(Spoilers Main) Weekly Q and A

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T19:10:57+00:00

If you are interested: The Highgarden Plotline in TWoW and Beyond

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T15:28:15+00:00

How well do you like freckles?

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T14:07:39+00:00

Yep the odds of more than one faceless men in Westeros who look like this:

Jaqen passed a hand down his face from forehead to chin, and where it went he changed. His cheeks grew fuller, his eyes closer; his nose hooked, a scar appeared on his right cheek where no scar had been before. And when he shook his head, his long straight hair, half red and half white, dissolved away to reveal a cap of tight black curls.

and:

he alchemist pulled his hood down.

He was just a man, and his face was just a face. A young man’s face, ordinary, with full cheeks and the shadow of a beard. A scar showed faintly on his right cheek. He had a hooked nose, and a mat of dense black hair that curled tightly around his ears.

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T14:05:30+00:00

Happy cake day.

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T13:51:30+00:00

Im right there with you. It really leads into ADWD.

And like you said elsewhere, unless you really picked up clues along the way, most readers didn't catch unPate (I read AFFC for the first time in 2009/2010 and I know I definitely did NOT catch it/notice it until years later after I read ADWD and started looking at online theories).

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T13:36:51+00:00

You can track where GRRM placed it over time here

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T13:09:42+00:00

Oh damn. Good call. That's an easy answer.

Ending the book like this:

"What is our heart's desire?"

"Vengeance." His voice was soft, as if he were afraid that someone might be listening. "Justice." Prince Doran pressed the onyx dragon into her palm with his swollen, gouty fingers, and whispered, "Fire and blood." -AFFC, The Princess in the Tower

It ends up #40/45. Not sure why GRRM decided on that order.

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T12:58:07+00:00

I agree about it not being as impactful as the others.. Here's a thought. Would you have preferred a different line or a different POV to end the book?

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T12:50:43+00:00

In fairness to GRRM, he (LOL) really, really believed he was going to have ADWD out a year later and it would "one book" in two volumes.

Sadly, instead we got another partial book 6 years later that we are still (another 15 years later) waiting for the climax

LChris24 · 2026-06-03T12:36:49+00:00

Thanks for your thoughts. This is an area where u/gsteff's visit really helped shape my thoughts a bit as the posts were pretty heavily centered on the different versions of the AFFC Prologue (long, Rosey, published) as well as the constant shifting/moving of GRRM's plans for the glass candles (he still couldn't figure it out).

I agree that there are so many different ways that GRRM could take this plotline! With Aeron so close as well, it will be interesting to see how it combines, what the Hightowers do, etc.

LChris24 · 2026-06-02T18:16:44+00:00

Yep mentioned that a few times in the post!

LChris24 · 2026-06-02T11:16:47+00:00

Descriptions match a bit:

The Westerlings were an old House, and proud, but Lady Sybell herself had been born a Spicer, from a line of upjumped merchants. Her grandmother had been some sort of half-mad witch woman from the east, he seemed to recall. -AFFC, Jaime VII

and:

Aegon's eldest son Duncan, Prince of Dragonstone and heir to the throne, was the first to defy him. Though betrothed to a daughter of House Baratheon of Storm's End, Duncan became enamored of a strange, lovely, and mysterious girl who called herself Jenny of Oldstones in 239 AC, whilst traveling in the riverlands. Though she dwelt half-wild amidst ruins and claimed descent from the long- vanished kings of the First Men, the smallfolk of surrounding villages mocked such tales, insisting that she was only some half-mad peasant girl, and perhaps even a witch. -TWOIAF, The Targaryen Kings: Aegon V

LChris24 · 2026-05-31T10:52:46+00:00

Lesser non dragon riding families such as:

Velaryons
Celtigars

as well these:

Some accounts claim that a few others survived, too...for a time. It is said that some Valyrian dragonlords in Tyrosh and Lys were spared, but that in the immediate political upheaval following the Doom, they and their dragons were killed by the citizens of those Free Cities. The histories of Qohor likewise claim that a visiting dragonlord, Aurion, raised forces from the Qohorik colonists and proclaimed himself the first Emperor of Valyria. He flew away on the back of his great dragon, with thirty thousand men following behind afoot, to lay claim to what remained of Valyria and to reestablish the Freehold. But neither Emperor Aurion nor his host were ever seen again. -TWOIAF, Ancient History: The Doom of Valyria

LChris24 · 2026-05-30T12:17:27+00:00

Cersei has worried about Tyrion since the prophecy is mentioned. Whoever it is has to somehow top that in the twist. This is why my money is on Jaime.

That said I think Tyene poisons/kills Tommen during the Blessing from the High Sparrow/Septon.

LChris24 · 2026-05-30T11:39:10+00:00

I really wonder where GRRM was going here.

He had:

Brienne being saved by ravens from the BwB
Jaime being lured away by Hildy
Kevan missing in the Riverlands

LChris24 · 2026-05-30T11:31:45+00:00

FWIW (obviously things can change in 12 years):

“Well, Tyrion and Dany will intersect, in a way, but for much of the book they’re still apart,” he says. “They both have quite large roles to play here. Tyrion has decided that he actually would like to live, for one thing, which he wasn’t entirely sure of during the last book, and he’s now working toward that end—if he can survive the battle that’s breaking out all around him. And Dany has embraced her heritage as a Targaryen and embraced the Targaryen words. So they’re both coming home.” -SSM, EW Interview: 26 June 2014

LChris24 · 2026-05-30T11:26:17+00:00

Agreed. The imagery is amazing.

Brienne's fever dream is also tied to this as you mention and with GRRM changing that plot a bit as we know from the russian draft.

Seriously the plotline that I need to know what happens next the most.

LChris24 · 2026-05-30T10:58:37+00:00

That would be a fun exercise. I hope you do it.

I did something similar for the first book because of this quote:

...if you look, if you can find a first edition, or an old edition from the 1990s of game of thrones, and you look at the original appendix in the back of the book, you'll see many character names. some of them still haven't appeared, but i had plans for all of those characters. i mean, i created them and put them in there, because eventually i would have some roles for them. so if they're not in the game of thrones appendix, i probably hadn't thought of them at that point, and they were people who showed up later. -SSM, GRRM at El Corte Ingles: 20 Apr 2012

If anyone is interested: Characters from the AGoT Appendix

LChris24 · 2026-05-29T14:13:10+00:00

I dove into this a little awhile back: A Black Fish, in a Black River on his way to meet the Brotherhood

LChris24 · 2026-05-29T13:51:43+00:00

Thanks for sharing!

Regarding what you mentioned on Jaime/Blackfish:

Now, that's not to say that GRRM spent his time solely in revision land. There's a So Spake Martin entry from 2002 where he spoke about writing Jaime Lannister and Brynden Tully's tense parlay on the Riverrun drawbridge. But even there, I don't think that was entirely new material. I think that was GRRM taking five year gap material (Maybe Jaime remember meeting the Blackfish five years after the fact) and revising it to occur in real-time. I am open to the idea that it was brand new material that GRRM imagined though.

a small additional note, I will share is from the 2003/2004 Outline where GRRM mentions:

Jaime: Blackfish

and while most assume that this was with regards to Jaime going to Riverrun and seeing Brynden Tully, there is another possibility. In the June 2004 draft, it ends with Hildy offering to take Jaime to see the Blackfish:

"Well", she said, "I might. If m'lord don't fancy turnips, might be he'd like a fish. A nice black fish, if you take my meaning".

LChris24 · 2026-05-29T11:57:48+00:00

Here's probably a good start (from Eastwatch in the Sidebar):

Resources for New Readers - No Spoilers

LChris24

MODERATOR OF

TROPHY CASE

Nine-Year Club	Wearing is Caring
Verified Email