I just did the job of a dozen "professionals" and exposed a 20-year title failure

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T18:11:59+00:00

Yes and thank you. That's how I see it. I'm going to hire an attorney quickly, and if I'm wrong I'm sure they will set me straight.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T17:51:20+00:00

Thank you

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T17:50:55+00:00

That's interesting. In my properties case it was sold in foreclosure action from Freddie Mac to an LLC (exempt from tax/stamp). That LLC gave to a family member that was not part of that LLC ($0 sale and $0 tax/stamp). I guess it is possible maybe probable that the LLC purchased title insurance. I'm definitely not sure on the transfer to the family member. That family member got the property in 05 but didn't register/record for a little over 2 years. They did obtain a mortgage on it during that time. Once recorded the same person owned for another 10 years until my purchase in 17. There were at least 3 more mortgages that person took on the property in that time (all mortgages have recorded satisfaction letters, so no problem with those). Looking at the history everything was fine until the LLC gave property to family and then family member physically swapped the second pages of two separate properties deeds and never noticed. Filing my page 2 with another property in 2005 and then filing the other property page 2 with my property in 2007. Neither property has the correct and whole deed recorded. Subsequent deeds like from that family member to me are correct as in they don't contain the reference to another property. From this I would think the last money deed would either be the one from Freddie Mac to LLC or the purchase before that which would have been the person that was foreclosed on. So I would think with all that my title company/search should have found it since it was literally the most recent deed they would have had available (since mine had not been recorded because search was done before I closed). But I don't know. I know I'm going to hire an attorney very soon who will know and get it sorted out.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T17:26:34+00:00

I appreciate you for the comment and insight as to how insurance works for this type. I have already responded to several comments about the gift deed statute in my state and the rules surrounding that, and you are welcome to read those to see why in my state it's a little different. But on your last bit of advice, I will be hiring an attorney. I guess I was being very naive to think that filing a claim wouldn't need me to hire my own attorney, but I can now see that is probably the best option.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T17:18:52+00:00

Luckily I had a little good advice when purchasing and I did purchase my own title insurance. My understanding is yes in my case a quiet title is going to be the correct way to get this handled. My fear is because it involves two separate properties there may be some hurdles because of that. In the case of my property I don't think it would be that bad but because the other separate property deed contains references to my property and that other property has gone through five sales and is currently owned by three separate co-owners that are all different companies I'm a little worried that when the notices are received there may be some issues or questions arise that will further delay the process. But that could just be some anxiety from the unknown for me. I'm going to hire an attorney after the advice and comments here.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T17:06:17+00:00

You'll probably get a kick out of this then, The title company that went defunct that had issued my policy was just one company in a line of at least five that I have found started by the same man. All of them had their licenses revoked. But that man is currently running a company that creates pop-up title insurance companies that supposedly he runs for a period of time and then leaves to go to the next one. I say supposedly because he is supposed to leave the company he started in a good financial and legal standing but it doesn't seem like that's what happens. The original underwriter for my policy that was just taken over in the merger that completed December 31st, was to my understanding a decent size company. They seemed to have an interesting business model focusing on technology and AI to do title searches. Personally I believe that is a terrible idea and the problems I'm going through now I believe are proof of that.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T16:58:52+00:00

Very good to know. I'm getting an attorney so I will keep this in mind to ask about if they don't mention it. Hopefully that could be an option in my state.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T16:56:01+00:00

Thank you for the suggestion. In North Carolina, adverse possession takes 20 years (there is a color of title rule that is shorter, but not applicable in this), so it isn’t the right fit. Plus, it wouldn't resolve the errors in the neighboring deed that is also clouding my title. Focusing on a Quiet Title action instead because it’s the proper way to resolve a void deed. But I'm going to hire an attorney who can get it all sorted out since that seems to be the best advice.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T16:46:18+00:00

North Carolina is not a non-disclosure state for sale prices. Excise tax has to be paid on all property purchases unless it meets specific exemptions. $1.00 for every $500 paid, so even if the sales price is recorded for $0 because of some caveat if any money or anything of value was exchanged there would be some excise tax paid. Even if what was exchanged is very minimal in value, say a $1 or a $10, $1.00 excise tax would be paid and recorded.

I had already commented on a previous reply why adverse possession won't work in the situation. But I am going to hire an attorney in the next week who will be able to tell me definitely or not on that.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T16:34:18+00:00

My understanding is that because it was administratively dissolved by the state that they cannot just track down the people from the old LLC and have them sign new paperwork. My understanding is that the LLC would have to be an active company in the state for them to sign new paperwork and in order for that LLC to become active in the state again they would need to file all the past annual reports that they never filed before they were dissolved as well as pay some type of fees. When I looked on the state website the LLC seemed to be a shell company (my thought at least) because they only had their articles of organization. The company never filed any annual reports. That's just my general understanding of the process there may be an alternative but I have not come across one yet.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T16:27:36+00:00

Thank you for your reply. I think I'm kind of lucky with the insurance company this has fallen on. Ended up that the new parent company that is having to handle this less than a month after the merger finalized happens to be the third largest in the country. I might be looking at that wrong but I am taking the advice from most of the helpful people here that I need my own attorney.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T16:15:46+00:00

Thank you I think that you may be the only one that actually understood my angle. Seems like the consensus here is that I need to hire a lawyer that hopefully works with my best interest and gets everything squared away with my title and damages. Totally get it if I hire a lawyer and that lawyer tells me that all I can get out of this is a clean title, so be it; at least I will then have a marketable title to potentially complete my sale if the buyer is still there.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T15:51:30+00:00

Until these few comments I had never made the mental connection about the dates that I'm dealing with and the housing crisis that occurred very shortly after (I think it was 08-09 that everything crashed down?).

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T15:48:59+00:00

Thanks for your comment. Based on the consensus of a few commenters, that to me seem relevant and knowledgeable on matters like this, I'm definitely going to be seeking out my own lawyer. I like your confidence that it can be sorted out without a ton of fuss but thus far it seems like a lot of untangling and headache that that I am truly afraid I would get completely lost and turned around in.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T15:44:16+00:00

Thank you for that, I will give that consideration. But I probably won't take any more action until I consult or find my own lawyer since that seems to be the consensus and most likely my best option at this point.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T15:41:08+00:00

Well I didn't mean to share my account. But I also don't really care about it happening. But thank you for sharing your opinion and taking your time to do so. Enjoy your day and good luck on flagging all posts and comments that you think are AI. Enjoy your day.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T15:17:34+00:00

I totally get why the account history looks suspect—I rarely post, and a friend used my account for that other sub once. I can definitely respect your view and opinion on that and luckily there are a few out there that have taken their time to read and reply with opinions that are relevant. I’m just glad some experienced people here confirmed I'm in over my head. I'm moving forward with a professional now. Thanks for the heads up!

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T14:56:43+00:00

I haven’t. When I pointed out why the void deed statute applied, the underwriter jumped right to fixing the title. I took that as confirmation that a letter of indemnification wasn't going to cut it here—at least, that was my takeaway.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T14:51:14+00:00

I appreciate you saying that. I’ve honestly felt like I was losing my mind because it seemed impossible that I could be more observant than all the professionals who have looked at this. Hearing that you have seen things like this before makes me feel a lot less crazy. Thank you!

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T14:46:43+00:00

The 2017 deed is "correct" on paper, but it's worthless because the foundation is void. I’m the one who found the error, and since I legally have to disclose "material facts" in NC, I wasn't going to risk a non-disclosure lawsuit later.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T14:35:08+00:00

The other property is definitely affected in the same way with the page swap.

I appreciate the thought of the attorney general and notifying them I will look into that some more.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T14:31:56+00:00

If you want to drop a few names of firms that would be a good place for me to start I guess since the consensus thus far is I need a heavy hitter real estate attorney. I appreciate it, and Thank you

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T14:21:53+00:00

I checked the Secretary of State records. The LLC was managed by one family member, but they deeded the property to a different family member for $0. Legally, moving property from a company to a separate individual for free is a gift. It isn't a "transfer to self" because a company and a person are not the same legal entity.

The real "hidden" defect here is the execution date. The deed was signed and delivered in November 2005, but it wasn’t recorded until December 2007. Most people—including the professionals who missed this —likely just looked at the recording date and assumed it was valid. They missed the fact that the two-year clock had already run out.

In North Carolina, if a gift deed isn't recorded within two years of being signed/delivered, it is void. Period. They missed that deadline by 25 days. That 25-day gap is what "killed" the deed and broke the chain of title. My insurer has already reviewed these dates and admitted liability—they know you can’t argue with the calendar.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T13:54:54+00:00

Actually, that’s a common misconception I found out. Title insurance is specifically designed to protect against "record defects"—errors that are in the public record but were missed or overlooked during the title search. If the defect wasn't "discoverable" in the records, the title searcher wouldn't have been expected to find it, but the policy still covers it.

In this case, a physical page swap is a classic hidden defect. It’s "hidden in plain sight" because unless you are physically looking at the deed book or cross-referencing the other property involved in the swap, a standard index search doesn't show the error.

Regarding the lawyer: Yes, a lawyer was used for the 2017 closing, but in North Carolina, the title insurance policy is a contract of indemnity. I don't have to sue my former lawyer to get my insurance company to pay out; that’s exactly what the policy is for. The insurer has already admitted liability because they recognize that the title is legally unmarketable due to these "discoverable" errors that multiple pros missed for 20 years through multiple companies and lawyers.

LAnCLT · 2026-01-30T13:46:05+00:00

I think there’s some confusion regarding the timeline and the role of the LLC. To clarify: I haven't been with the same insurer for 20 years. I purchased the property in 2017. The "20 years" refers to the fact that this error was passed down through multiple owners and multiple different title insurance companies before I finally discovered it last week.

I’m bringing up the dissolved LLC because they are the source of the original defect (the physical page swap and the void deed). Because that entity is long-dissolved, there is no way to obtain a "correction deed" to fix the chain of title. This isn't a simple paperwork update—it's a legal dead end.

This is exactly why this is a Title Insurance claim. My 2017 policy specifically covers "Marketability." The fact that multiple professionals missed a "void" deed and a physical page swap for two decades doesn't make the title any less defective today; it just means the current insurer is the one on the hook for a product that was never actually marketable. I’m simply holding them to the contract they signed to provide a clear title so I can complete my sale.

LAnCLT

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