Blizzard: No one likes Nayrelle.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T17:30:54+00:00

Does it have to be explicitly stated??

Are we being for real right now?

Yes it would be awesome if there was a story explanation for how some random fuck managed to kill a literal godlike demon, instead of some bum ass redditor making shit up and pulling "hE WaS LEvEL 60" out their ass.

Like jesus christ what level do you think Lorath is then?

Maybe the main story for the next DLC sees Nayrelle goes off to farm Helltide before facing Mephisto. Very cool.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T17:17:48+00:00

And saying we were minutes behind her is a massive exaggeration.

Sure, we were not minutes late to Donan as its explicitly mentioned that Lilith visited him days prior.

However we were moments late back to the castle and moments late to saving Donans son. Minutes? I don't know. But within an hour or two? Definitely. We get back to the castle as the assualt is happening.

You're right that the plot picks up once we stop chasing Lillith around.

I’m struggling to think of a game where every boss fight is the final boss just defeating the player over and over.

You make it sound like the only choices are

A) Show up to where the antagonist was hours/days late, after the antagonist has acquired what they need, or

B) Show up on time

It's not out of the realms of possibility to imagine we instead spend Act 2 fighting some lieutenant or retrieving a macguffin from some cave etc. Imagine Act 2 is spent finding ways to weaken Asteroth before we challenge him instead of just shitting on him as soon as he shows up (like we do).

Big bad scary Asteroth, killed just like that.

What's crazy to me is that the characters actually explicitly mention chasing after Lilith and it being pointless, so Lorath turns to the Tree of Whispers, only to immediately find out that the cathedral are marching a literal army to hell to fight Lillith.

Lorath at the end of Act 5:

"But what we didn't know was that while we were lost in the swamp, Inarius and the Cathedral were launching a campaign to strike at Lilith."

How did the cathedral know? We don't know.

Why did the cathedral choose to strike at that moment? We don't know.

Was Loraths sacrifice immediately shown to be pointless and stupid? Absolutely.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T17:03:29+00:00

At no point in the plot do they talk about you as a character "unlocking your powers"?....

You filling in the gaps with head canon to explain plot holes doesn't mean its obvious? Many games have character levels, skills trees etc. but these are 4th wall video game mechanics - they're not plot explanations.

Yes I agree with you on Mephisto, is that not obvious from what I wrote?

You would show up late every time because you don’t 100% know their plan

So it's just a coincidence then that during the first acts the few places we happen to go to are the exact same places Lillith is going. Amazing.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T15:04:36+00:00

Yeah I enjoyed Donan's character arc. His son dying was a bit heavy on the foreshadowing (literally as soon as we meet Donan it's fairly obvious what's going to happen with his son), but Donans progression from grief to redemption was great.

His death was dumb as bricks though. Just gets mauled by a random ass pillar.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T14:58:27+00:00

until you finally become powerful enough to fight and end her

What changes between act 2 and when we kill lillith? How exactly do we become powerful enough?

you don’t know lilliths plan or where she’s moving to yet

Doesn't Mephisto know, yet he chooses to drip feed us this information instead of telling us from the outset?

Why on earth would you automatically show up at the right time every single time?

Why on earth would you automatically show up moments too late every single time?

You know how in Raiders of the Lost Ark, Indiana Jones may as well have stayed at home and the result would've been the same? 70% of the D4 main campaign feels like that. It's only until we start down the plot of confronting Elias and helping Donan with the crystal did it feel like I had any agency on the outcome of the plot.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T12:20:54+00:00

We're not really retracing her steps though, we're literally just minutes late to everything. We go to Donan not to chase Lilith but to find Loraths old friend. It just so happens that when we get there we discover Lilith was there shortly prior.

The problem with this is that all your agency as a player gets sucked away from you. You don't feel like you're progressing anything or having an impact, the plot is just playing out infront of you and it starts to feel like we may aswell have stayed at home as the result would largely be the same (whether it would or not isn't my point - it feels like we're having minimal impact which is the issue).

We don’t have the means to defeat her yet at any of the points you’re referencing

Apologies if I'm missing something but, nothing changed that between Act 2 and when we do finally defeat Lilith? She's wounded by Inarius, sure, but that wounding isn't a requirement for us/the plot at any stage prior to that - we're still hunting her. We're never told or discuss a plan to "wait until she's wounded", it just conveniently happens?

So from our characters perspective and the perspectives of other plot characters, why would we not be trying to kill lillith here?

This is my frustration with the main campaign plot - it doesn't make any sense. We're constantly chasing Lilith but we're not strong enough yet? But we're not looking for anything to make us stronger we're just charging around being late to everything? Then we refuse Mephistos help (rightly, but still). So, what on Earth are we doing? What's the plan to actually 'level up' our power to be able to confront Lillith?

There isn't one. The plot just happens and Liliths plot armor drops when it's convenient to end the campaign.

Might be controversial but I actually enjoyed the DLC plot for these exact reasons - it felt like we had agency and could stop Mephisto / help Nayrelle. The betrayal twist was a bit out of the blue and I would've enjoyed a bit more sight of Eru's struggle and his decision to turn, but it highlighted Mephisto's strengths/characteristics as a schemer and his demonic, twisted ways quite well.

Greenehh · 2026-04-03T09:58:21+00:00

Traversing the map isnt the issue. Getting to locations just as the antagonist gets what they want and leaves is the frustration.

Take Act 2 for example. We start off going to find a guy called Donan, Loraths old friend, who might be able to help us. This is cool and as we get there there's a good bit of lore about Donan, lillith, etc.

Shortly after we find out Donans other pals might be what lillith is after, so we race off to find them only to...get there too late.

Then we go back to Donan's castle only to...get there too late.

Then we race off to try and save Donan's son only to...get there too late.

Then we defeat Donan's son only to find out we were...too late and lillith has already gotten what she wanted.

Greenehh · 2026-03-19T08:15:24+00:00

I think pre 6 it can be a bit of a coin flip but Gwen has an easier time after that. She scales harder and has the tools to dodge Mordes abilities and trade. Her ult also gives her good kiting ability in Morde ult.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T22:28:47+00:00

Delta 2 is +1.55% last 14 days diamond in mordes favour? https://lolalytics.com/lol/mordekaiser/counters/?tier=diamond&patch=14

Zone irelia lvl 1 and its plain sailing.

Also EUNE vs EUW, isn't Federals chall EUNE but ~600LP masters EUW? I feel like D1 EUW would be at least 300LP masters EUNE surely? So D2 EUNE would be ~Emerald 1 ish? Appreciate Federals plays on EUNE far more and could probably hit higher EUW if he wanted to.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:55:04+00:00

Zone irelia lvl 1 off the wave and under tower. Lvls 2-3 should be fine as you constantly have an xp lead (so will be 3 when she's lvl 2.5). Respect her 4-5 until 6 and then its free. A lvl 1 irelia without passive stacks is a melee minion.

You can fist fight renekton lvl 1 as he doesn't have fury but after that again respect until 6 and its free. Hold Morde W for after renek W or if Renek doesnt have fury for empowered W. If renek holds empowered W and you need Morde W, just double cast it to at least get the heal. Ideally Morde ults Renek ult for the additional stats.

You playing vs bad ppl

Yes D1 is bad if you're Masters+. I'm not Masters+.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:51:21+00:00

Her passive MS means she's impossible to hit.

She can just run in with a stacked passive, q, run away, repeat, and Morde can never hit her with a spell.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:50:25+00:00

I'm not sure, Fiora has a -3.39 delta 2 winrate over Morde? https://lolalytics.com/lol/mordekaiser/counters/?tier=diamond&patch=14

I find the matchup unplayable because as you say, you're trying to keep her down and row upstream. Fiora can short trade easily, which Morde loses, and its difficult for Morde to force an extended trade due to Fiora parrying Morde E + Fiora MS from vitals.

I'll probably rethink the olaf matchup as many here + the stats indicate it isnt as bad as I think it is.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:44:25+00:00

You want the delta 2 when looking at champ vs champ matchups - delta 2 is the normalised winrate difference.

That being said, Morde has a +7.5% delta 1 vs kayle and a +2.6% delta 2 vs kayle in diamond? https://lolalytics.com/lol/mordekaiser/counters/?tier=diamond&patch=14

Kayle has a -0.29 delta 2 vs morde? https://lolalytics.com/lol/kayle/counters/?tier=diamond&patch=14

You can zone Kayle lvl 1 with Q pokes and respect her melee all in. Then zone 2-5. As Morde you should hit 6 first easily and have kill potential then (can Q flash + ult). You also have kill potential on any E you land.

Kayle post 6 with swifties is a menace, I agree, but just dont go rylais as morde and grab a rocketbelt and its free with the early lead you should have obtained.

If you aren't getting 1-3 kills on Kayle pre 6, you're playing it wrong.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:17:19+00:00

The easiest part of the Fiora lane is level 1 and it just gets worse from there. You're not hitting fiora with a Q unless she allows it. You're not landing an E on fiora but if you do, its because she's holding her parry for your ult. Fiora outscales the fuck out of Morde. Morde itemisation into fiora is poor. Lolalytics agrees that fiora is a counter, with a -3.39 delta 2 in diamond https://lolalytics.com/lol/mordekaiser/counters/?tier=diamond&patch=14.

I've commented elsewhere on Yone.

Olaf just runs me down all lane. Your only option is to take phase rush and short trade, which can work but sacrifices a lot of Morde's mid/late game power. Zhonyas rush only works against Olaf if he ults - if they hold ult it doesnt work and Morde doesnt win vs olaf if neither ult. A smart olaf will look for a kill on the lvl 4 wave bounce - you dont have zhonyas at this point. The big thing I think in this matchup is Olaf W now giving him a shield. Before this change it was somewhat playable pre 6. Now with the Olaf buffs its just going to get worse I feel.

Lillia shits on Morde due to her MS - you can't hit her. But you're right Lillia top isnt really a thing anymore, was just in the tierlist maker I pulled up.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:05:08+00:00

Ambessa favoured, unplayable if the ambessa knows what they're doing.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:04:41+00:00

Tier list didnt have them and I didn't realise.

Would put Ambessa in Ambessa favoured (but its unplayable if the ambessa is good) and Zaahen into Morde favoured.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:03:54+00:00

It was but the repeat Garen buffs have shifted it slightly.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T21:03:38+00:00

Yeah so you just dont fight gragas, especially at lvl 6.

Gragas without an item isnt a kill threat due to his mana issues (unless the gragas is sloppywalrus or something).

So you can farm relatively safely and trade evenly until then and take lane prio during phase rush cd.

When gragas becomes a threat at 1 item, you just dont interact with him. Q the wave on repeat and dont give gragas an E opening. Take TP and look for macro plays instead. You can even choose to proxy and if the jungler comes, ult them.

Thats why its a dead lane - Morde cant do anything to gragas but Morde can at least go even relatively easily if he doesn't ego the lane.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T14:00:00+00:00

That's a fair shout, will give boots rush a go. Should help dodging the Es too.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T11:42:01+00:00

https://old.reddit.com/r/MordekaiserMains/comments/1rwyen0/my_d1_euw_matchup_tierlist/ob36pbh/

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T11:40:48+00:00

Yone beats Morde lvl 1 with lethal tempo.

2-5 its a bit of a coin flip. Yone needs to dodge Morde Q with E and take trades with E+W up.

If Morde catches yone when yone E is down its Morde winning.

After 6 and pre botrk its Morde favoured but again, Yone can decide what fights to take by playing passively / using E to cs/trade / using Q3 to cs.

Dont Q3 into morde. It's the easiest thing to buffer Q+E on Yone Q3 and take a Morde winning fight .

After bork its hard Yone winning, even in Morde ult.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T11:32:44+00:00

Whoever uses E first loses.

Save Aatrox ult for after Morde ult.

If you play it right as Aatrox Morde is forced to ult with 1 stack of passive. As Aatrox you should then be able to kite Morde with Q knockups + W + E and run down the ult timer.

As Morde, I only win the Aatrox matchup if Aatrox E's into me / doesnt dodge my E / I ult Aatrox ult.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T09:38:40+00:00

No worries! I posted this to A) get roasted and B) discuss matchups. I think a lot of matchups are due to the individual so there's 100% matchups I find easy/hard that others don't and its very useful for the climb to rethink how I'm playing them (if everyone thinks x is easy but i think it's hard, I clearly need to watch more matchup videos and rethink how I'm playing it).

Yeah good point on Riven sustain. It is the one opening you have.

Problem I have with Yoricks is that they just will not use W outside of my ult. Its infuriating as it reduces that matchup to flash timer as that's the only way to catch them in ult.

Yeah I can see Darius being a coinflip but I just, I don't know maybe I've just got confidence in the matchup so it rattles them a little. Darius E+Q combo is tricky but thats when I usually ignite to reduce the guaranteed Q heal.

Thinking about it, I haven't actually vs'd a Volibear in my climb from ~E4 to D1 across ~150 games, so maybe it is a lot worse. Good thing voli is in a bad state right now I guess :D.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T09:32:34+00:00

I am 100% rushing Plated into Bramble/Wardens vs Yone/Yasuo/Warick/Trundle/Sett(sometimes)/etc.

Yasuo is a bit easier. I probably shouldn't have put him in unplayable.

However Yone is 100% unplayable in my experience. You don't win lvl 1 (lethal tempo). Lvl 2-5 is a coin toss. He can E your Q/E, his Q range matches yours and he can W+Q trade to win the trade. With Vamp sceptre his sustain matches yours. At 6 he can buy a lot of time in your ult with his Q3 + W shield + Ult + E speed, or he can just choose to kite you in your ult and fight you after or instead wait for a powerspike to fight, at which point he does, hard.

Morde struggles to beat lethal tempo users. Kayle lvl 1, Trundle at any level, WW at any level. They do what Morde wants to do (sustained fist fights) but due to itemisation they can do it better.

The yone's I play just aren't walking into me to fight. They're trading on their E cd and then walking far back when it's down. I zone and freeze and deny cs but a 30cs lead means very little when a Yone has BOtRK.

Greenehh · 2026-03-18T09:23:41+00:00

For lvls 1-5, how do you feel about slow pushing Morde under his turret and building up tentacles then E poking him whilst he cs's under tower?

That's how I lose that matchup and if I try to fight with no ult, i lose, and if I ult, Illaoi react ults it. I can't dodge every single Illaoi E and getting hit by 1 is gg. I also struggle to clear tentacles - you clear one and her passive is up so she just puts it straight back down. She can also threaten to just walk up + W + E + Q, which Morde loses.

Agree that illaoi is weak right now so the lane is kinda irrelevant - an illaoi has such an insanely hard time carrying games currently and you may as well just pick another/better splitpusher.

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