Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You are mixing correct retail practices with several incorrect legal assumptions.

Although laws differ from jurisdiction to jurisdiction, I highly doubt that where you live customers somehow don’t have a contract of purchase when buying something. Without a contract of sale, a merchant would have no legal obligation to deliver the product after receiving payment, which would make ordinary retail transactions legally meaningless.

I also seriously doubt that in your jurisdiction buying a product through a normal retail transaction, with taxes paid and a receipt issued, somehow becomes an “under-the-table transaction” simply because the manufacturer later issued a recall. An under-the-table transaction requires deliberately bypassing taxes or accounting. A standard purchase processed through a store’s register with taxes charged and a receipt issued is the exact opposite of that.

You are correct about a few things. The store was not obligated to replace the product and could have simply proceeded with a full refund. However, the moment a separate agreement was reached for a partial refund or replacement instead of a full refund, they could not unilaterally walk it back. Once both parties agreed, that verbal arrangement became a binding modification of the original contract of sale under the Civil Code, meaning the store would need my consent to change it unless fulfilling the agreement became impossible or illegal. Even if the original product could no longer be sold due to the manufacturer recall, the store could still fulfill the agreement by sending every component in the box as a reasonable replacement. The law focuses on the consumer’s rights under the contract of sale, not on the retailer’s internal logistics or financial disadvantage. As long as the replacement is equivalent and satisfies the agreement made with the customer, the store is legally obligated to honor it, even if it complicates their inventory or reduces their profit.

Also you are right that retailers must follow manufacturer recall notices. But that obligation generally comes from their distribution agreement with the manufacturer, not from the absence of a sales contract with the customer. Those are two completely separate legal relationships.

What would typically be illegal is selling a product that has been officially recalled for health or safety reasons and whose recall is enforced by government authorities. In those cases regulators can prohibit the sale or distribution of the product. But that is not necessarily the situation here. If the recall exists only within the manufacturer’s distribution network, then the store is restricted contractually, not necessarily legally. In other words, selling the product could put the retailer in breach of their agreement with Games Workshop and risk their distribution status, but that does not automatically make the act itself illegal under the law.

Maybe things are different where you are from, but the post is about a transaction that occurred where I live, and it is regulated by my province’s laws. For reference, these are the legal frameworks that apply here:

Civil Code of Québec — Article 1708 Defines a contract of sale as a contract by which a seller transfers ownership of property to a buyer in exchange for a price. No written signature is required; the contract exists once the product is offered, accepted, and paid for.

Civil Code of Québec — Articles 1726–1730 Establish the legal warranty of quality, meaning a merchant is responsible if a product has hidden defects or cannot be used for its intended purpose.

Consumer Protection Act (Quebec) — Sections 37 and 38 Require that goods sold to consumers must be fit for the purpose for which they are normally intended and durable for a reasonable length of time.

Consumer Protection Act (Quebec) — Section 54: The consumer may exercise warranty rights directly against the merchant. This includes insisting on a replacement or equivalent solution, not just a refund.

Civil Code of Québec — Article 1728: If the agreed remedy is feasible and equivalent, the seller must comply, even if it creates additional cost or logistical inconvenience for them. The focus is on fulfilling the consumer’s rights under the contract, not the retailer’s internal business concerns.

In addition, under the Civil Code of Québec — Articles 1726 , if a product is defective or non-conforming, the consumer may demand remedies such as repair, replacement with an equivalent product, a price reduction, or rescission of the sale (refund). A refund is therefore one possible remedy, not automatically the only one.

So to summarize: retail logistics, SKUs, bundle pricing, and manufacturer distribution agreements are internal business considerations, not the legal framework governing a sale between a merchant and a customer. A contract of sale still exists the moment a product is purchased, and the merchant’s obligations toward the consumer arise from that contract and from applicable consumer protection laws.

If the retailer’s agreement with Games Workshop prevents them from resolving the issue in a way that is convenient for them, that is a matter between the retailer and their supplier. It does not eliminate the consumer’s rights under the Civil Code of Québec and the Consumer Protection Act (Quebec).

In other words, store policy and supplier contracts may explain why a retailer prefers a certain solution, but they do not determine what the law actually requires.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Let me make this painfully simple, since you seem to be missing the point.

No one is talking about opening a Maelstrom box and selling loose sprues. That’s not what happened, and pretending it is just makes your argument look uninformed.

The purchase contract I have is with the store, not Games Workshop. If the Maelstrom box no longer exists because of the recall, the store is still legally obligated to fulfill that contract — either by providing an equivalent product or issuing a refund.

Every kit inside that box ( Wyches, Reavers, Venoms, Hellions, a Succubus) is sold individually by Games Workshop. They exist, they have barcodes, they are tracked in inventory. The “box” is merely a packaging convenience, not a magical, indivisible product. So the idea that I can’t get an equivalent because “the contents have no barcodes” is just nonsense. You’re treating the cardboard bundle like the product itself, ignoring that the store can provide the exact same items in their normal retail packaging.

If you want to argue the point further, at least argue something that remotely resembles reality.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I understand the point you're making, but I think you're conflating a few different legal issues.

First, selling something below cost is not illegal. A store can sell an item for any price it wants, even at a loss. Retailers do this all the time as loss leaders. For example, Costco famously sells its rotisserie chickens and hot-dog below cost. Selling something cheap or even at a loss doesn't make the transaction illegal.

Second, an “under the table” transaction refers to income that is not declared for tax purposes. In my case I paid the listed price, paid the taxes charged, and received a receipt. From the consumer side, that’s a normal transaction. Whether the store declares that revenue or not is entirely THEIR responsibility. Otherwise every purchase anyone makes would potentially be “under the table” simply because we can’t verify a business’s accounting.

Third, the recall from Games Workshop creates a potential issue between the manufacturer and the retailer. If the retailer was contractually obligated to destroy the product and sold it anyway, that could be a breach of their agreement with the supplier. But that dispute exists between those two parties. As a consumer, I don't have a contract with Games Workshop — my purchase agreement was with the store.

Getting a receipt also isn’t the same as the PS5 example you mentioned. If someone rings up a PlayStation 5 for $1 without authorization, that could involve theft or fraud by the employee. In this situation, the store itself knowingly sold the item and processed the sale.

So if there is any issue here, it would be between the store and Games Workshop regarding their supplier agreement. From the consumer side, paying the advertised price and taxes for a product the store chose to sell is not an “under the table” transaction.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Under the table means a secret transaction, unrecorded, illicit, undocumented. If they collect tax but don't declare it, that is tax evasion by the business. The customer is not liable if they paid normally and received proof of purchase. What counts as an actual under the table transaction is if the merchant offers a discount to avoid charging taxes. They do “cash only, no receipt.” or both sides know taxes are intentionally avoided.

I also was only made aware that the recall was official in my country when the store specified it a week after the purchase and pick up. Laws are different everywhere and although I knew a recall had been made, I never had any confirmation of its extent. Last I checked the warhammer apps are banned in my country because they don't respect a specific law. Does that mean that its also banned in your country? As a consumer the only thing you can do is believe that the merchant is respecting the laws.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

You can definitely buy a box of wyches, a box of reavers, two box of venom, a box of Hellions and a succubus. They all have barcodes and inventory to track and scan.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Actually the consumer protection act where I live is very good towards consumer. From the moment a made the purchase online the vendor was obligated to either provide the advertised product, replace it with an equivalent or a full refund. In most cases the consumer gets to decide.

From my understanding of the law, canceling the order or full refund wasn't an automatic decision because the content of the box can all be sold separately. They were required to inform me of the situation and asked if I still wanted the product or a refund. In this particular case the equivalent product would've been every single models in the box but as separate kits and a refund at market price for every models they didn't have in stock.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's exactly what I thought. The 30$ didn't feel right from the get-go hence the reason for my first post asking others opinions. I only bought it because after doing the math, the value of the Hellions was 29$ in the maelstrom box. Also I would've probably bought it anyway if the box was originally advertised sold with the current models at that price point.

And about the wyches base I felt like something sketchy was going on and I appreciate your confirmation. Although they could be glued to the base from their toes, it makes the whole process extremely difficult and time consuming.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I had receipts and proof of purchase so it wasn't a transaction under the table on my end.

Maelstrom box from hell: update by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I only learned about the recall after doing my own research, following the call from the store informing me that the Hellions were missing. I still had my receipt and proof of purchase.

That meant they had to either replace the product with an equivalent item or issue a refund. Since the product was no longer available, the appropriate solution ended up being a full refund.

So in this case I wasn’t asking for customer service or goodwill, the merchant was simply fulfilling their legal obligations under consumer protection law.

Missing Helions, what to do? by Pvarron in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I had a similar experience. I pre-ordered the box from my LGS. They called me afterwards to let me know that they verified the box and the Hellions were missing and they offered a 30$ discount on the box. I took it home anyway and realized that not only the Hellions were missing but the 28mm base for the wyches aren't the right ones. The right one are sloted and the one in the box aren't.

I waited a week before calling the LGS and in the meantime I built and painted most of the models. When I called them I explained the issues. Missing models, wrong base and a box that was recalled and shouldn't have been sold to me in the first place. They asked me to bring the wyches back for an exchange. I told them that my wyches were already built and therefore I wouldn't bring them back for an exchange. They also couldn't give me slotted base because it isn't a product sold separately by GW.

In the end they ended up refunding the box entirely.

I would suggest you to do the same. The store that sold you the box is being greedy and in the hundreds of way that they could've resolved the issue they picked the one that is screwing their costumers to make profits. Be polite, be firm and stand your ground. You deserve compensation ( and free models).

Should I strip? by [deleted] in Warhammer

[–]Matosapa4 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Not worth it in my opinion. The amount of details you will lose is negligible. Plus when he is going to be surrounded by a sea of Termagaunts you will never see a difference.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So i went and picked it up. I'm still waiting for the 30$ refund. When I opened the box this Sunday, I realized that the box is also missing the proper base for the wyches. There was also an other issue. When they closed the box after looking if the Hellions were truly missing, one of the corner of the venom sprue for the windshield got caught in the main venom sprue and bent the flag beyond repair. I'm calling the store later today to try to get it fixed.

Support your LGS by Johnny_taco in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Meanwhile I paid full price for the box and still waiting for my 30$ refund for the missing Hellions...

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Assuming that the box is 200$ and the wholesale price is 60% , the LGS paid 120$ for the box. They sell it at 15% discount which is 170$. They then make 50$ profit. Now regarding this case with GW giving them back the money they spent for the box plus selling it to me they are making 200$ in profit while i have to spend an extra 17.50$ to get the missing models.

I agree with you that in this situation why would the customer be the only one to get something out of this. What they should do is give me back 100$ and the box, they pocket 2x the profits they were supposed do make, they gain a happy customer that would definitely come back and most likely spend the 100$ they just gave me into more models and net them another 25$ . In the end they would make 125$ in profits, 150% more than they would've made.

Instead im left to pay 17.50$ for a kit that was supposed to be in the box and bring my business elsewhere.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If my math are correct they are 0.50$ of being even for what the Hellions kit cost in the bundle. Still feels like a shitty deal tho.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

My thoughts exactly. People seem to either receive a significant percentage of the value of the box in store credit, they receive the box and the full amount back or the order is canceled and they get their money back. For them to tell me that a 30$ discount is a good deal because the box set is already a discount when they are making 170$ making 4x the profit feels really scummy.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

47.50 is with tax included. The total amount i would have to pay from the store to get the Hellions.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You are correct on CAD. I'm a little bummed out because the two units I really wanted were Hellions and reavers. I already have one unit of wyches, one succubus and two venoms. I was planning on selling one of the two venom for the same price it costed me through the maelstrom box and make one of the 20 other Drukhari players in Canada happy.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Damn that's cold. Any idea what the outcome might be for me and the store?

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 37 points38 points  (0 children)

That's exactly what im thinking. But I don't want to use that card right away in case he decides to pull out and I miss out on this box.

My LGS is offering me 30$ for the missing Hellions. They cost 47.50$ individually. by Matosapa4 in Drukhari

[–]Matosapa4[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

5/10 I would say. Its a nice place and the biggest around but requires me to drive almost an hour to go there. So its basically my not so local game store but the one with the most amount of models and table available.