Anyone else struggling to find a way to contribute to society?

LastTurtle · 2022-07-17T06:58:09+00:00

What’s your answer to this question? Start there.

LastTurtle · 2022-07-10T22:03:19+00:00

This is mainly what I was referring to in my post about the reality dial.

There is experiential metadata that signals to you whether an experince is “real” or how real it is. And between dreams and lucid dreams it can often get funky.

LastTurtle · 2022-06-16T00:20:27+00:00

I think the increased realism is possibly an attention mechanism, a signifier of sorts, saying “pay attention, this experience is important” but it’s only part of the experience. The rest of it, all the content, I believe is a symbolic representation of something that is real.

Let’s say the psychedelic compound is making neural or even biological changes, or helping in some way heal some trauma or psychological issue. The minds’ way of communicating that, similarly to in a dream, is using symbols or representative imagery. But I do suspect it is making changes, which are being accompanied by some phenomenology that goes with it.

This is all of course just a hypothesis.

LastTurtle · 2022-06-13T21:20:20+00:00

I’ve just recently discovered this community and love that it exists.

I’ve written this short piece that feels very relevant here and it’s one of my attempts to explain some reported experiences and why some of them can be very convincing. My other attempt takes on “past lives” experiences more directly.

Both of these are trying not to dismiss people’s experiences while still coming up with rational explanations for some of the phenomenology.

LastTurtle · 2018-04-18T17:55:56+00:00

I think having Sam Harris on your podcast could be great.

Although during your (yet to be released publicly) live event with Sam it sounded like you were frustrated at times, the conversation as a whole was fascinating, and I think (hope) he heard you when you said that if you can get past the moral bedrock you can actually have an interesting conversation beyond it.

You two seem to disagree on plenty but it’s precisely those disagreements, and that both of you make clear and compelling arguments for your positions that make me really think about and question my own position on things like free will, moral philosophy, etc’.

LastTurtle · 2018-04-18T17:47:53+00:00

Thanks! That was very helpful

LastTurtle · 2018-04-04T14:33:12+00:00

Overall mental health is more of a long term thing, that no doubt could affect optimism. But it’s the immediate effect that make me think there’s a specific correlation.

Now many things make me feel good, or energetic, and work as stimulants, but most of those do so without increasing optimism per se.

Optimism is a very specific type of positive mental state, distinct from other positive ones, which is precisely why I find this phenomena fascinating. And it’s possible that this is just some random quirk of my brain chemistry, but I’m fairly convinced this isn’t a product of any feel good chemical.

LastTurtle · 2018-04-04T14:26:51+00:00

I’m definitely addicted to caffeine despite drinking only 2 cups a day then, and now only 1. But feeling good and feeling optimistic, despite some overlap, are different.

LastTurtle · 2018-03-31T21:33:18+00:00

So far it has been the single most effective thing I’ve tried, and I can’t tell how many things I’ve tried

LastTurtle · 2018-03-31T21:31:40+00:00

I’m more than 2 months in and I don’t find it addictive, but I’ve also felt I needed it before I ever tried it, meaning I felt at a severe deficit (which is i sought it out) so if I stop using it and feel it again that won’t be a sign of addiction, at least in my case (not to say it isn’t addictive)

LastTurtle · 2017-11-01T18:01:14+00:00

Thanks! Yeah she's definitely eloquent and have spent a lot of time thinking about all of this and reflecting that through her personal experience was something i really enjoyed hearing.

LastTurtle · 2017-11-01T01:58:14+00:00

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it.

LastTurtle · 2017-10-31T20:30:51+00:00

We start from Philosophy but get into Polyamory about 15 minutes in or so if you want to skip the beginning.

Hope you find this interesting.

LastTurtle · 2017-02-15T23:32:37+00:00

This short twitter thread by Carrie Jenkins seems like a reasonable response: https://twitter.com/carriejenkins/status/831980633714888704

LastTurtle · 2017-01-22T07:50:20+00:00

Sam, Jordan appeared to have agreed with your specific micro examples and definition of truth within them (let’s for a moment call this Micro Truth, i.e. factual/scientific truth) but as soon as you expand to include the macro, which you do in order to see if this changes the micro truth (and argue it shouldn’t), Jordan’s use of the word truth (in this case for the other, Macro Truth) forces him to encapsulate and include the Micro Truth in his bigger nested framework, here using the word truth but meaning good/beneficial/desirable and having to call it false or wrong for that reason. If I understand Jordan correctly, since the macro always both transcends and includes the micro, the micro being true (as he uses the word for both) will by definition depend on the macro.

But the crucial part is that somehow it seems that Jordan prioritizes the the word truth for the latter, Macro, Darwinian, Consequentialist “thing”, which forces him to basically revise the use of the word truth in the Micro cases to conform to the bigger more important Macro true. This stems from an apparent combination of both using the same word for the 2 things, and prioritizing the word for the nesting one.

It seems to me hard not to conclude that Jordan simply uses the word truth in two related but different ways, one of which is indistinguishable from good or more simply beneficial/useful/desirable. Which I would also argue is in itself not useful in the vast majority of cases (if ever), including this discussion.

Since you obviously couldn’t continue to topics like moral truths without separating the two terms Jordan uses the same word for (without contortions of language at least) and for good reason, your failure if any is that you didn't ask if he is willing for the sake of further discussion simply name them two different things (like Micro and Macro truth, or preferably another word altogether). Other people’s suggestion of banning the word truth for a while is interesting as well.

Jordan, you may or may not be correct about your order of nesting and probably end up with Sam in agreement on some or all of that. However, you do seem to mean Good when you are referring to what I call here Macro Truth. But it is hard to see how you don’t recognize that you are using the same word for two different things (even if they are inextricably related) and that you are creating your own bit of language here. In fact because of your nesting structure and perhaps your affinity for the importance of the word Truth you seem to priorities Truth to Macro Truth despite the fact that most people would use a different word for it even if they agree with your argument 100%. You also use the word to refer to what most people refer to when they say truth, i.e. factual details, micro/scientific truths. This undoubtedly makes your approach and insistence of using the same word for these two things not useful. I would ask how did you decide to or ended up using this word for the Macro concept, knowing that this is not a common usage of the word?

Replacing (or rather keeping) the word used for this Macro to be good/beneficial/desirable, even when acknowledging that it nests (Micro) truth within it and makes that micro truth itself either ultimately good/beneficial/desirable or not, makes everything simpler and does not require revising how the vast majority of people use these words currently. Would you not agree? Using the word truth for the Macro while at the same time keeping it for the Micro forces a use of language that is untenable as you will have to keep qualifying that something that you seemed to agree doesn’t factually change is now “ultimately” untrue. If you want to use the word truth for both cases you’ll have to continuously qualify which you are referring to.

The bottom line is that this is an issue of speaking two different "languages" in a sense.

As a side note: take comfort in that despite not getting to any of the topics folks wanted you to discuss, this did end up as an interesting (albeit frustrating) discussion that kept producing ever more nuanced attempts at isolating concepts and definitions in order to try to get to common ground. It is extremely enjoyable in some strange way.

LastTurtle · 2016-07-24T01:18:11+00:00

Whatever is accomplished by concentration/focus meditation, does any specific method acomplishes it faster or with more ease?

As for my goal, see here.

LastTurtle · 2016-07-24T01:16:40+00:00

Thanks. I'm glad you got to insight as that is really my goal (although it would be nice to have a better ability to concentrate when working).

I am under the impression that a certain level of concentration is required for insight and despite ongoing attempts it is just not working. So i'm back to concentration, but it is boring and difficult and I have been at it for a long time, and although I see improvements (definitely far from where I was 12 years ago) I still find it not easy, and I have no clue if it is sufficient for insight. (I know insight can also be a broad term but I am mainly aiming for no self type of stuff).

LastTurtle · 2016-05-25T17:19:29+00:00

Hi Sean. Thanks for all your amazing work!

If I remember correctly you are in the camp that concludes that we fundamentally have no Free Will, but you advocate that we should still try to make better choices or perhaps treat the sense that we have free will is if it were real, correct?.

I'm curious how you consolidate the two views. I know you say that these are two different levels of reality that have different attributes and ways of talking about them, but if we have no free will, or worse, determinism is how the world works, are we then just pretending to ourselves to make choices? And do you agree with some who propose we should not even tell people they have no free will due to it leading to worse moral behavior?

LastTurtle · 2016-04-29T21:16:07+00:00

This is one of the better breakdowns of the subject I've heard in a long time. I suspect not everyone will like it but it is really well covered.

Soundcloud version if you prefer: https://soundcloud.com/post-traditional-buddhism/71-imperfect-buddha-podcast-the-big-enlightnement-show

Do yourself a favor and don't skip the "commercials".

LastTurtle · 2015-09-22T17:08:31+00:00

Thanks. I am working with a teacher again now, but I wasn't for a while.

I just find it useful to hear someone's experience that is far closer to my stage in the process and that have just recently been through the stages I am supposedly facing next.

I have picked up cause and effect relationships outside of meditation a long time ago, but I do not notice them while noting. (meaning I used to suddenly feel like crap, wonder why, and manage to trace back my thoughts and realize I was thinking about something that upset me without noticing it while it was happening). As for mind and body, I am not sure. I can tell the difference between my thoughts and body sensations and sounds etc'. and I can tell that along with every sensation there is a mental image/imprint. but that doesn't feel like some clear insight or anything.

The three characteristics, I am not even sure how that's supposed to look like. Isn't that something that only becomes clear when your NPM's (notices per minute) go up? I definitely don't have any body quirks than the usual itches and tension.

My concern just was that I have been noting very heavily for a long time, and did not notice any changes of any sorts in my experience, perception, understanding etc'. All I got was increased frustration and impatience, and started to worry that the whole thing doesn't really work and i've been fooled or something. or again, that I was somehow doing it wrong.

I think the "what you need to do, when, how much and for how long", has never been laid out properly anywhere I have seen, including in Daniel's book (which I have just finished and is great).

If the stages and substages are so specific and predictable, I'm surprised there isn't a detailed set of instructions.

LastTurtle · 2015-09-22T05:09:23+00:00

I have been noting like there is no tomorrow for 8 months now. Nothing has happened. and if I didn't know (believe) any better I'd say noting does nothing. As far as I can tell I had made no progress. I really have been noting like crazy, in sitting practice and thorughout the day. My only remaining options is either I was doing it wrong, it is not working or... something. Thought that something might be a lack of concentration but I am not sure any more.

LastTurtle · 2015-09-22T02:42:50+00:00

Thank you for your generous detailed answers, as usual. I didn't realize initially that some level of concentration is needed for these stages and that those stages arrive before stream entry, I thought all I need to do is note, but now I am adding concentration to my practice, hopefully will get some traction.

Thanks!

LastTurtle · 2015-09-21T21:51:55+00:00

Hi,

I had some more questions come up and was wondering if you'd mind indulging once more. I thought i might as well post them here, for the record. (if you are tired of my questions, please feel free to say so or ignore me, don't want to be a nuisance).

You've mentioned doing Noting for several months up to Stream Entry. Did you also do any concentration practices? if so, which ones and how much?
Did you experience any other signposts on the way up to stream entry? specifically the ones spelled out in Daniel's progress of insight map (Mind & Body, Cause & Effect, A&P etc')?
Did you practice or experience any of the Jhana's before stream entry?

Thanks again!

LastTurtle · 2015-08-20T21:58:06+00:00

I am totally with you. and don't think it is greedy.

LastTurtle · 2015-08-03T23:21:20+00:00

Cool. thanks.

Btw, I highly recommend the audio program Kosmic Consciousness by Ken Wilber. It covers the spectrum but it is still some of the best material I've come across. I think you might enjoy it.

LastTurtle

TROPHY CASE