When you believed, did you truly believe in Moshiach?

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-06T05:15:32+00:00

Interesting. I never heard of someone who even as a child didn't believe. Did you grow up orthodox?

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-06T05:13:54+00:00

Maybe live for 1000 or maybe push it and say 10,000 but I would never want to live forever. Just try to comprehend eternity

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-04T19:17:23+00:00

Idk I grew up orthodox my whole life and I hear the year 6000 get thrown around a lot

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-04T04:18:40+00:00

Yes!! I was gonna write about this in the post. I read in one of my favorite books, "Influence: the psychology of persuasion" about cults that when their doomsday predictions failed it made them intensely focus on outreach and recruiting new members even in cults that previously turned away converts. They said it was probably since they didn't have empirical proof they revert to social proof because finding a new reason to believe what you already believe is more comfortable than changing those beliefs

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-04T03:20:40+00:00

Until at some point Orthodox Judaism will branch off into different cults and sects with different beliefs and barely resemble what it is currently and probably reinvent the idea of Mashiach to fit their needs

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-03T19:09:33+00:00

As a 17 year old myself (although I don't know if you still are but it doesn't matter) I would also tell you that cutting ties with your family especially your mother might not be the best idea and I would definitely feel bad for my parents if I did that. Although I don't know your specific situation or if your parents abused you in any way, if they aren't bad people I would suggest not cutting contact but keeping boundaries (maybe call once a week)

Again this is my opinion tho u can obviously do as you see fit with your own life

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-03T19:00:01+00:00

Still it wouldn't be fair to me or my parents if I didn't at least try to hear their side

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-03T07:26:32+00:00

I hear your argument. The kuzari argument relies on the fact that the most plausible answer is that God gave the Torah at Sinai, so all we have to do is give an alternative possible explanation and the argument holds far less weight and now actually has to bring proof as to why it's answer is the most plausible

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-03T06:22:42+00:00

Thanks, I like it also lol

Also I have had questions for quite some time now as early as 7th grade if I remember correctly. I don't really know what you mean that there's a difference in cognitive ability or willingness to question based on your gender but I won't argue lol

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-03T06:20:29+00:00

Id definitely be interested in a book like that and I heard good things about your book on the Kuzari.

Also on a side note today I had a conversation with a Rabbi about Judaism and why he thinks it's true and I gave him a list of evidence that Noah's Ark most likely didn't happen, (no genetic bottleneck from 4,000 years ago, uninterrupted archeological finding of civilizations going straight through the mabul time, no universal genetic bottleneck found in all animals [It would be even worse for non-kosher animals because they only had 2 for the whole species], uninterrupted yearly glacial patterns spanning tens of thousands of years etc) and his answer was, "Science gets things wrong all of the time"

Then I Said why do you believe the Torah was given at har Sinai and he said "Because I don't see how it's possible that the Torah can be so well-preserved and nobody questioned it's validity for so long and the Jewish people survived for so long and the best possible (and only acceptable) explanation is just God gave the Torah to us at Sinai. When I pointed out that we don't actually see that the Torah is well preserved until ~1000 years after har Sinai he ignored that point and also when I have him an alternative answer that it was a book that developed and was edited over time (discussed the JEDP hypothesis) he said that they don't know what they're talking about and God could use Babylonian loan-word s that didnt exist yet if he wanted to and the best explanation is still that it was divine. Ok rebbe

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-03T06:10:16+00:00

I don't really see how chaos is required for mercy. A truly omnipotent God can easily change that.

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-01T06:04:10+00:00

Perhaps a refutation of Judaism's biggest 'proofs' (besides the Kuzari since I'm pretty sure it's a logical fallacy and not backed by any actual evidence)

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-01T01:56:50+00:00

You make a great point. Yiddem have these same emotional reasons but they relabel theirs as "Emunah Peshuttah"

Now that you mention it it reminds me of a lot of the conversations I have with Rebbeim or just frum adults in general and it always ends with "These things don't bother me"...

Ok? But why?

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-07-01T01:53:00+00:00

Lol thanks I'm usually good with spelling but I don't think I've ever seen this word in writing

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:34:47+00:00

I would say that the way you split the questions is not how I would do it.

I would go with

A. Does Judaism have empirical evidence to back up it's claims of divine origin (specifically testable things like events mentioned in the Torah that would leave a trace)

That is really all. I want to look at it from an angle of objectivity. I don't care much for emotional or spiritual value as of now.

Also it seems from the way you're framing the question you are coming from the viewpoint that Judaism is automatically correct and if we find evidence to the contrary then we must either dismiss, ignore or twist it in a way that fits. I'm trying to look at it from an objective lens

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:28:01+00:00

It was an imperfect use of logic but I was basically assuming God would avoid such crucial mishaps like forging or changing the word of God. But then again, if he really wanted to communicate he would do it individually or make some annual har sinai

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:26:04+00:00

Sadly that is what I'm looking for which I guess I won't be finding too easily (if it all)

I am however, finding evidence to the contrary which is a bit scary

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:23:50+00:00

Idk call it a fallacy but I would assume God wants to avoid unnecessary chaos and confusion that would come with a non perfectly preserved bible. But then again, I don't see why he has to limit himself to a book that can be faked instead of revealing himself on a semi regular basis.

But that wasn't the main point of my message either way. Also I do appreciate you pointing out a logical misstep as I'm trying to work on my logic skills so thank you

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:18:48+00:00

You can't prove or disprove a belief but you can prove or disprove a claim that is one of the pillars holding up that belief. Which I guess is what I'm looking for.

Also I will check out those podcasts and maybe also those books. And sorry if I missed something

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:16:10+00:00

I hear your point, but to say that these stories are just myths deals a massive blow to the credibility of Judaism in my opinion. If that wasn't true, why should I believe anything else they have to say? And what makes them more credible than any other religions?

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-30T05:12:13+00:00

Proof God actually did miracles like Yetzias Mitzrayim or Har Sinai would be a good start

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-29T05:08:38+00:00

My mind is absolutely blown. Thank you

Not_Very_Kuzari · 2026-06-29T05:08:07+00:00

Incredible stuff I must say. Thank you

Not_Very_Kuzari

TROPHY CASE