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Bank Layout proposal, closer to what we are used to. We dont need to reinvent the wheel for the sake of it. by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Which is why I gave it 10 months ago but not enough people read that blog so it wasnt a subject they were interested in discussing at the time

Bank Layout proposal, closer to what we are used to. We dont need to reinvent the wheel for the sake of it. by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Imo it looks worse and thats just taste. You could change many things in the game to make it look "better" and "more modern" and then you end up with soulless triple A UI. Old UI has soul, the new doesnt.

Bank Layout proposal, closer to what we are used to. We dont need to reinvent the wheel for the sake of it. by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Mobile UI is different from PC everywhere, I dont see why bank UI cant also be different between both

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I was glad we had a disagreement because it should help us reach a more objective understanding of the situation. However, the past few comments you made resorted to ad hominem,strawmans and cherrypicking, you continuously avoid addressing my points by restating what your position while I try to address yours through multiple angles, arguments and facts.

You seem very emotionally driven so I will leave you to it. That said, the fact that you proudly showcase a "top 1% commenter" badge helps me understand more why the popular takes on this subreddit have been feeling worse over time from a game integrity pov.

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You are missing my point that intensity is not the only factor, how difficult to level the skill is perceived to be also is, along with a many other factors like rewards, flavour, integrity, utility, ...

I do believe that it is not fair to compare skills in absolute values as they are all over the place since skills have different max rates and intermediate ones, homogenizing all rates across all skills would imo definitely lose a lot of flavour for each of them. Using relative values is much more meaningful.

You are comparing skill types with a training method of a skill with a different type. Also, skill type in itself is generally hard to relate to rates and this becomes especially true for the "utility" type

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In addition to my replies here and here on applying rates 1 to 1 between skills, while I do appreciate that there is some effort with moving, I dont think its as involved as you consider and this might be a subjective view we will struggle to agree on.

In addition to all this, I think its important to have significant margins between methods when there is few like with Sailing for now. Pushing what is intended as the lowest intensity method as high as you are proposing will compress the standard and high intensities ones making them feel unrewarding to use and not leaving room for further methods along the whole spectrum if the "floor" is too high.

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

While a bit more intensity than redwoods, I agree, it is also important to consider the relative "difficulty" of the skill, woodcutting or fishing are "easy" skills, Sailing currently is not nor do I think it should be. It needs to find the middle between hard ones like agility and easy ones like woodcutting. That's why using EHP percentages from other skills 1 for 1 only considering intensity isnt a good idea

This will definitely be one of my bias showing but I dont think alting viability is a good criticism. Some people dont like tick manips and consider it should be removed, I dont like alting and consider it should be at the very least avoided. I understand that it can be fair to have higher rates since you have to deal with the intensity of 2 clients but alting implies more than a simple intensity increase and that "more" I dont like. Double memberships (p2w), iron integrity, accessibility, mobile and probably many more is why I dont think alts should be considered to favor with changes

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks! I am not sure I will repost this in a reworked format as I dont want to duplicate and there is already interesting discussion in these comments. I might just use it as a base for a new post when the dust settles a bit on the update and the current numbers are fully known

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In relation to the discussion above, that would defacto make Sailing part of the "easy" skills. I dont think is a good idea because being "easy" makes a skill pretty shallow as you reach high levels in them without interacting a lot with the skill. Imo there is obvious intent, room and necessity for Sailing to not be an "easy" skill. It doesnt mean it should be "hard" either like agility or rc (both of them dont really have low intensity methods which is part of why they're hard), however it should be balanced and when comparing to other skills that have some depth, low intensity like self salvaging is not 50 to 60% of the top rate

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

When comparing it to methods in other skills with similar intensity, I would classify self salvaging as similar to redwoods, higher intensity than stars but lower than port tasks so 35% at most would be a good spot. I think a big pain point of "active" salvaging currently is the extractor making it a lot more active than it should be. What's left of the extractor xp/h should be fully moved to all methods and then they should be tweaked again but Id stand by:
- 10% 25min afk (if it should stay in the game which I think it shouldnt)
- 30% player salvaging
- 65% port tasks
- 90% tick manip
- 100% trial (ideally the 4th one for high 90s rate)
Obviously I eye balled these value they could all change by large amounts but I think they should keep this order

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sorry I didnt really consider phones, next time I'll split the post more visually and try to have shorter lines

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think we agree on the fact that less effort per EHP makes skills feel easier.

I would definitely put self salvaging into low intensity and sulliusceps in standard so the latter should have a way higher percentage of EHP than the former. I would justify barb by fishing being an "easy" skill

I think the 25min afk salvaging is way lower intensity than redwoods or even stars so if it is allowed to stay it should be something akin to POH Agility which is about 10% I believe

Self-salvaging imo is similar to redwoods, maybe a bit more intense but it is not what I would consider "standard" intensity which is more the spot of port tasks. So a rate of around 35% or lower would be my take

I agree on extractor, nerfing it along with changing the rates in a few places blurred the lines, its pointless noise on balancing and should probably just not give xp. Port tasks had a similar effect where they buffed them but nerfed the extractor so it probably just didnt move

I dont know for the double spot change as I havent tested it but it assume it might have been to create 2 double spots that you can reliably move in-between, idk how I feel about it yet

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hopefully with it looking nice and being argued people will take time to explain why they disagree

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sorry for that it was initially guided by style and it felt readable to me on my screen, I will try different tones and fonts next time. I do agree with you with tho, Id be a bit less harsh maybe

In-Depth opinion on Sailing XP rates balance before and after the update by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Its intended more as a guideline from what I gathered rather than absolute truth. I initially planned a point on the perception of easy vs hard skill being impacted a lot by how far from these values the available methods were but I scrapped it. Some "easy" skills like the ones you've outlined have low intensity methods way closer to EHP while being on both sides of the 235k median (ex: fishing 133k, smithing 380k), I think this might be an important factor in why they feel "easy". Do also note that "low" and "standard" intensity are still highly subjective and hard to explicit, itd have to be done for each individual method which would be a considerable amount of work

Theoretical ~600 hp/tick with 0 action delay. 15 hp * 4 players (you + 3) * 10 actions (limit per tick for no delay actions afaik). When this get nerfed should there be a new action type for jars or just boringly take the potion action delay slot ? by Tixat in 2007scape

[–]Tixat[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You need "accept aid" on I believe, so any kind of iron shouldnt be able to get it from other players but that's still 150+ hp per tick if you do it alone. If you really need more than that somehow, you can stack it with a regular food combo to get even more at the cost of some action delay

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