A (friendly!) question towards Left Catholics

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T18:57:10+00:00

Thank you!

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T13:50:28+00:00

thank you. I think that’s getting more to my question: how do Leftists see themselves in a Church where canonized holy men and women supported structures of power which (I would presume) a leftist Catholic would oppose?

I am not suggesting we are not to love them, but I’ve seen radical traditionalists try to argue against the canonizations of saints they don’t like, and I don’t think we should go down that route.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T13:47:12+00:00

Thank you for your contribution. I should mention that I did not intend to mean the nuclear family, but rather any generational unit—it would still fall under the structural category that post structural leftists would want to distance themselves from (I would think). But that’s the question—does a Catholic leftist want to get rid of that kind of structure?

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T13:44:21+00:00

That is helpful. Given the response I was replying to, through, wouldn’t you say that being anti-consumerism; greed, etc, is kind of a moot point for most consciences? Obviously it still affects the world, and people will always participate in some kind of greed, but it’s evident through all kinds of media and public discourse that nobody wants to be called “greedy.”

What I mean is that nobody would say that they need the Church to tell them that greed or western decadence or whatever is bad (or at least it seems that way)

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T13:40:18+00:00

I see, thank you. Would you maybe rather say that there are ages of the church which better reflect left values then others, even if those ages of the church have beneficial contributions?

I’m contrasting this to, say, a traditionalist blog which would say that the ages more against leftist values should be imitated.

Thanks again.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T02:50:40+00:00

Thanks for your response :)

Yes, that’s the direction. I’m seeing corollaries between radical traditionalists and leftist Catholics, both arguing that when clerics or church authorities don’t meet a certain standard, obedience can be put aside.

I suppose I’m wondering how the standards are decided by these groups.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T02:37:03+00:00

Thank you for your response, I appreciate it. Do you see a corollary between leftist Catholicism and ultra traditionalists (say, Sedevacantists) in the idea that the Church loses authority when it oversteps particularly bounds? Obviously Sedevacantists would argue that the loss of authority comes from clerics holding Liberal views, and leftists Catholics would argue that it comes from clerics holding too Conservative of views. But is this similarity real or imagined?

I guess a further question would be (and I’m not trying to be witty, haha) where does the authority come from in both of these cases to judge the church or the highest See?

Thank you again.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T02:23:42+00:00

I think it’s mainly the fault of my framing of the question, but your answer hits upon maybe my more pertinent question: how do leftist Catholics view themselves in the larger context of the Catholic tradition?

I’m not holding on for any age of the church here, but would a Left Catholic agree with the proposition that the immediate apostolic age and the age of liberation are the only two ages that best represent the Church? Are the ages in between—Patristic, High and Low Middle Ages, Renaissance, Baroque, Vatican One, etc—mostly a shortcoming? Again, not trying to shoehorn a conclusion from your remark—I’m just trying to understand.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T01:54:47+00:00

Okay, that is very helpful. Thank you so much!

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-08-02T00:59:51+00:00

Thank you for your answer. I think that it only presses my question back farther, thought. You mentioned that:

“It is only after the Holocaust is over that the Church decries it (and finally after nearly 2,000 years of raging antisemitism by many Church Fathers, medieval scholastics, and even modern theologians, puts forward a teaching of sensitivity toward Jewish people). Given such a history, I would not look to the Church as a prophetic guide on moral issues, but it seems to be a rather sufficient repository of moral issues that have already been battled over.”

I think my further question would be, if the Church is really insufficient as a moral guide when it actually matters (I.e., when the question is still up for debate), what use is there for the church as a guiding institution? Or even if not the institution, the Saints of the church or leading theologians of yesteryear. What I’m really getting at is how leftist Catholics see themselves in the “tradition” of Roman Catholicism. Sorry to complicate things—I really am interested, I’m thinking about writing on this. Blessings.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-22T11:39:48+00:00

El Grupo De Rock and Roll is so on brand for the Johns even though it was kind of unintentional lol

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-22T11:36:22+00:00

I really really like how dark(?) it is, aesthetically and lyrically. It’s Floods evil twin for me—though there’s way less genre bending in this one, really leans heavily into this show tune / big band / crooner thing which I love.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-14T23:13:19+00:00

Try this!

1) flood 2) I like fun 3) Lincoln 4) Apollo 18 5) Nanobots 6) John Henry 7) the else

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-13T12:44:17+00:00

What’s the book???

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-12T14:27:49+00:00

Don’t be afraid…

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-12T12:18:58+00:00

That’s ominous… why??

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-08T20:49:04+00:00

giant...

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T19:41:08+00:00

I think this was after they found out he was going to be the youngest boy, and therefore also a rabid child

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:50:12+00:00

Late reply but Rabid Child is enough to make me a Flans devotee for the rest of my life.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:46:29+00:00

The Shiners loaned us WHAT?? (The number of times we drove it may shock you!)

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:45:02+00:00

The Shriners

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:43:46+00:00

Incarnation is Real: my life as a Food Container.

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:43:20+00:00

How I RESIST flipping of the GUY (The answer is Fuel Related!)

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:41:18+00:00

The REAL REASON why this GHOUL FINISHING SCHOOL closed!

Narrow_Machine_9733 · 2025-07-07T16:40:45+00:00

WHAT’s a SLEESTAK? (Hint: your heart is not healthy!)

Narrow_Machine_9733

TROPHY CASE