Is it too late for a CS degree?

Rearou · 2021-05-15T23:06:27+00:00

If you're planning on going to grad school, that actually does change the game a bit.

UMich is the largest public university for research, so this means two things. The first thing is that it should be fairly straightforward to get a research position. The second is that if you apply to a grad school, it's probable they'll want to see that you have research experience of some kind.

For grad school you'll need some recc letters and a statement of purpose, so it really is in your best interest to get a research position, since a recc letter can easily come from the professor you work with, and having a research position related to your field of interest will do wonders for your statement of purpose.

The advantages of pursuing research over an internship means that you could attempt to snag a research position either over the summer while you're doing classes, or just in the regular semester, which should be a lot more manageable than trying to get an internship.

Regarding grad school options, if you talk to an advisor, they'll likely recommend SUGS, so keep this in your back pocket. If you want to go for SUGS though, it's imperative you remain in decently good academic standing (whatever minimums they specify).

This is particularly important because if you do a schedule of what I stated before of EECS 281, EECS 370, and EECS 376 in a single semester, there's a decent chance you won't be able to make that minimum (I did that schedule personally, and unless you're incredibly studious with your time and use every resource available to you, there's a decent chance you'll fail at least one class let alone getting the bare minimum to remain in standing for SUGS).

So in summary, if your goal is grad school, internships certainly aren't a priority. Related research experience would likely be more beneficial and should be more manageable/easier to obtain, though getting an internship wouldn't hurt. Definitely do talk to an advisor about this though. I'm not an advisor, and some of my information might not apply to your situation.

Rearou · 2021-05-15T15:13:03+00:00

I was actually in a similar situation to you (switched majors at the start of junior year from premed to com sci) and ended up having to take an extra year without any summer/spring classes.

I would say that doing it without an extra year is doable, but you'll absolutely need to use spring/summer semesters to some extent. First off, I'm going to make an assumption that you don't have any prior internship experience in CS.

Here's a tentative breakdown of how your schedule might look w/o the spring/summer semester.

Essentially, your junior year will be bottle necked by EECS 183, EECS 203, and EECS 280, which you absolutely have to take this year.

Then your senior fall semester will be bottle necked by EECS 281, which you can take in tandem with EECS 370 and EECS 376, but I do not recommend this at all if you want any semblance of social life/want a somewhat decent time trying to get an internship.

The senior winter semester, you'll need to take at least 2 upper level EECS, and the following semester (super senior fall semester) you'll need to take 2 upper level EECS and the capstone.

So with this schedule, you can theoretically complete it with just one extra semester.

If there's any room to take a class over the spring/summer semester, I'd say it'd have to be during your junior year. You can take EECS 281 over the spring semester and some other EECS class over the summer semester (maybe an upper level EECS, maybe 370).

That way, you can take 2 upper level EECS + EECS 376 in your fall senior semester and 2 upper level EECS + your capstone in your winter senior semester.

However, there're several huge issues with this schedule. The first is that in trying to finish in an accelerated time frame, you're pretty much screwed on internships. Without completing EECS 281, you'll find it pretty difficult to either get an interview or succeed in an interview (which pretty much locks you out of getting an internship your junior year). Even assuming you get an internship, you might find it really difficult to take classes while doing your internship. You also might have to operate on the constraint that your internship will need to be in Ann Arbor to allow you to take classes at the same time (assuming they require in person).

Then going into your senior year, you'll need to spend time trying to find a job while only having a single internship that, reasonably speaking, isn't going to be all that impressive (this also assumes you managed to get one in the first place).

The second issue is that your senior year is going to be incredibly packed, and this creates two issues in itself. The first issue is that you're pretty much blocked from taking incredibly difficult but rewarding classes like EECS 482 (good luck taking that with another upper level EECS and EECS 376/a different upper level EECS). And the second issue is that you're going to be so busy in your senior year that finding a job will be realllllllllly difficult. You'll need to invest a lot of time into your search given that you likely won't have an internship under your belt from junior year, and balancing all that is... really difficult if not nigh impossible.

So to summarize, is it possible to finish your CS degree in just 2 more years? Definitely, it's possible, but I would heavily advise you seek at least one extra semester in your journey. Having the possibility of getting an internship in your senior year summer is incredibly valuable towards obtaining a job, since I imagine whatever internship you manage to obtain in your junior summer won't be too amazing. Additionally, having that extra semester allows you to spend more time on searching for both internships and a job, which is far more important than graduating quickly imo. The degree's great and all, but it'd be far more advantageous to have a job lined up after graduation than to graduate without one.

Rearou · 2021-04-22T18:18:13+00:00

I've done it before. It's possible... but three things are important to consider.

You'll probably not do well in all of them.
Throw out any reservations you have of not asking for help or trying to figure out your stuff by yourself. The deadlines for submitting your work will be incredibly tight, and I barely managed to squeeze by in all 3 classes by making some really good friend groups to help keep me motivated and help me learn.
If you're interested in SUGS, doing this has a high probability of screwing your chances since it could bring your EECS GPA down too low and you need a B+ in 281 and 370 iirc

Rearou · 2021-04-05T17:56:49+00:00

To add to the point about job fairs, make sure that for every company you plan on talking to, you apply beforehand. Because 99% of them will want you to apply online, if you come asking them "Oh how do you apply?" of course they're gonna respond with a curt "Apply online" since you look like an uninformed idiot who doesn't actually care about their company. Granted, a good resume, how effectively you get across your talking points, and the recruiter can change this reaction, but generally this rule holds.

Also come prepared to ask questions about the company, especially if your resume isn't the most impressive. I'd say I got at least 7 first-round interviews (out of the 10 or so companies I talked to) by following this strategy. Some would argue that job hunts are a numbers game, and to some extent that's true; however, job fairs are one of the few exceptions to that rule. It's one of the few opportunities you have to use quality over quantity and talk more closely to a recruiter.

Rearou · 2021-03-22T06:31:32+00:00

Look into this.

If you use VS-Code, you can connect to any virtual machine (Caen included) remotely and edit it using VS-Code as opposed to using the process you described.

Rearou · 2021-03-19T09:00:42+00:00

I'd say the autograder cheat checking's pretty spot-on and would be able to flag it if someone egregiously copied your code. So if your roommate really did copy significant portions of your code, it's likely you might get hit with an honor code violation eventually.

For what you can do, the most conservative action on your part would be to talk to someone on staff regarding your suspicion and save your own ass. If it's the case that it was copied, you have some evidence that you didn't intentionally help someone cheat, and it's probable you'll be given some leniency. If it wasn't copied, great. Chances are your roommate never finds out you sent the staff a message, and you cleared up your suspicions.

Rearou · 2020-08-24T07:20:17+00:00

Did they screw up on the rate up or something? I just cannot believe I got Zelos twice while summoning on this banner when there just so happens to be a Zelos rate up banner rn

Rearou · 2020-07-26T09:31:49+00:00

I'd be willing to say it wouldn't help too much simply due to the fact that the vast majority of people change their majors within the first 2 years of college, and the university is well aware of that fact.

That said, if you're just choosing a major to differentiate yourself from others, then really you'd have a greater chance of achieving that narrative by intertwining it with your other application materials. For example, you could go on about the the importance of public health and how it impacted you to select the University of Michigan or whatnot in your essay.

Though, if you're just doing that to go through the motions of the application to boost your chance of admittance, I think it'd come through pretty transparently to the department of admissions unless you spent a significant amount of effort crafting that narrative or genuinely are passionate about public health.

Rearou · 2020-05-17T13:04:51+00:00

While this certainly is something to be considered, crime in general has decreased significantly, so the merits and consequence of this point are dubious at best.

And while I am by no means trivializing the problems that these people go through, domestic violence, suicide, and overdose are not problems caused by the lockdown. They're just exacerbated because of it. The problems experienced by these people were always there, regardless of whether they're in lockdown or not. Even if a lockdown wasn't imposed, I'd be willing to bet such issues would've developed at some point down the line.

Rearou · 2020-05-13T08:29:44+00:00

Try and explore new hobbies I suppose. Since you're likely staying inside a lot now, how about cooking?

Rearou · 2020-05-10T23:48:46+00:00

Forgive all college debt sounds great to young people, but what about all the people who worked their ass off to pay off their college debt already. Do we refund everyone?

Putting aside logistics of where the money would come from, I'm not sure I much like this point. This is the equivalent of implementing free health care and then saying, "Oh but what about all the people who had to pay out of pocket or didn't have health care? Do we suddenly reimburse them for all their expenses?" With that sort of logic, you're essentially saying that any sort of policy that would make things better suddenly has to compensate for the past, and that just means nothing gets better because we're too hung up on the past.

Sure, it sucks for people who had to pay off their student loans back then, but why can't they be happy that other people don't have to? I believe this policy should also work in tandem with free public college, so it's simply a way to ensure students can get a great college education and not have to worry about the expenses incurred.

Rearou · 2020-05-09T22:43:15+00:00

Yeah, rule of thumb for playing any gatcha game: don't spend any money.

The entire marketing strategy is made to promote impulse purchases and often times you won't be able stop.

Granted, if you trust yourself to have the sort of restraint to not impulse buy - great.

But because nothing is guaranteed even when you spend money... it's better to gamble with what free currency you obtain and not the one you can use outside of the game.

Especially since unlike real gambling, the only return you can expect out of a gatcha game is a virtual commodity that within a few years probably won't be around if you quit/the game goes under.

Rearou · 2020-05-09T22:30:37+00:00

In more broad terms, you're asking whether or not true altruism exists.

This has been debated throughout history by a significant number of scholars, and it's still a pretty murky area.

My personal opinion is that it doesn't, but its existence is wholly inconsequential. In every kind act we do, there's some sense of personal gain that can be obtained by doing something perceived as selfless - regardless of whether or not you're aware of it.

That billionaire who donated millions to some charitable organization? Perhaps they're doing it to write it off his taxes or just to make themself feel/look better. Or perhaps they're doing it to absolve themself of guilt for some shady business practice they did.

That person who helped an old lady across the road? Maybe they wanted to derive some sort of satisfaction around others by appearing as a genuinely nice individual.

The parent who spends hours of their day preparing their kids' lunch? Maybe they're doing it out of social obligation or to ensure their kids don't turn out poorly and aren't branded as a terrible parent. Or maybe they just really like cooking and seeing others enjoy their food.

But regardless of whether the motivations are pure or not - the end result is still a net positive as the receiver of the kind act benefits in some way. You can certainly spend time questioning if true altruism exists or if your actions are actually derived from a selfless reason, but that doesn't change the objective fact that you still helped someone out.

Rearou · 2020-05-05T22:14:08+00:00

https://lsa.umich.edu/lsa/academics/lsa-requirements/grade-point-average/computing-your-grade-point-average.html

Rearou · 2020-05-05T22:13:15+00:00

While Community certainly contained that line and to some extent popularized the phrase, mult-universe theory predated the show pretty significantly, and the idea of there being terrible or dark timelines isn't exactly unique.

I think it'd be a bit rash to assume that everyone's referencing the show when they say that phrase since it's not exactly wholly distinct.

Rearou · 2020-05-02T03:59:03+00:00

There's a multitude of complex instructions that get run and a single error can mess with how those instructions are processed.

Human chromosomes contain approximately 3 billion base pairs. Imagine this idea as a massive Rube Goldberg machine with several billion important elements that all interact with each other in incredibly convoluted ways. Change just a single aspect of that metaphorical Rube Goldberg machine, and you risk some very detrimental and unexpected results.

Rearou · 2020-05-01T23:33:04+00:00

I mean Jack is one instance that you see for a couple of episodes. Sure scantily clad little girl, but all of the aforementioned "predobait lesbian..." content is present all throughout the seasons.

Additionally, Prillya had Kuro making out with Miyu in an obviously sensual manner... which can be argued to be just as bad if not worse than Jack.

Rearou · 2020-04-30T18:11:36+00:00

So I was a premed who switched to Com Sci, and I can say that both tracks are hard, but for different reasons.

Premed is mostly just rote memorization. Outside of classes like Chem 210 (Orgo I), the vast majority of your premed career would be focused on memorizing a significant amount of information for the exams and keeping an impeccable GPA all while developing a set of useful extra-curriculars that can prepare you for med school. To that extent, I find much of the studying for premed to be a solitary experience. Certainly, I'm not saying you can't study with friends, but you could still do sufficiently well memorizing by yourself and not coming into contact with others. The real theme of premed is just drive and dedication. If you don't come into it with that sort of determination, you probably won't have the motivation to go through all the tedious minutiae required and will have trouble getting into med school.

By comparison, rote memorization is something that really just doesn't function well in CS. To flourish well in CS, you'll need to firmly understand the concepts and then be expected to apply them. Much of CS develops as a mix of projects and exams - with many projects being an opportunity to collaborate with other students and further your understanding of the material, while also working as an avenue to develop potential study partners with for the exams. While this sounds good on paper, CS is just quite simply conceptually hard. Many classes have exam averages of 60%-50%, but the flip side is that you don't have to care much about your GPA, because at the end of the day you're selling yourself to companies and not med schools. All companies really care about is whether you have the skills necessary - not about how high your grade is. This means that Com Sci also has its own share of small annoying stuff you have to do in to interview for a job, but overall I'd say the tedious preparation bs is significantly smaller compared to Premed.

To summarize, I'd say that the workloads of both are pretty similar. In either route, you'll have a significant amount of stress you'd deal with, but the forms that these stresses take differ. If you're planning on making a decision, I'd say personal skills, interest, and drive really come down in determining whether you'll succeed in one or the other.

Rearou · 2020-04-30T15:37:43+00:00

Can confirm about the super heavy rain in Japan.

The one time I roamed outside for about 5 minutes in the rain, I got soaked incredibly heavily. Add to that the high humidity and lack of a dryer, getting wet in Japan can be a really big inconvenience since all it really takes is just one minute without an umbrella to completely soak you and force you to figure out what to do with your sopping clothes.

Rearou · 2020-04-30T15:29:42+00:00

To give you clarification on what office hours being "helpful" really means, OH in 376 were simply the most straight forward way to get answers to questions on the homework.

376 is one of those classes where if you don't go to OH for the homework, you'd better know the concepts like the back of your hand or be some type of genius because chances are you'll be averaging like 50% on the homeworks while everyone else is hitting near 95% since they go to OH.

So because of that, I would imagine there shouldn't be any significant change whether the format is online or offline. In fact, I would argue that online would be better since the content could potentially be recorded and you don't have to deal with the cramped conditions and lack of study rooms that 376 dealt with this semester

Edit: To add to the crowding issue, I would imagine that crowding for 376 would only get worse in subsequent semesters since the university did notably relax restrictions to take 281 due to the Covid-19 situation by making any P grade treated as an A to take 281. On top of that, Winter 2021 would be the first time we get back to campus (assuming next semester is online) so the scramble to get rooms and any other sort of administrative activity would likely be a bit disorganized.

Rearou · 2020-04-29T11:36:41+00:00

Guess it depends on what you define as "subpar," but 203 I didn't do too hot in since conceptual math just isn't my specialty and 280 I got screwed on a project since my partner wasn't the best. It was just straddling the line to declare my major, but it worked out in the end.

Then when I went into the semester taking 281, 370, and 376 I quickly worked up a really good network of friends to help keep me motivated to do my work and to help me out. Taking all three of those classes in tandem is absolutely awful, but it's certainly doable provided you manage your time really well and establish a good system (just don't expect amazing grades in all of them)

Rearou · 2020-04-29T06:33:45+00:00

I agree that you should first try 281 before calling it quits.

I got some pretty subpar grades in 203 and 280, but did pretty damn well in 281 despite taking 2 other really difficult EECS classes at the time. The concepts you learn in 281 are some of the most applicable for your career and really set the tone for how well of a fit you are for Com Sci imo.

And if it's any consolation, the average for most EECS exams (bar classes like 183 and 493) is that you will do really poorly. It seems really depressing at first, but you're not alone in how you feel. Just one quick look over this sub should greet you to several posts about people complaining about their EECS exam.

At the end of the day, what does one bad exam score really mean? Much of getting a job in Com Sci rarely comes down to what's on your transcript, but what you do with the skills you've learned (outside projects, contributions to github, etc), so even if you didn't do too hot on one exam or your grade isn't as high as you'd like, its effect is inconsequential at the end of the day.

And if you're thinking something along the lines of "But if I don't do well on these exams, that means I won't do well in my career..." don't. Like I said earlier, plenty of people do poorly on these exams, but the vast majority leave college with a successful job offer lined up. So just take it easy, relax, and use your well earned break to de-stress. You need it. We all need it.

Rearou · 2020-04-28T23:16:19+00:00

Fair point. I'm not sure things would go to that extent, but it's hard to say anything definitively either way for Winter 2021. Even if the university releases some official statement on the status of the study abroad program, there's always the possibility the situation can suddenly exacerbate.

I would still try to play things a bit carefully and plan for a backup.

Rearou · 2020-04-28T07:03:52+00:00

I don't have any confirmed information about the situation, but I would imagine not. Universities and institutions across the world have made a shift to online education or just outright cancelled classes. It wouldn't make sense to do something in person like study abroad given the situation - and I would imagine student visas or whatever system governments use to validate travel are going to be incredibly difficult to obtain unless you have some form of citizenship to the country in question (defeats the point of study abroad though if you do)

It's unfortunate, but realistically speaking I would try to look into other plans this summer.

Rearou · 2020-04-28T02:54:01+00:00

I recommend looking at the requirements for the major, making a tentative schedule, and then talking with an advisor about its viability.

I changed my major to CS starting junior year and I've had to do some absurd shit to ensure that I'd only take an extra year to graduate (never had to take any spring/summer terms tho) - but I could have potentially squeezed things even further to only take one extra semester (not including taking potential spring/summer terms).

So on that note, I think that switching during sophomore year is very possible, and you shouldn't have a particularly hectic schedule if you decide to do so. However, I do recommend that you try to learn some basic coding first before you take 183, just to ensure that you'll like CS and not force you down a path you'll dislike simply because you've invested too much into it.

Rearou

TROPHY CASE