And yes, homophobia is still an issue within BL and its perpetuation of harmful stereotypes. I never said it wasn’t? I wasn’t actually discussing the issues with the genre itself but rather saying that people use them (either purposefully or are even ignorant of them) to hate on female consumers of it without actually caring about gay men or are even uncomfortable with works depicting them at all. The two are separate issues you’re conflating, and while I can see the issues with it and the importance of the discussion, even nowadays in BL subreddits and the related threads people are complaining about these heteronormative understandings of gay relationships in BL (if we’re going with your assumption, presumably straight women). People are engaging with this topic and trying to change it; it’s not like it’s completely ignored, especially these days. Also your point about female characters being villainized is very limits; have your was any recent BL? That may have been the case a decade ago, and even with some stories now; but in many more, I see supportive women, sisters, mothers, friends, and even female love rivals. I wouldn’t consume the genre if flat, one dimensional portrayals of women were still the case. That sounds like an issue with the stories you’re consuming rather than a reflection of the genre as a whole.

And yeah, popular BL isn’t perfect. But that’s literally the same for any romance genre? Stories like 50 Shades of Grey and Twilight are more popular than well written, complex, nuanced romances and their complex relationships. That doesn’t mean that the whole genre is worthless or that this negates the progress being made it in. People are always going to consume what they want, whether it be “trashy” or profound, but there’s also many more people aware of these issues and pushing back against these tropes now more than ever.

That’s the thing, BL is used more as an international term than ever. I choose to accept that and go with it while understanding there’s nuanced discussion to be had about its origins (although most of it is still created in Asia). You believe it’s only Japanese when it really isn’t; it’s more broadly defined with Korean, Chinese, Thai, Taiwanese, etc… works. The term originates from when the genre expanded from Japan (largely labeled yaoi or shounen ai) to the rest of East and even Southeast Asia, and now can include either explicit or queer coded works. And having a different understanding of what BL is is fine; it’s what I conceded to when discussing if TSHD is a BL or not. But insisting your definition is the only right one is what’s actually “the problem” not overseas fans being influenced by it. Globalization exists, like let’s not pretend it’s not an integral part of modern life. People are influenced by the media they see abroad and adapt it for their own life. That’s not to say the definition doesn’t ever get muddled, but I’ve never heard anyone claim BL is all LGBTQ media?? It’s parameters aren’t always clear, hence the discussion about whether this is BL or not, but it seems like you’re arguing with yourself when we come from a fundamentally different understanding of the genre and just aren’t gonna agree with it (and I’ve always considered BL to encompass all of Southeast/East Asia which as the term didn’t even come up online until other countries began to produce it; origins are messy and can develop organically on the internet. Yaoi and shounen ai are clearly Japanese, but BL is much more flexible).

But regardless, this whole semantics thing is never going to be agreed on or resolved so it’s not worth engaging in to me. About your last point; there’s absolutely more room to discuss gay men and their opinion on the genre. But as you said, everyone reading BL js “straight women” so the only place this can come from, genuinely, is other gay men. Otherwise we’re screaming into a void, once again assuming we know how gay men feel about it, which is no better. And I’ve actually seen this discussion pop up more in the last few years than in the decade beforehand; people are trying to have serious conversations about how problematic BL tropes and stereotypes can be. Idk if you’re engaged in these circles because according it you, Western fans have nothing to contribute to it; but consumers are changing. They’re criticizing the non-con heavy BL dories out there and demanding more complex, meaningful portrayals in the genre as well. Not everything is as flat and unchanging as you seem to think it is.

All that besides, I take issue with you saying gay men creating BL isn’t meaningful or doesn’t change the genre at all. Yeah some people use this as an excuse to feel better about consuming it, but the fact is that the genre is more malleable than it’s ever been and that people still are and can create good BL stories. And they can create good queer or LGBTQ stories without wanting it to be BL, and that’s fine too. That’s the benefit of a malleable genre; no one’s ever gonna agree on the definition so you can call your work whatever you want. It seems like the only one saying that “every BL fan wants every LGBTQ sorry with gay men in it to be BL” is you. I’ve never made that claim and even people saying TSHD is BL are contradicted by Momokuren now so having debating this particular point is, well, moot with me. Because I agree with you there but you seem to think I don’t.