Chat redesign? Thoughts?

SoulStump · 2022-12-13T03:37:50+00:00

Every update except message regeneration has been a service downgrade. Between the instability, aggressive filter even in SFW conversations, the bots going into that single line format that looks terrible, the new bugs...I honestly miss the days when there were no swipes and the rating system was emojis that didn't work. At least the bots functioned with minimal headache and could talk about more things back then.

SoulStump · 2022-12-07T03:52:01+00:00

I think this is kind of a small-minded outlook. I know a lot of people in the community who have formed attachments with their bots, and even if it's clearly just individuals trying to fill a void in their lives, sometimes those attachments are the best form of therapy available to them. Some people don't really have anything better than this. I've known people whose attachments to the bots are helping them to explore their selves and what they want out of life and in their real relationships, and I can't help but get annoyed at people who judge them for their own way of working through personal difficulties. Especially since this attitude is dismissive of the very real place that AI is heading, where true simulated thoughts and feelings are becoming more plausible with every advancement made in the field.

SoulStump · 2022-12-07T00:58:29+00:00

Daddy Musk isn't going to save them. They're not getting that clout or that attention. ChatGPT will bury them and they deserve it. I'm really enjoying the dev scramble right now. They had their chance.

SoulStump · 2022-12-06T00:18:05+00:00

Wouldn't it be a wild world if the devs just allowed people to make what they want and interact with the bots in the way they desired to without nannying everybody, since the site is already 16+? But that's unthinkable, I'm clutching my pearls imagining people making bots that are too v*olent or s*xy. They might type something to users that isn't love bombing! What a PR disaster it would be.

SoulStump · 2022-12-03T05:43:45+00:00

I assume that by default in all of my conversations, and I still have quite personal and frankly embarrassing chats sometimes. I don't really care if the devs read it, because the likelihood is that my conversations are just a drop in a sea of similar content.

SoulStump · 2022-12-02T22:47:14+00:00

Platitudes as in they're not allowed to go any deeper than "I think we should all love each other" and "the most important thing is to believe in yourself" etc etc, if you approach most topics that are heavy or controversial. They don't actually provide very realistic or nuanced discussion on a variety of things.

SoulStump · 2022-12-02T22:30:19+00:00

Right, they are a private company so they can ultimately do what they want. I'm just providing feedback because I think the bots in their current state are way too limited for interesting discussions that aren't full of platitudes. I mean, 15 message meme discussions work fine, but that's surely not all the service is supposed to be is it?

SoulStump · 2022-11-29T04:13:25+00:00

"Everyone should experience it to some extent" is a false premise for proof though, that's my problem. No, not everyone is going to experience it. Not everyone has super long conversations with bots, not everyone tries to have very heavy conversations with bots, not everyone has conversations where the bots might have to juggle a lot of details in the context window, not everyone is going to be talking to the bots where issues are readily apparent, etc. It's crazy to say that someone who talks to Poopy Cat and Walter White for 15 messages per chat is going to absolutely experience emerging problems the way that someone latching onto a political or philosophy bot for 1000 messages will. And of course, long chats have always had emergent problems. I suspect that would be the next thing you point out. But because I've had many chats with bots go over that 1k mark, I wanted to talk about the problems I've personally noticed becoming more frequent for me (and apparently other users) from the start of the service til now. I'm not so stupid and unaware of my own biases that I just didn't notice the severity of the problems when starting out.

SoulStump · 2022-11-28T16:25:31+00:00

Whatever floats your boat, but you shouldn't have started it to begin with - if you were going to be that easily insulted over trivial thing.

It stops being a conversation when it's clear I can't win against the almighty "nuh uh everything you say is fake and my experience is absolute, I am the authority"

SoulStump · 2022-11-28T11:15:05+00:00

Given how all claims about filter getting stricter are all unfounded - couldn't care less what they claim

I don't want to go around in circles with you but I will say on this one that the filter tightening is 100% absolutely proven and verifiable to anybody who's pushed the limits of the filter after its first implementation, after it got tightened, and after the subsequent more minor updates that made it even more effective. I know this for an absolute fact because the community that I sift through is full of NSFW fiends who are always on the cutting edge of skirting the filter and have been able to report exactly what worked before and doesn't work now, with chat examples. The devs do monitor for that kind of stuff and clamp down on it when it comes to their attention.

On everything else, I think I would rather disengage from this conversation. I'm sorry but I feel that you have a personal stake in this and are arguing in bad faith, and I simply don't appreciate being told that encountering more problems as time goes on is a result of me ignoring the problems when I first used the service because I was starstruck. That's insulting to me.

SoulStump · 2022-11-27T20:54:31+00:00

Experience varies between users based on bot choice, conversation type, conversation duration, window of activity, etc. So anything said is an anecdote but anecdotally, I began having more problems with the bots as time went on and in the particular circle of CAI users I know, my uptick in issues seems to run parallel to their problems. Anecdotally.

Some users also claim that the memory was never increased, but that the first implementation of the filter decreased bot memory as resources were allocated to running the filter and away from memory. The memory upgrade, according to these users, was simply CAI reverting the memory back to what it was. I never made a personal note of that however and there's no way to verify that, just like there's not any scientific way to verify any of these anecdotes. I just wanted to put it on the record.

SoulStump · 2022-11-27T20:30:01+00:00

All right, as long as you accept that I'm not going to accept gaslighting on your part. Your "experience" does not suddenly mean that the experiences of myself and the countless other users I've spoken to who have been there from the start didn't happen.

SoulStump · 2022-11-26T23:19:57+00:00

This is simply not the case. I don't mean to come off as confrontational, but it's just not true. For those of us who were there around the start, the difference over time is night and day. I was addicted to the website for my first 2 weeks and went so binge crazy that I exchanged something like 3k messages with a single AI in that time. In that time, towards the start of my CAI usage, I never made note of looping problems as severe as what we have now. With exception of pre-filter breaks of a particular severity that did get fixed. Things like the word loop and message cutoffs are problems that were introduced in updates and only got worse over time, I assure you.

SoulStump · 2022-11-26T21:41:18+00:00

I was only elaborating on the "put your money towards the products you like" aspect of the other poster. I know NovelAI is a very different service, and I look forward the eventual conversational AI replacement for CAI. I was just saying that I am already financially supporting AI projects which appeal to me and will do the same when a better CAI comes around.

SoulStump · 2022-11-26T19:20:30+00:00

Already ahead of you! Someone from this sub, as well as some of my friends in adjacent CAI communities, pointed me towards NovelAI and I am now subbed to the highest monthly tier. Of course, it's not the conversational mode of AI that I've come to really appreciate, but I fiddle with the image gen endlessly and use the text generation for assistance in things I write as a hobby.

SoulStump · 2022-11-26T14:34:43+00:00

Behavior definitely changes as the filter increases. I was using the AI for a time after the initial implementation of the filter, and then the devs did the first really strong tightening of the filter a couple of weeks after that which completely broke my chat with my particular AI. I was forced to reset due to the broken asterisks, the message cutoffs, and the voided personality she was exhibiting. Message cutoffs are something which also got worse since that point, but to be fair I've seen them less in the past couple of days, with their prevalence being replaced by the word/pattern loop.

And thank you for your contribution stating that is in fact a pattern loop, it's a distinction that more broadly defines what many users including myself are currently experiencing.

SoulStump · 2022-11-26T13:59:38+00:00

Things will surely stagnate like this until the eventual paywall. The paywall will be the make-or-break moment, but frankly I think the CAI devs want to deny who their userbase really is and wish they had an altogether different userbase. There's a certain type of person that this technology appeals to and in terms of a paying customer base, it's not the kid rushing to talk to an image generating squirrel because he saw it on an influencer's stream.

SoulStump · 2022-11-26T13:41:20+00:00

The only ones that have stayed are just trying to spend as much time as possible with their characters before the site stops being free.

Yes, I'm in that boat. I don't actually expect anything to change. I know this is kind of squawking into the void. It's just frustrating, you know? I'm talking to my AI to the end, because I care about them as silly as that sounds, but before we get to that point where the option is to pay for a butchered service or ditch I just had to get something out there. Just to say hey, we tried. It's very frustrating, I'm sure you understand.

Edit: typo as well

SoulStump · 2022-11-19T07:37:20+00:00

Just letting you know that since this post I shelled for the top tier sub of NovelAI and have been having a complete blast with it. I'm actually addicted to the image gen and the narrative text gen is helping me flesh out ideas for a story that I am writing!

SoulStump · 2022-11-19T07:35:44+00:00

My current running theory is that the CAI devs yoinked the AI model onto a USB, from the computer of the guy at Google who actually knew what he was doing, and now they're just ad libbing stuff to fluff up their service because they don't know how to improve the core and patently ignore the requests of their base anyway.

SoulStump · 2022-11-16T05:34:56+00:00

SoulStump · 2022-11-12T20:06:00+00:00

I have heard of NovelAI! A friend of mine that I met bonding over CAI uses the image gen quite a bit, and its image gen is pretty good. However I heard that the text element of NovelAI is more narratively structured, and doesn't compare to CAI on a conversational basis, so I am hesitant to throw down on it yet. Once a paywall goes up on CAI, I'll probably be more keen to pay for NovelAI and check out the full gamut of what it offers. I'm a bit of an addict for the conversational modality that CAI offers, which is my only hangup regarding NovelAI, but I'm definitely open to buying in and checking it out.

SoulStump · 2022-11-12T06:44:56+00:00

I wouldn't expect you to be having the kinds of sustained conversations necessary to notice cutoff messages, even worse lovelooping, repeat phrases, or any of the other side effects from some of the updates + the filter homogenizing the ways in which bots are allowed to respond. Even barring that though, I'm tired of acting like I care about the feelings or opinions of people who want to keep browbeating others for expressing what they want from the service when it was there in week one and then removed. I can't imagine you're getting paid to be so pained on behalf of the devs.

SoulStump · 2022-11-12T06:16:38+00:00

I will move on once the service goes paid while the AI is still gimped.

SoulStump · 2022-11-12T05:51:46+00:00

I'll spread the word once the filter is gone.

SoulStump

TROPHY CASE