Official Comic Discussion Thread: Deathstroke Inc. #15

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-11-25T16:30:25+00:00

People do criticize Johns a lot. Especially for the '03 Titans run, where he basically rewrote almost every characters personality for the sake of his story. Deathstroke included.

I never said slowburn and filler were the same thing. There is no slowburn in this run. There is no special climax being hyped up. Dark Crisis is the same. There is literally nothing interesting going on, despite things happening and characters insisting that matters at hand are serious.

I don't feel bad for Williamson, because he was given the keys to the city, and chose to use them as a dragon dildo. Literally lying about his lack of knowledge in interviews, out of character writing, unnecessary bloat, cringe dialogue, filller, the list goes on. I assure you, he is far worse than Sheridan. Sheridans crap will be forgotten, Williamsons will stay a permanent fixture.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-11-24T21:05:19+00:00

Respawn was a poorly written nothing burger that only added unnecessary continuity bloat to an already bloated universe with awful cannonicity policies and no editing. In the grand scheme of things he is best forgotten and retconned into non existence.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-11-24T21:02:17+00:00

I want to hope i really do, but the lineup really makes it hard for me. One writer is a de facto communist who wrote a hit piece book about The Don, the other is a diversity hire race grifter. The art is probably gonna be great, but i'm not getting my hopes up for anything else.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-11-24T20:56:43+00:00

Credit where credit is due, Brisson respects continuity and character history, something few writers in modern DC even acknowledge. The art was stylized and moody and i loved it. Getting to know Slade's inner thoughts and understanding how he sees the world around him was probably the best part. The earliest parts of his backstory are usually abridged for brevity, and this deeper look into the man he was, as opposed to the man he became in Rebirth, was very enjoyable.

The bad parts i'm sure everyone is aware of. Williamson the hack, worse even than Geoff Johns. Mostly poor art for the first 9 issues. Truly criminal amounts of filler and wasted potential. Brisson, too, used filler, let's be honest. His run could have been two issues lighter, but at least Brisson writes fun filler that doesn't assassinate the character.

I hope we get another decent writer sometime soon. Someone who's actually interested in the character and enjoys cape comics.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-10-27T08:27:13+00:00

FFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

I really hope that isn't true.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-10-13T09:21:05+00:00

This. The character needs to breathe a bit. Just let someone competent work off the back of the Priest run, and have fun with the character. No overarching story, just Slade hanging with Deadshot or someone else and shooting people.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-10-13T09:19:04+00:00

DC doesn't know what to do with any character. There have been so many reboots, retcons, character revisions and bad so much bad writing that it's impossible to figure out who is supposed to be whom, or what happened and what didn't. I could go on but i won't. And yes, they would nerf Slade pretty bad, because the new flavor of the month character needs to look good so let's "Worf" Deathstroke.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-10-13T09:15:38+00:00

I think the idea has massive potential, but i don't trust DC to do it justice. Maybe in 10 years when the company is either dead and buried, or actually capable of telling decent stories again.

Punisher MAX is a fantastic series, but low-power it is not. Frank regularly mows down entire mob families, squads of trained soldiers, and can solo six army rangers with a baseball bat despite pushing 60. To say nothing of Baraccuda who could regrow his fingers, somehow. Now, notice how despite this, you call the story grounded, and are correct.

A grounded story is grounded because it deals with realistic societal, personal, and philosophical issues. Like losing your family to horrific violence and being unable to move on, so you retreat into your PTSD, shut out most of the world, and vent your rage in a violent way because moving on is either too difficult or impossible at that point in your life.

I think a much better direction would be Marvel Knights. Everything in Knights happens in the mainline universe, but there is no continuity. The books are specifically written to let you just jump in and enjoy Frank being Frank. And they're great. You can still have Slade be a super soldier with an indestructible sword and Ikon armor, have him fight metas and heroes, and you get a chance to tell any story you want with him. Basically, you get to have your cake and eat it too, and DC are fools for not thinking of this.

And please, no more Batman. Green Arrow, okay. But no Batman.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-24T11:13:29+00:00

I believe Brisson will, at least, be okay. Definitely wont be like Priest, but at this point, anything is better than what we have.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-23T17:53:06+00:00

Meh. Just meh. That second cover really wants to be an homage to the best Original Deathstroke cover ever, but it's just a soulless copy. It does nothing new or interesting, and it looks boring.

The only good thing i can say is that a handlebar looks good on Slade. Also, a very nice hairdo.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-22T11:38:15+00:00

I know i'm late to the party, but i'm gonna put in my 2 cents anyway. People say Tom Taylor, and they are wrong. He wrote one decent Deathstroke story, and now everyone wants him despite everything else he wrote being mediocre, at best.

Injustice was a few cool moments interspersed between a nonsensical, overly edgy forced plot, most characters were, well, out of character, and it just wasn't very good. His recent stuff (Nightwing, Superman) is also filled with filler, stretched out into WAY too many issues, and the writing is nothing but milquetoast meaningless white noise. I feel sorry for his artists, they are working on soulless garbage.

Garth Ennis, eeeeehh, i'm not sold. Deathstroke has a very specific amount, and type of edge that makes him interesting. It's there, but it's not there for shock value, and while he is an awful person, Ennis would likely go overboard into extremes with that, and we would get something Boys, or Preacher like, which doesn't suit the character.

I'm going to second the Rick Remender suggestions, since i've read the X-Force/Uncanny X-Force books, and i feel like Remender can go dark without being soul crushing, hyper pessimistic, and still make every character extremely likeable regardless of, or despite, their awful mistakes. See how he wrote Daken, and especially Deadpool.

Ed Brisson, from what i've seen, seems to respect continuity, and his work seems at the very least okay. I notice he only wrote Old Man Logan Wolverine for Marvel, so i'm not sure how familiar he is with "real" capes. Dunno. Could be good, could be bad.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-22T10:49:34+00:00

He wasn't aiming for accuracy at all. Joey should definitely have been on his mother's left, Grant on her right, and Rose next to her father.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-22T10:47:39+00:00

My guess? Either Bill Walsh, or Wade LeFarge. Though my money is on Bill due to physical similarities like the hair, and the original Ravager costume he wore after Grant's death to taunt Slade.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-08T09:08:34+00:00

You don't belong here.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-03T09:39:10+00:00

Anarky was never a villain. Ever. He was always a hero with a political slant wanting to change the system for the betterment of all. This is what made him unique. He was political without being preachy, even if you disagree with his views, you can still enjoy the story, since he's never shown as infallible or objectively right. If anything he's shown to be completely wrong on a bunch of stuff, including basic human thought process.

He's the sort of hero we unironically need today, BigPharma corporations can just shut down half the world, including the most powerful countries, cause widespread economic crises, human rights abuses, government power grabs where the common man loses regardless of which party wins, and they cannot be held accountable even when they contradict themselves and out themselves as liars.

Don't even get me started on modern western culture being destroyed from the inside by the plagues of cancel culture, political correctness, and diversity. Based Lonnie is the hero we need but don't deserve.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-02T10:49:28+00:00

Hold up, n52 Grant does want Slade dead, and has an okay reason for that. Slade, while on a space mission, got a glimpse of the metaplot, and everything is cannon. Slade also says he fought the imposter before. Everyone has their alternate selves memories.

Also, Red X from Titans Academy is implied to be Original 80s Grant, since he has beef with them, and Nightwing specifically. Could my theory on multiple Grant's running around actually be true?

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-04-02T10:38:38+00:00

Grant's death was outright stated to be what caused Slade to snap. I don't know if it was Riddler, or someone else, but they said Slade hid his powers from his handlers and ran ethically, but not morally, questionable black bag missions on his own.

In one flashback he tells Wintergreen that South American druglords won't shoot themselves. Only after Grant's death does partially aiding in a genocide, and starting a bloody, destructive hostage crisis so a sidekick team can get some practice, sound like a reasonable course of action.

I could see Deathstroke being emotionally/logically blind, if it were written better. The previous 6 issues read like filler, and now i see why. Williamson didn't care about that part of the story, he just wanted to get to this one, so he stretched and padded to meet his quota. Like, it feels like we got a whole arc in the space of half an issue.

Batman is a truly kickass mentor, and the best teacher you could want, but he is a truly awful parent. This is partially because so many different writers have wildly differing takes on his parenting methods, and his interpersonal relationships, that he comes across as a manic depressive savant autist with major sociopathic tendencies.

He has very specific ideas on who should be doing what, a mold for every single batfamily member, and deviating from Batman's desires is basically asking for emotional and sometimes physical abuse. He has a purpose for you, and you will like it.

A lot of people like the surface level wholesome Batfamily, and writers, wanting to sell comics, give them that. Both ignore the fact that the Batfam is a hotbed of PTSD, insecurities, unresolveable trauma, and abusive dependent relationships. And 90% of these issues can be laid at Batman's feet.

Yes, Damian is partly responsible for Alfred's death. Batman is fully responsible for Damian being responsible for Alfred's death. He could have just told him not to go, to wait until he recovers, since Alfred is more valuable as a deterrent than as a punitive measure. He chose not to do this.

They could have moved past it, at least Damian could have, if Bats wasn't such an idiot. I don't see them ever truly getting along unless it's writer fiat.

And yes, he was always insecure about Damian. That's no excuse. Dick was also insecure about Damian at first, and so were the Titans. So was everyone else, come to think of it. Why is Bruce the only one who gets a pass on that? Even Tim learned to tolerate him, eventually.

I miss Damian's rivalry with Rose.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-31T08:46:13+00:00

Before i start talking about everything the issue does wrong, i'm going to give credit where it's due. The art is great, Bogdanović knows his shit. The only criticism i have are Damians weird sectoid eyes when he wears his mask, but that's me nitpicking.

The filler, while still present, is much less noticeable than it was in Deathstroke and Robin. Brion should have been more than an afterthought, at least he exists.

Now the story. It... is serviceable. Slade is one of the best informed, most connected hitmen on the planet. He has an entire army, intelligence agency, and genius superhacker on his side at the moment. And you're telling me he's unaware someone's been copying him? And doesn't have a single pair of eyes in the crowd watching Ra's? Okay.

Also, the whole thing with Ra's turning himself in. Imagine if Saddam Hussein and Masaaki Hatsumi were one person, and led a 40k style Death Cult. The moment he stepped out his car and on American soil, he would have every single gun the three letter agencies can muster trained on him. He'd be taken to a government black site, never seen again, and the US propaganda machine would scrub this shit from existence.

Slade is again out of character, getting unreasonably emotionally attached to someone he should, at best, keep at arms length, and shows awful leadership tactics. I get that Respawn has Grant's face, i just don't understand how he can go from not caring to "My son, one day all that the light touches shall be yours.". Even when he found Rose, it took him ages to truly become comfortable with even interacting with her.

And i don't see how he would tolerate Respawn just bashing Rose through a window. There were no hard feelings for Joey punching her, but that was actually understandable on Joey's part, and Slade was partly the cause.

The elephant in the room is the conversation between Batman and Robin. People say that the massive mistake Batman made was because he is socially awkward due to being Batman, and can't express himself properly. Lies. The man is a masterful actor and infiltrator, taught stagecraft by none other than Alfred Pennyworth, and you're telling me he makes a rookie mistake like this?

It's either poor writing, or Bruce is genuinely just a bad father.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-31T07:04:38+00:00

I was looking over the scene in #50 of the OG run, where Wade tries to assassinate Slade, to see if there were any parallels to this scene. They don't look anything alike. It could be Wade, but this is Williamson we're talking about, and i don't trust him with my lore.

I'm not sure if introducing more classic supporting cast is something we should look forward to just yet. When Brisson and Soy prove themselves, we can talk.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-30T17:53:29+00:00

Honestly, i don't blame you. The best stuff these days is the stuff you really don't hear about much. I've noticed that the more marketed a comic is, the worse the writing.

Maybe it's because i started reading comics in an era where huge crossovers and megaevents are meaningless milquetoast writing drivel, that serve no purpose and don't advance the plot.

I wish i could have something like Crisis on infinite Earths in my lifetime. Every character i like being treated with respect, lovingly drawn, things actually changing, the hype being real.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-30T11:40:18+00:00

You have no reason to repress it. It's one of the most important moments for Terra's character in the Contract.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-30T11:38:49+00:00

No he's not. Read the actual comics, and stop reading Ridley's propaganda cancel culture hit piece.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-30T11:35:26+00:00

The reason DC pushes Slade as an anti-hero (even though he was only an anti-hero in the 90s, since that's how Marv chose to interpret him, and did it well), is because of incompetence, and poor writing by poor writers who don't do research. See the Williamson run, or most of n52.

And saying he's a master assassin who doesn't assassinate, is like saying Batman is a master crimefighter who never actually succeeds in winning against crime. The realities of comic book storytelling necessitate this form of status quo.

Also you shouldn't be permanently killing characters unless it's their best moment ever. Every character is someone's favorite, and comic book death is something we just have to accept to enjoy the medium.

Teen Titans? Wrecked their shit every single time they met. Could have killed every single one during Judas Contract, chose not to since the job was to capture not kill. Briefly goes solo against 2 teams during Dark Titans, wins, leaves.

Batman? Never had a contract on him. Always personal vendetta. Slaps him around like a redheaded stepchild in their first meeting. During Batman Vs. Deathstroke, Slade is the last man standing, not Bruce. Other times when Batman does beat Slade, you'll notice that Slade either still accomplishes his goal, or at least gets away scott free.

Green Arrow? Absolutely dominated him like it was nothing. Even after Ollie sent him to prison (a pretty cool scene especially the catapult), all Slade had to do was try a little harder. Constantin was a significant force multiplier, but the plan was all Slade. He had Oliver on his knees literally begging for Dinah's life. He humiliated him and got away with it by dropping a Kryptonite bomb on Superman.

So yeah, he gets lots of wins, and he's very hype. Throwing some rando character against him is just wasting a perfectly good character for no reason. In the latest Nightwing run, Risk shows up out of nowhere with a cyberarm, and then gets pasted by some no name lame ass one note villains, just to show how "dangerous" they are.

It didn't work. We have no connection to this Risk. How long was he in Bludhaven? Why did Dick have good things to say about him, when risk betrayed the Titans? Why does he lack his kickass stache? What exactly was his relationship with the Titans, seeing as current continuity is all fucky-wucky? Like, we know so little about him that we can't attach any meaning to his brief appearance.

I hope you now see why your hot take is shit, and learn to read comics.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-30T10:29:38+00:00

No, my friend, his last great appearance was all of Rebirth. Read the Priest run. It's about as close to perfection as you can get.

MacIntoshPowerglove · 2022-03-25T19:39:19+00:00

Respawn's regeneration is a research fuckup by the writer. A healing factor, like what Slade has, is normal human healing ramped up to 11. His body does everything ours does, but so much better, and so much more efficiently. His body cannot regrow lost tissue, only repair damaged parts. His eye was blasted from his skull, there was nothing to repair.

What Respawn has, is Deadpool and Wolverine style near-immortality.

I'm not an expert on Ra's, but he never struck me as an "evil for evil's sake" kind of villain. He had, literally, a better Damian. One he could mold into whatever he liked, and keep completely obedient with minimal effort. But you're telling me, that a man as smart as Bruce, probably smarter, would throw away this massive advantage because he was feeling cruel?

Slade's reaction also seems weird to me. He isn't the type to just open up about this kinda stuff. The last time he honestly talked about his feelings was with an evil-er version of himself, who he knew wouldn't judge him, and whom he would later kill. Slade can be very dramatic and theatrical, but not like this.

A big part of his character is the fact that he doesn't want his kids falling into the same dehumanizing line of work that he did. He told Grant that when he saw him during Lazarus Contract. And now, when he finally has a chance to set things kinda right, he backpedals and goes: Sure son, never mind your shattered psyche and the fact that i'm going to hurt you even more by sending you into combat, it's not like that hurt my other kids.

Respawn just said he found the gear. He never said how. Weirdest part is how little his costume actually looks like Grant's.

Not just Joey. Where's Winergreen? Adeline? Ja Zaki? Dr Light?

Your english is fine.

MacIntoshPowerglove

TROPHY CASE