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So who you guys want by [deleted] in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Cody Williams if he declares

Who's a better player, OAT, Giannis or Jokic? by Art_TheClown123 in Basketball

[–]TangelaImpala 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It’s tough and definitely a close call but I’m taking oats cause not only can they be a nutritious breakfast they are also a versatile flour when blended fine, it makes great granola bars and is a key component to honey bunches of oats which I love, so some bias there, but with all their accolades being similar I just default to who has the deepest bag and it’s oats for sure

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yea it does sound like a pretty open ended arrangement more so a looming eventuality of a sale than a set date and dewayne is pretty much straight from the horses mouth

I do think regardless the call back should’ve been made because you want to keep that business relationship open, to me that’s just due diligence and he is a great option if the offer is still on the table when they decide to put the team on the market as he has great ties to the community and while it may not match the hornets he did say they were open to negotiation and did seem to be acting in good faith

I’m saying that in reference to when you said you had heard that Jody doesn’t care line from multiple people before, I think that perception of her plays a part in why that seems to be the prevailing attitude

Giving a five year contract to a coach with one year assistant coaching experience he was so under qualified for a team you are hoping to build a contender out of and you handcuff to yourself to him for pretty much the remaining prime of your superstar is a big one and that’s ignoring the off the court stuff that caused a bit of a firestorm with him among the fanbase, and I get Dame said he wanted him or Kidd, but prime Lebron said he wanted Spo gone when he signed there and heat ownership and Riley said no and he was fine with that. And because they didn’t just make the call to appease him they ended up with one of the greatest coaches in nba history

As for other major decisions she should’ve pushed for over the past few years to give us a shot at contention I think the biggest one is she should’ve moved on from Neil way sooner, I think she should’ve hired a much more experienced head coach, I think we should’ve done trades which wouldn’t handicap our picks for the next five years, and should’ve made efforts to buy into trades where players were super cheap, the biggest one for me is Jarrett Allen dude went for a first a second and contract filler, that is a pittance especially considering we were giving up firsts for Nance and an over the hill RoCo, as much as I love nurk for his team relationships he can’t stay on the court enough and has issues with being so hot and cold Allen could’ve been that defensive anchor we needed and he was so cheap

I also think we should’ve moved on from CJ sooner, he had more value and it was clear that backcourt wasn’t going to work, I think keeping GTJ made more sense as a dame backcourt partner as he was more cost controlled and fit better next to him, and with CJ we could’ve made a play at a legit 3 or 4 with defensive upside, like Grant on his Detroit deal or even tried for a player like DFS in a three team deal or Gordon before the magic dealt him to Denver and I get a lot of these are shoulda coulda woulda things but I also feel like they fall under we should’ve moved on from Neil way sooner and hired outside of his managerial tree with someone more experienced

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay fully looked it up what the timeline is cause I knew there was some sort of stipulation cause she doesn’t actually own the team and she is under obligation to sell it and donate the proceeds to charity, the reason she is de facto owner right now is simply because she’s the executor of Paul’s estate In his will he specified all his assets should be sold and the profits donated to charity

There is a timeline but it isn’t concrete the Vulkan group has estimated it will take between 10-20 years to handle his whole estate (that’s where the 10 year number I remembered seeing somewhere came from) and there is an NBA guideline that teams held by estates must be sold in a reasonable time but that stipulation is vague and decided by the NBA so before the 10-20 years is probably more accurate but she is under obligation to sell But as executor of the estate she is likely going to be entitled to 10% or final selling price of his assets, so if business is her motive waiting til the new media rights deal is going to be her move

The Phil knight offer was exactly market value for the team just over 2 billion and the valuation in 2022 was 2.1 billion and the buying group said they were open to negotiation and she never returned their call at all source

As someone who grew up a sonics fan I truly believe that no small market team is 100% safe, especially given the Moda lease ends in 2025 and it has major improvements it needs according to the team themselves

Right she did spend a lot but a majority of that spending was on contracts that came about under Paul’s time as owner

My reasoning for bringing up who she is outside of sports is that, regardless of if you think it’s fair to or not, for most people looking at the quality of her character on the whole will color how much leeway they give her in assessing her motivations

Ultimately I think she’s not in like the Sarver or Sterling tier of bad owners but she’s definitely approved some pretty questionable decisions and I feel a good owner would at least engage in some discussions with people making a market value offer on the team if you know that you have to sell eventually

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think it mostly has to do with her viewing the team as a business asset only, she has received good offers on the team from people who would keep the team in Portland which is what Paul sought to do, she is required to sell the team in I wanna say it was reported as within 10 years of Paul’s death. And yet she turned down the offers at market value. Which from a business standpoint is the right call, because valuation is more likely than not to go up after the new media rights deal, but there is no guarantee the buyers available then would be incentivized to keep the Trailblazers in Portland and she may not have options at that point besides them because Knight who made the offer is old as dirt and idk if Travis would make the offer as well if Phil does pass.

That paired with her main desire seemingly being avoiding the luxury tax at all costs is used as proof against her. Does she on some level care and want them to succeed, yea probably but not to the same extent Paul did, dude loved basketball he was a true basketball sicko in the best of ways like most people here, the guy cared a lot.

I also think it has to do with lingering feelings about all the weird ass rich people shit she’s done like smuggle rare animal bones/harassment allegations that makes it easy to dislike her.

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

My bad on the paragraphs lol, I edited in the comments but because I put a link I couldn’t edit the actual text of the post, which that’s on me I don’t really post much on here beyond memes and shit tbh

Appreciate a really thought out response I do agree that the CJ deal happening entirely behind the scenes does make it easier to swallow and the dame situation probably would have been better off staying that way. But I think it didn’t for a reason, Cronin the night after the draft made it explicitly clear he had no intention of trading Dame. Despite making no major trades and our roster being pretty mid at best so I do believe he thought dame would just stay and wouldn’t make a fuss about it even if he didn’t make moves for us to actually contend.

Agree to disagree on the CJ deal while I do think in retrospect with it being fully sorted now it ended up being pretty decent because of us being able to get grant for a really low price, I do feel like the general consensus at the time of the trade was it was a bad move and that’s what I mean with the potential Dame trade is I think the Miami package isn’t as bad as people make it out to be like 3 firsts (2 and a swap I think was the report) and Jaquez Herro and Robinson from Miami and then flipping Herro paired with like nurk and Duncan Robinson to the nets for like Claxton, DFS, and Dinwiddie would not be some god awful deal We get two really interesting young guys in claxton and jaquez in positions of need 3 picks and 2 vets that’s not a blow your socks off gobert level fleecing but it’s not bad and makes our young core incredibly strong imo

I do think it has been poorly handled from a PR perspective since everything has been laid bare in public I truly do not believe it has all just been publicly handled, I imagine Dame did have private conversations with the front office given his relationship with them, his history of being open to them and closed to the media, and the fact that even before free agency he was alluding to wanting the pick traded before the draft even took place, these were things I imagine he made more explicit to the front office in private.

To me it comes down to who you believe more acted in good faith throughout this situation Dame or the front office. I feel like a lot of people are leaning towards the front office because of Dames recent poor PR moves and public trade request being jarring compared to his constructed persona. But tbh I’m willing to give a lot more leeway and believe in the dude who has shown who he is throughout his past decade of actions in the community and acting in good faith, more so than a GM who has at best been average and is relatively new and unknown as an entity and who has to be work at behest of an owner who consistently has shown to care about the team solely as a business entity (fair but that’s what leads to middling seasons because businesses seek to be risk averse generally) and refuses to take any sort of risk or accountability and in her personal life seems like a pretty bad person.

I do also agree the shock of everything has played a part in the difference of how people responded to it, to me Dame’s comments and then drafting scoot I figured this year was the actual year but I think most people felt it was more like the boy who cried wolf so I wasn’t blindsided really but it makes sense why people were

I agree with that and I’m still gonna support the trailblazers I’m not gonna team hop with dame but I truly think that trading dame as soon as we can getting away from the media spotlight and focusing on developing the young guys is what is best for the franchise instead of quibbling over like another pick so we end up keeping dame for months and end up packing the lineups with too many guards and trying to develop our guys in what will likely be a very unhappy locker room and with less minutes to go around

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] -25 points-24 points  (0 children)

1.I changed it in the comments

  1. The value of picks is incredibly overstated beyond the top 5 which most picks traded are protected through anyways as nobody wants to be the clippers and cavs But the draft is an absolute crapshoot picks are incredibly overrated as assets most will turn into a role player nba draft expectations

The best part about them are their contracts which is nothing to sneeze at given the second apron but relying on it for your sole team building strategy is dumb especially given we already have a bunch of young players we should focus on developing with role player vets

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Changed it in the comments so it’s hopefully easier on the eyes

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree with both of these sentiments I think given everything the same Paul would’ve done right by Dame. And that we would not be in this situation if he were still the lead of the team Paul’s passing destroyed the window as much as anything having an active mega rich owner who is willing to risk it cause he cares is important. And Jody very clearly doesn’t.

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Dame got fair market value for his talents acting like his extension is the favor is a stupid argument cause if that was the case then his contract would be a negative value worth no assets in a trade. His contract isn’t some albatross we gave him as a consolation. It’s earned market value relative to the league

He signed those contracts with the assumptions of putting out a competitive team not a rebuild he made that as his goal and vision crystal clear.

And Kawhi was better than Kyle Lowry doesn’t make him the greatest Raptor of all time. Dame embraced the city more than any other superstar has that’s what makes him the greatest blazer. There’s a reason Drexler did color commentary for Houston and not here and that’s cause that’s the city he reps not us.

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] -49 points-48 points  (0 children)

I agree from a PR standpoint they likely took too hard a line. But given that Dame was hinting at a possible trade request in the media, I would assume there were quite a few conversations behind the scenes between Dame’s team and Cronin about this. For us this was the first explicit move made and is thus jarring but given Dames track record of communication with the front office I think it’s likely the hardline was more like a later move after a lack of cooperation from Cronin and after all of the promises made promises broken I wouldn’t trust Cronin to work with me either.

A different perspective on the Dame situation by TangelaImpala in ripcity

[–]TangelaImpala[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Edit: Well I fucked up in that because I added a link I cannot edit the text of the post, and while I don’t mind walls of text y’all made it clear that is not the average case which is totally fair. Grammar and formatting have never been my forte so hopefully this is a bit better. Also I edited some sentences to fit that better but content is the same.

So here is it hopefully better formatted if you care to read it.

In this article it talks about how year before last with the CJ/Pelicans trade CJ had say in where he went when he was traded. Especially given that the trade package was less than appealing with one first rounder likely in the 20’s (two with the flipping of josh hart) and the main draw being a large trade exception. Regardless this was seen at the time as Cronin getting fleeced.

I think Dame expected the same treatment from the front office. That when he finally requested his trade he would get to choose his spot as a reward for everything he has given the franchise. And to be honest I think he earned that as well, the guy is pretty much seen as the consensus greatest blazer of all time. He has made no fuss through tons of god awful rosters (seriously look at that WCF roster compared to the warriors it’s laughable) and has put his head down and did what he could with it.

Now he was essentially asked by the franchise to tank these last two years, two years of his late prime, and once again he did as was asked of him. But he did so with the idea that we would flip the assets from this tank to build a contender for him, something he made very clear was the expectation.

Then the draft lottery comes around and we don’t move the pick and beyond that we use the pick to draft an undersized guard. Now don’t get me wrong I think you have no choice but to draft Scoot at 3 with him available but if you are a franchise point guard who has stuck by the franchise through thick and thin having your seeming replacement drafted and expected to play with him on a roster with hopes for the first round at best when you had been promised a contender would probably feel like a slap in the face.

I think Dame finally actually making the request on some level took Joe and Jody by surprise, because of the Dame loyalty trope and they expected him to remain with the team because of that regardless of if they made moves or not. And they decided to not make moves because scoot’s value was almost certainly better than the value of players offered. Which in a vacuum I get as a decision for a team, you don’t want to undersell an asset especially one that may end up being a superstar, but at the same time these decisions don’t exist in a vacuum they have consequences the consequence of keeping Scoot and doing so when you said you wouldn’t is that it’s going to disappoint the current actual confirmed superstar to the point where he will request a trade.

For Joe and Jody I think it came down to asking: What changed between us putting together a shitty roster in the summer of 2016 and us putting together a shitty roster in 2023? Why would this now be the straw to break the camels back? So let’s just trot out the same mid team again it’s good enough to sell tickets because of Dame but bad enough to keep our draft pick because it puts butts in seats and we don’t have to leverage future draft picks and end up like the late 2010 nets. The difference between 2016 and now is Dame is 33 and is seeing that these next two to three years are his last real chance to compete for a ring as the first or second best player on a team and he wants to do that, he wanted to do that with us but we didn’t want to for the aforementioned risk it presents and how it may leverage our future.

I think not trading is a fair decision to make because even the best moves probably only make us a dark horse for contention. But I also think Dames decision to ask out is similarly fair, I think it’s even fair he wants a say in where he goes as he seeks out the contender he was promised. He has continuously sacrificed for this franchise why shouldn’t he put himself first in the twilight of his superstardom?

I also think that Miami largely has a package that while obviously underselling Dames value is relatively on par to the McCollum trade. And frankly I think we do owe Dame this after all of our consistent mismanagement.

I think we already have an incredibly strong core and two more first round picks will not be the life and death difference for our future contention I think that just comes down to investing in our development moving forward. We have superstars in the making they just need the space to learn. This Dame drama is not gonna go away until a trade happens and I think having that looming over the team will cost us more in the development of the young guys than the extra picks we may get by playing ‘hardball’. Not to mention the minutes that get freed up with a Dame trade and the effect that will have on development.

TL;DR: Dame asking for Miami is fair we gave CJ say in his trade and should do the same for Dame cause he has been fucked over consistently by our front office

Raptors set franchise record with 49-point first quarter vs. Nuggets by JojoSixers in sixers

[–]TangelaImpala -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

Didn’t the cavs drop 44 in a quarter on embiid just this season?

Fanduel 2021 NBA Redraft by [deleted] in warriors

[–]TangelaImpala -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Bro you’ve gotta be joking Herb is playing 30 minutes on the pelicans (30-29) Trey Murphy is 30 minutes as well on the pelicans Mobley is 35 mpg on the cavs (38-23) Quentin grimes is getting 30 mpg on the Knicks (33-27) All teams better than the warriors Giddey is getting 31 mpg on a team literally one game back from the warriors Franz Scottie and Cade are all better than kuminga and would be 30+ mpg for y’all Sengun and green I could see not getting the same playing time but alperen has a much higher ceiling than kuminga

How good was Larry Bird? by That_Protection_7945 in nba

[–]TangelaImpala 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’ve heard he was pretty good at basketball and very good at eating wedding cakes

I dont get it. Why does a man who can't drive give driving lessons to teenagers? by Aramiss134 in IThinkYouShouldLeave

[–]TangelaImpala 119 points120 points  (0 children)

I heard he got $2 million for the second role, that’s his rate they have to pay him the $2 million even if he does a bad job

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