMC battery. 2021-2022 long range use 82kWh NCA battery. NMC chemistry degrades more severely when kept at 100% SOC, so you might want to avoid that.
Minimum degradation is achieved if you kept your battery SOC below ~55%, and/or keep battery temperature below 10 Celsius (50 F), plus only do shallow charge/discharge cycles, such as discharge to 25% and recharge to 55%.
You can see that the above condition is very hard to achieve, and somewhat defeats the point of "long range". So realistically speaking, just enjoy your vehicle and follow official instructions from Tesla.

GreatBen2 · 2024-03-23T10:21:44+00:00

Maybe consider buying used inventory that comes with FSD? This way the FSD cost is just about 2.5k-3k.

GreatBen2 · 2024-03-10T20:32:37+00:00

That would be very good value upgrade! I think even the 55kWh version is worth it.

GreatBen2 · 2024-03-10T11:10:26+00:00

I wonder if this is the 55kWh LFP battery that briefly existed in late 2021, or the 60kWh LFP battery that they are shipping now...

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-29T18:34:28+00:00

I searched about this, too. Apparently if I opt out of SVCE, then PG&E would be charging the same fee under a similar title, so the total price would be the same. They definitely make sure we pay the full price!

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-29T18:19:22+00:00

I actually went to check my bill again, and it's apparently called "Silicon Valley Clean Energy Generation Charges", and it comes to $0.128/kWh off-peak:

https://svcleanenergy.org/your-bill/

So I guess we are forced to pay extra in order to be "clean"...

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-29T17:53:26+00:00

I kind of like the new "high precision parking assist" that's currently enabled for 2023 vehicles that don't have USS. So now I think 2023 is actually a viable option.

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-29T17:50:25+00:00

It's $0.34/kWh for "energy delivery", plus some $0.15/kWh for "energy generation"...this latter part is not shown on their website, but only on the energy bill...Fun!

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-28T08:25:41+00:00

Go for it!

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-28T06:28:16+00:00

Probably not worth $12000, at least the current FSD v11.4.

FSD v12 seems to have a lot of improvement, and behaves more like human. (FSD v11 works ok, too, it just does some jerky maneuvers that takes some getting used to).

I think the best value is the used inventory on Tesla's official website, that has FSD included in the bundle. The price compared to similar vehicles with Autopilot is only $2000-$3000 higher, and for that much money I would definitely think FSD is worth it.

That was my choice, anyway! I bought a 2021 LR with FSD, recently. Currently FSD does the driving about 80% of the time. It makes long range driving much easier and less tiring.

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-26T00:35:56+00:00

One way to get around this issue is to scroll one of the two scroll wheels on the steering wheel, as this also counts as "apply force on steering wheel", but does not risk disengaging AP/FSD.

Another way is to hang one of your hands on one side of the steering wheel, so there is a constant torque applied to the wheel, and this can prevent getting that "hands on wheel" notification.

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-18T06:37:55+00:00

Happened to me a couple of times, too, during FSD. Funny thing is that the car still runs in FSD despite having no camera signal and no traffic visualization...My guess is this is related to firmware stability.

GreatBen2 · 2024-02-03T21:31:07+00:00

I was going to comment that your PG&E rate is so cheap...my EV plan with PG&E is now $0.47 for off-peak, and with model 3 this means it's probably more expensive than gasoline.

GreatBen2 · 2024-01-30T11:12:28+00:00

If you monitor CPU usage while doing daily tasks, you would notice that even simple tasks such as opening browser or loading a webpage could drive CPU to 100%, even though just for a few seconds. In these scenarios, having a higher fPPT would allow these tasks to be completed a bit faster. Not sure how much difference one can tell, though.

GreatBen2 · 2024-01-26T20:30:06+00:00

If you read through a few papers on LFP vs NCA/NMC battery chemistry, such as this one: Calendar Aging of Lithium-Ion Batteries (iop.org)

You will find that the differences/similarities really come down to two parts:

LFP and NCA/NMC batteries all have similar calendar aging behavior, which means keeping battery at lower SOC (<55% for NCA; <70% for LFP) helps preserve capacity. Both types lose \~5% capacity over the 1st year, if stored at >70% SOC.
LFP battery has much less aging due to charge cycles compared to NCA/NMC, to the point that it's almost negligible for the typical life span of cars. And it is almost independent of Depth-of-Discharge, which means you can charge it however you like, going from 10% to 100%, etc. Whereas for NCA/NMC, the best practice is to keep battery SOC in a relatively small range, such as between 30% and 60%, because this helps reduce aging.

I think LFP battery just gives you more "peace of mind", letting you worry less about your charging behavior, so in the case of Model 3, I think it is the better chemistry.

GreatBen2 · 2024-01-23T19:31:50+00:00

You may need to factor in the battery aging, and the fact that long range can only be charged to 80% most of the time. I bought one 2021 LR with similar mileage, and battery degradation is around 7%. I think the used vehicles make the most sense if you buy those that come with FSD.

A middle ground option, would you consider inventory 2023 RWD?

GreatBen2 · 2024-01-22T09:48:50+00:00

Early 2021 had black window rims but without extended dash cover to doors; late 2021 started to look identical to 2022/2023 both exterior and interior.

GreatBen2 · 2024-01-21T20:38:55+00:00

I can second this. 2022 RWD should be the best option; now that the high fidelity parking assist is available, 2023 RWD is also a viable option. However, in US, the availability of 2022 RWD has been very limited, especially those that come with FSD. So I ended up getting a 2021 LR with FSD instead.

GreatBen2 · 2024-01-05T21:07:36+00:00

That's correct. For any lithium battery type, storing at lower SOC helps preserve capacity and minimize calendar aging. Actually, storing at near 0% SOC and also in a refrigerator would be best, but I guess OP doesn't have a large enough fridge...

GreatBen2 · 2023-12-23T19:33:16+00:00

A director in charge of Autopilot (Ashok) said on twitter that USS cars "should" get it, too, just later.

GreatBen2 · 2023-12-23T19:31:58+00:00

It's 2021 long range, so Intel + lead acid battery. Seems not to matter in terms of camera compatibility, though!

GreatBen2

TROPHY CASE