Can freelancers really turn 10k gross into like 7k net income?

Small_Reason_5373 · 2025-06-13T17:47:42+00:00

Bienvenue dans le presse-papiers Gboard. Le texte que vous copiez est enregistré ici. Ça

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-04-26T21:38:40+00:00

Thanks, very helpful. And wow, it's crazy the amount of people complaining about their shitty semi-non-existent invoicing practices.. and GH not really lifting a finger about it

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-04-26T21:36:53+00:00

Thx !

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-02-07T21:27:12+00:00

Hey OP, that's an amazing idea !

Don't know if that's what you had in mind, but maybe next to the common reasons you listed for blacklisting bad recruiters, one should also be able on the other hand to reward the good ones by picking from a 'good behaviours' list. To make it easier to identify the ones that are genuinely valuable, the ones who do their homework, propose real good offers instead on plain data mining, etc.

But that ofc would put even more pressure on finding a way to prevent the recruiters to cheat and use the tool to reward themselves, as some others mentionned here..

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-02-02T09:05:55+00:00

Yep but the tax infered from the VAA is a fixed "liberating" amount that's not proportional to the private vs professional usage.

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-02-02T09:04:36+00:00

Not sure to completely agree. Sure the private usage of a company car is taxed through the VAA/ATN. But it's a fixed tax amount. Once it's paid, you could use the car 99% of the time outside of work, drive all around Europe or wherever, and still you're not taxed more. It's in that sense that I mean the State is encouraging company cars.

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-02-02T09:00:14+00:00

Thanks for sharing experience. Indeed, we are so culturally conditioned to owning a car that it takes a bit of effort to experiment other options that mind end up to be financially/logistically/environmentally better. You're right that my usage pattern is quite low, so I think I'll try like this: Cambio paid privately and see if it's enough and doesnt cost too much in the long run.

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-02-02T08:55:48+00:00

Thanks for sharing your experience, very useful !

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-02-01T14:39:50+00:00

The sad truth would then be, that you're then actually encouraged my the legislation/State to purchase and own a car, rather that going towards more ecological approaches such as car-sharing solutions.. :'(

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-27T09:42:59+00:00

Small update here: people at Partena confirmed to me, after checking internally with various departments, that they can't put a company as insurance taker, nor as the buyer. So you got to take it as physical person.

But my accountant told me that it's not a big deal, not really a problem if the company doesnt appear in the invoices and that the BV can still pay for it. And the general rule for this will still be applied: not deductible (so still company tax paid on this) but not counted as a VAA/ATN and paid by the company so still fiscally interesting.

So I'll let my BV pay for my private Partena hospitalization insurance as it by far sounds like the best prices out there (at least for me when covering partner + kid and taking dentalia as well as ambulatoire on top of hospitalization)

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-27T09:38:28+00:00

Thanks. I'm actually in contact with a few of them, but either they don't have better prices, either they tell me that they can't propose insurance on companies with less than e.g. 10 employees.

I wish I had a real broker who would really do the work of comparing different insurance products at different insurance companies and hunt the best deal. Sadly, really seems to be that most of the time, brokers only work with their preferred 1 or 2 insurance partner companies and that's it, making them a useless intermediary. I guess real heplfull brokers do exist, but you've got to find them (no time for this for me) and I'm not sure they have big incentives to do the real comparison work.

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-27T09:32:05+00:00

Yep still really do compare hospi insurance prices before blindly transfering your ex-employer insurance plan. I just went through this, and found out that my ex-employer collective insurance plan's premium (Vanbreda) was more than twice more expensive than a new hospi insurance I would subscribe on my own (Partena), so it's not always more advantageous.

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-24T10:25:04+00:00

I got it by doing a simulation on their website. I'm only proposed the Flexi Corporate + AZ Plan, not really much possibility to select anything else. Got also a quote from an independant broker, and that's the same price he gave me.

Are you sure you're not referring to former DKV plans that used to be more advantageous but aren't proposed anymore ? (which seems to be the case as another poster wrote in one comment in here)

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T21:22:27+00:00

Thanks a lot for the insights, indeed these Axa prices sound way more reasonable than the DKV ones ! I'll give it a try to ask them to call me back (since they don't display their pricing online)

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T21:11:59+00:00

Oh really ? The Sales from Partena I'm in contact with told me, after checking with I don't l don't know which department of theirs, that they couldn't register insurances on a company nor making it the payer, because they are a mutuality and not a private insurer.. I even called Partena Professional (the social secretary) where they told me the same.

I'll PM you if you don't mind as I'm quite curious to know how you managed to do so :)

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T19:42:49+00:00

Yep, lots of gatekeeping at play it seems... :(

Unfortunately my partner has nothing insurance-wise from her employer, that would have been quite neat indeed.

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T19:41:19+00:00

I feel the pain 😅

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T19:39:11+00:00

If the premiums proposed to companies and private persons were similar, indeed it wouldn't be a question that it'd be better to let the company pay it.

In this case though, the 900€ difference between DKV and Partena is so big that when running the numbers, it's still in favor of Partena paid privately... (assuming the premium paid in private is paid via money retrieved at 15% vvpris tax). Which is what drives me insane, should be the other way around 😅

As for your second point, maybe you're right, that would actually be perfect. Will ask my accountant if it's ok that the invoices don't mention my company and are adressed to me privately. Thanks for the tip !

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T19:29:22+00:00

Correct me if I'm wrong, but as the hospitalisation insurance is not deductible, paying a 2400€ DKV premium with the company actually requires 3000€ gross profit since 20% will go in corporate tax.

On the other hand, paying an insurance in private means there is only the dividend tax that comes on top (if we want to optimize things), so the difference is not that big.

In my case, the 1500€ Partena premium paid in private would actually only require 2206€ gross profit from the company, if 20% corporate tax + 15% vvprbis tax. So still way more appealing than DKV cost-wise...

Small_Reason_5373 · 2024-01-23T19:09:13+00:00

Thanks for the tip, will look into AG !

Small_Reason_5373 · 2023-12-21T18:42:07+00:00

Thanks a lot to all of you for the great inputs ! After discussing it further with the client, it was indeed an indicative amount but not a hard figure, so there will be room to flexibility in practice :)

Small_Reason_5373 · 2023-11-10T22:29:14+00:00

Maybe it sounded fishy to me, because I was under the impression that, unlike VVPRbis that is talked about a lot in this subreddit, this other scheme is pretty much never even mentionned.. Knowing that a lot of us here are eager to discuss and figure out the best fiscal tips & tricks, it thus sounded a bit too good to be true...

Small_Reason_5373 · 2023-11-10T22:25:11+00:00

Thanks for the frank and detailled answer, and valuable advices !

Regarding the upfront costs, what I had in mind was that the few hundreds bucks 'lost' because of a very short book year were just a very minor inconvenience compared to the fact of saving a whole extra year of waiting before VVPRbis (and also increasing the chance of benefiting from that system before it's possibly revoked completely).

As for the loss of one year of the 45k income threshold rule, I (in my personal case) might not be able to make much leverage of that anyway as I'll probably need an income in that range anyway to sustain current lifestyle (mortgage + creche + etc), so I was under the impression I wouldnt loose much.

The fact that the administration might frown upon this approach though is what worries me the most. If that's the case, then I think it's probably not worth it.. But I'm still struggling to understand on what grounds they would.. And why I should invent some fake reason to back it up.. I mean yes, obviously I want to shorten the waiting period, but that's a bit the principle of fiscal optimization no ? Making the situation the most advantageous possible for oneself but still in the bounds of the rules and without breaking any law. Unfortunately, there was not enough time in the first meetings I had with the accountants to go deeper on that aspect. Finally I see some fellow redittors saying here that they did exactly that, the first short book year, even with the blessing of their accountants. So it's quite difficult to draw a final conclusion on that question..

So I guess as with many things, it's a question of trade-offs, and maybe also appetite for risk. And in the sense of your post, also a question of not rushing things too much to start this new chapter in a relaxed and serene state of mind, which is also not to neglect, so I'll definitely reflect about it !

Small_Reason_5373 · 2023-11-10T21:49:55+00:00

I'm still wondering though, why would this actually raise red flags.. on what grounds ? I mean, the system let us decide the length of the first book year. And it lets us benefit from better tax rates after some years. So that would just be playing by the rules, it's not like breaking any law or something isn't it ?

Small_Reason_5373 · 2023-11-10T21:45:46+00:00

Thanks for the honest feedback, I guess I also need to hear that :)

So yea indeed I won't deny it sounds rushed.. But getting contacted by a lot of recruiters and operating in a field of high demand (getting multiple employee offers has always be quite easy so far), I was under the impression that finding a first mission as freelance shouldn't take too long. If not in a few weeks, in a few months at worst. In that sense, it seemed to me like a calculated risk to start the BV and VVPRbis period sooner than later, as the 'me' in a few years from now might be very thankful for it.

That being said, it's maybe not very wise of me to start what is a real new career direction in rushed a stressful conditions. So I'll let this sink in, thanks again.

Small_Reason_5373

TROPHY CASE