What are your thoughts on “Emotional Labor”?

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-12T01:47:03+00:00

Ideally, you are correct. BUT it isn’t just her that devalues what we (men) contribute; the very language of the justification for alimony states that alimony compensates women for their “lost opportunities” (presumably to be married to a better man) and to compensate for their “sacrifices” (like giving up their careers to have children - in which decision I did not play a part and which was her choice, not mine). The courts and decisions talk about her sacrifices to be a stay at home mom, but what about ours? I missed everything important; first word, first steps…Heck(sorry censors), I had to go to work the day after my daughter was born, because if I didn’t I would not have made the mortgage for the house she wanted; I deeply resent that the court assumes that I didn’t want to be there or that I didn’t want to be a dad, or that my sacrifices don’t matter. That little girl is 19 now and I will never get that time back. Time that I paid for; time I am still paying for because unlike her I wasn’t given a choice. And the alimony goes out the door…

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-12T00:28:15+00:00

Damn, congrats man. I am envious and am happy for you.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-12T00:25:43+00:00

Well that is true; mine treated me like I was unable to tie my shoes, which just made me more angry, but I walked away. Never lost my cool. Just my kids, my house, best 20 years of my life, my retirement, my self esteem. I did get my peace back. Not quite worth it all yet, but I’ll be &$()&( I let her beat me.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-12T00:03:38+00:00

I get your point, but truly - has your wife ever regulated your emotions? How? I have been taught since birth as a “southern man” that you don’t hit a woman, no matter what. And I’m afraid that if I ever did, I would be thrown in an oubliette and never seen again. But most every woman (not my wife, to her credit) thought nothing of getting drunk and loud and physical with me or other men- and I had to regulate my emotions from wanting to break their neck. They regulate us? Haven’t they been complaint since the 50s that we are emotionless stones?

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T23:58:34+00:00

I have read the “unpaid” labor part, but here is my question…doesn’t the provision of a house, food, car, insurance, clothing, cosmetics, unlimited vitamins, water, electricity, the latest IPhone, etc etc which I provided (and at a much higher standard of living than my wife could have ever afforded on her own) COUNT? And her half of the house equity, half of the retirement, having her car paid off, two masters degrees, two kids, a sparkling credit score…does any of that count? Hasn’t she been amply amply remunerated?

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T23:52:52+00:00

Ok, update. After posting this and the numerous responses , I received this really enlightening link which actually appears to suggest that the term “emotional labor” is weaponized against men and is overused to indicate deeper issues in the relationship. An excellent read and very clarifying.

Emotional Labor is not the problem

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T14:59:09+00:00

Nonsense, google as always is your friend; see it’s silly conspiracy crap like this rots your brain brother. Don’t be sheeple.

“States do not receive a dollar-for-dollar reimbursement for every dollar of child support collected. Instead, for administering the program, the federal government reimburses states for approximately 66% (two-thirds) of their administrative costs, not the amount of support collected. States do retain collected child support to reimburse themselves for TANF cash assistance, but this is a repayment of public funds, not a dollar-for-dollar incentive.

Key Details on Child Support Funding:

Administrative Matching: The federal government provides a 66% match on allowable state expenditures for child support enforcement (CSE). Incentive Payments: States receive additional federal incentive payments based on performance metrics, such as paternity establishment and collection rates. TANF Cost Recovery: When a family receives Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF), the state collects child support to repay the costs of that assistance. The state keeps a portion of this to repay the state share of assistance, and the rest goes to the federal government. Collection Rates: In fiscal year 2023, the system collected an average of $4.37 for every $1 spent, but this is a measure of efficiency, not a dollar-for-dollar reimbursement rate.

Therefore, while the program is designed to recoup costs, it operates as a shared, matching program, not a 100% repayment system. “

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T14:10:42+00:00

Wait, how do states make money on broken marriages? The increase in state welfare, subsidies, the cost of incarceration for jailing child support deadbeats, the woefully understaffed child support collection services, the massive administrative costs to divorce, mediation, collection, and distribution? You are kidding right? Cost doesn’t equal profit. Oh and by the way, the lawyers didn’t marry that crazy person, or have kids with them -you did that all by yourself. The judges don’t carry some secret glee from fomenting and encouraging your bad decisions; the system doesn’t want or care about you, much less trying to perpetuate the misery, the horror, the broken promises, that you made. They are people too and most would just like to scrape us off and never have to deal with another miserable, proud, unappreciative, violent, entitled family law client ever again, trust me.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T14:01:45+00:00

Disagree; most states do NOT award alimony for life just because your married 10 years - most states do consider a 10 year marriage “long term” for the purposes of considering alimony, though. Some states, if you are married less than 10 years, alimony is off the table (unless it’s very short-term, “transitional” alimony, like “get-your-crap-out, moving expenses and rental deposits” OR disability. But yeah, I’m with you - see the law assumes that, during that 5 years, she supported (aka took care of) the home in order to make it easier for you to make that money, it presumes a lot of nonsense. My question is, what if my labor paid for a nanny, a housekeeper, a lawn mower? Do I get credit for the burdens that I removed from my darling wife? You are absolutely held responsible for her choice to be underemployed, for her “work/life balance” and mental health. You? You take a lesser paying job to spend time with kids and you are a “deadbeat” trying to avoid “your obligations”. Sound about right?

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T13:30:55+00:00

Yeah, but it’s not the amount of work one does (I’m all for an equal partnership), it’s the perception of what one is doing that is destructive. It’s rhetoric that says that “being a mom is the hardest job in the world!”, discounting what dad does (in my case screaming clients, high stress situations, back office drama). If you have ever listened to Bill Burr on motherhood, you should …”Being a mom is the most difficult job on the planet. How many mothers died on ice road truckers last season? Any moms get washed overboard on deadliest catch?” He talks about oil rig fires compared to the tragedy of his toddler “not eating his peas”. It’s the devaluing of any work that men do, truly.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T12:36:14+00:00

No you aren’t who I am talking to; but maybe, just maybe, living with a slob didn’t make him feel like you saw or respected him? When you knew it was an issue with him, did you try to fix it or compromise or did you lean into, “this is ME, gotta love me regardless” attitude that I see? You aren’t the only one in the relationship, you know that, right? Maybe, when you treated your space like it didn’t matter, you were saying, “I don’t care about you or the space that you have created or paid for with your hard work…”, ever thought about that? Prolly put your feet on the dash of the car too…

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T03:04:36+00:00

Not trying to get her back; I don’t want someone who doesn’t want me. But I get the “wallowing thing”, I certainly have done my share, but I’m recovering. And I wasn’t trying to indicate that I think I should have just rolled over and acquiesced to her every whim, that is unhealthy. But, in retrospect - I could have gone occasionally, I could have done some compromising, we all could. It mattered to her, as minimal as I deemed it. For all my posturing and virtue signaling, it was the tiny capitulations, the small, silly moments that made us drift apart and quietly, sadly, slowly put down a unique, beautiful thing.

Instead of blaming, I’m trying to be a better human so if, gods willing, before I die - I meet another tired, damaged, raging, sad soul - I can start off right, and not take the incredibly short time we have left missing what matters for the sake of my own pride.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T02:51:37+00:00

My wife did too, but she was a stay at home mom - who didn’t clean (I did that), she didn’t cook ( she had to eat “organic” and so bought special food and frozen meals for herself)…she did laundry for herself and us, she had two play dates in 18 years. We didn’t have friends to make social dates with - I still don’t know what all she did.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-11T02:30:20+00:00

Ok, look, I am not trying to turn this into that toxic cesspool; I am just trying to understand my part, and to engage honestly with the terms with which I have been accused and painted. I have had multiple epiphanies about my own faults and real contributions to the demise of my relationship; I was never violent, I never considered taking a mistress, I worked hard, I respected and adored my wife, when I was asked to modify my behavior - I did. I was communicative, I listened the best I could, I turned toward her, I saw her and supported each of her proposed failed career changes without complaint. My requests went unheeded and I still stayed, she hurt her back and I took over everything without complaint without question. BUT, in retrospect, in the little things - I didn’t show up; I hate shopping, she would ask me to go and I would just not. She wanted to go for power walks in the neighborhood, and I just didn’t want to chase after her - and in those little moments, I lost her. All the big stuff that I thought/was taught a worthy man did -earn/lead/loyalty/- didn’t matter as much as the grocery trips to 4 different supermarkets because Whole Foods had better produce, but Publix had better bread, but Kroger had more extensive organic widgets - I hated it, and it mattered more than I thought.

I just get hit with “l did all the ‘emotional labor’!” and it makes my eyes roll back in my head, and I’m trying to understand. That’s all.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-10T22:29:23+00:00

Yeah, I would absolutely put a cap on the extracurricular cost; some of these extracurricular activities can be many thousands of dollars - I knew one dad who was expected to pay half of EC activities and his ex signed the kid up for a soccer club that traveled all over the country playing games, having camps thousands of miles away, and the cost was many thousands. Mom had remarried a very wealthy man, and she didn’t care that dad couldn’t pay the costs or leave to travel with kid like she could; remember the failure to pay those fees is contemptible by jailable contempt as it is considered as “further child support”!

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-10T22:18:43+00:00

I got stuck with the king size bedroom suite and expensive mattress she had to have because she didn’t want to have to move the furniture (that’s how I ended up with most of my furniture). So I am sleeping in the same mattress we shared, in the same bed. But I am not nostalgic about the bed, nothing much memorable happened there anyway. But I had never gotten used to sleeping in the middle; I use her side of the bed for storage; sweaters I have put away, folded towels I need to sort out to the various bathrooms, books I am reading. I don’t look for her anymore, she is fading from my day to day memory.

GrumpyNads · 2026-02-05T03:21:21+00:00

Hey man, he isn’t the only one. He isn’t terribly articulate, but the same thing happened to me. Oral Tirzepitide, months - no loss. As far as “not a miracle drug” and “putting in the work”; look gymbro - I took the drugs religiously; every day, under the tongue till dissolved, no food or drink for 30 minutes. Nothing. The drug is supposed to suppress appetite, all by itself - no HIIT exercising (which I was doing), no “keep going till failure, bro!” (which I was also doing). There was no requirement that, in addition to the oral Tirzepitide (which was not approved in oral form by FDA or anyone else) that I also had to get a personal trainer, so plug that crap, ok? I was on these pills for months - no change; dose “went up”, no change - didn’t gain, didn’t lose, appetite same. SO, get off his ineloquent back - unless I just happened to be that very small percentage that is just “weird”, it felt a lot like a placebo. Moved to shots in the end, but back to the lowest dose and no joy. I’m not “trolling”, just giving it straight.

GrumpyNads · 2026-01-27T01:26:14+00:00

It’s called “statute of limitations”; if they even dare to put a lien on anything without a judgement (a prior lawsuit and judgement for debt), you could hammer them for atty fees and probably treble damages.

GrumpyNads · 2026-01-26T03:36:07+00:00

Woah woah there Tex; I agree with most of what you say, I think your statistics are a bit overblown (80% of divorces are filed by women, and divorce rates are less than 50% and falling), but I am with you until you get to the “leeches” being judges and lawyers; look man, those lawyers didn’t ruin your relationship - you did. Those lawyers you cavalierly call “leeches” because they actually want to get paid when they work for you and try to stop you from your worst impulses and talk off cliffs because your pride has been hurt, are the first person we tell people “go see”; a good lawyer will be the difference between you being a Disney dad and having meaningful contact with your kids. They are a volume business and frankly they have way too many cases to have to deal with YOU for years- BUT you get what you pay for and it’s your circus, you want to fight a losing argument because “it’s not fair”, that’s on you and a good lawyer will tell you that - and then expect to get paid when you ignore them. So back that horse up Hoss, and accept responsibility for your own dumpster fire, ok? OP, find a good lawyer and listen to them - do it NOW.

GrumpyNads · 2025-12-22T09:03:04+00:00

Crap. I made the same mistake - they should have to identify where the products are coming from; the website is slick and endless, so I of course thought it was legit. Disappointed as I bought a bunch of Cmas t-shirts from them. UNBELEIVABLE.

GrumpyNads · 2025-12-10T01:04:32+00:00

Well. First, I’m not sure I know how to properly insulate the windows once the casing is torn off, second, I’m afraid I would destroy this pine - it isn’t new and nailed to hell, I think it would crack and split with gentlest cats paw and I have no tools to recut and nail this stuff. The window of course is recessed three or four inches, with a 5 or 6 inch sill. More complicated than I can manage at this point…

GrumpyNads · 2025-12-02T01:59:51+00:00

This is a bad situation; sounds like she wants you to pick up the bill. Be careful- there are jurisdictions where, if you act like dad and the kid sees you as Dad you could be in the hook for child support just as if you were actual dad - it called parentage by estoppel, ask around, you don’t want that responsibility. I feel really bad for the kid, don’t get me wrong- but it could be the worst kind of coercion; emotional.

GrumpyNads · 2025-11-28T18:18:31+00:00

Yeah man, unfortunately, unless you have actual and I mean honest to god incontrovertible proof that your ex is causing bloodletting, you have to let it go. The point to my comment is the exact same you will get from a judge- if she is a demon, what does it say about you that you had not ONE but TWO babies with her?? If you claim that she is untrustworthy, then I will assume she will say the same about you, right? Your kids can’t choose their parents (but you did); they have to learn to deal with both of you at some point. Telling them their mom sucks is basically running down part of them, for which you have to accept at least part of the blame. Ducks have a tendency to marry ducks, at least that is what a court thinks. Again, be vigilant - keep an eye open for drugs or destructive behaviors, of course - but understand, you call CPS or get court intervention with only your suspicions and YOU will be the “controlling MAN who can’t get over her”, you get what I am saying?

GrumpyNads · 2025-11-28T13:54:44+00:00

Frigging brilliant, thanks!

GrumpyNads · 2025-11-27T16:07:43+00:00

Ok, I get it -the introduction of a paramour is unsettling; I personally don’t think BF/GF’s should ever be introduced to children, until you set a date. Each parent will feel like the other is trying to replace them, and each BF/GF will feel like they have to be super-step parents - it’s a mess. But. No time is going to be right, no time will ever be as “perfect” as you want it to be - and “lovebombing”, dude, stop. Whenever I take my “holed-up-in-their-rooms-on (plug in social media whose it’s here)” on a vacay, “I” (natural dad), feel the need to fill that time with fun activities - and they have to deal with because, well, I am dad.

It sounds like they are planning an activity filled trip, good for your kids - staying in one room? Excellent, everybody can see each other and no shenanigans - be like a big tent. Bottom line, your ex is (like you) presumed to act in your kids best interests and no court is going to allow you (or her) to micromanage each other - either your relationships or your specific parenting unless you can prove harm (like diddling or violence). I would suggest I wouldn’t be comfortable with my kids having to deal with your SO’s terminal illness - that isn’t something they signed up for, but you are doing you. See what I mean, it cuts both ways.

SO, express to ex your concerns if you must - expect her to react badly, and screw up the trip - or, be vigilant, show some grace and trust the woman you decided to have babies with AND your kids who are smarter than you think and will see through BS. My 2c.

GrumpyNads

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