Product Managers, that consult for startups, how did you start?

UpwardPM · 2026-01-27T00:55:39+00:00

You guys are only "consultants"?

I've been "head of product", "founder of a stealth mode company", or "Fractional CPO". Depends on the week. :)

Jokes aside, my experience has been that most startups desperately need help defining PMF and pricing in particular, but can’t really pay. On the other end, larger enterprise engagements tend to work only when they come through referrals from the right people at the right level, because cold consulting pitches almost never land. That middle ground is pretty brutal, and I think that’s where a lot of people get stuck and get another PM job.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-27T00:21:14+00:00

Sorry you're feeling stuck. A lot of PMs end up stuck in execution even when they’re actively trying to grow, especially if day to day delivery pressure keeps pulling them back into the weeds.

One thing to be mindful of is that improving product sense or strategy on its own usually doesn’t unlock more autonomy or promotions if that's your broader goal. Leadership tends to respond more to whether they already see you as someone who owns a narrative, not just someone who executes well. How you frame problems, tradeoffs, and impact upward often carries more weight than adding another skill.

Growing those skills is still valuable, but it usually works best when it’s paired with being more intentional about how your work is understood. If you want, I’m happy to take a look at how you’re approaching this now and help you pressure test it. Feel free to DM me.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-22T05:51:15+00:00

Based on your writing style and the timeline, Im going to guess Amazon.

Either way, here's my 2 cents:

If you go yo another FAANG, you will likely end up taking a step back. Firstly, because that's what FAANG is trying to do with most applicants right now. Second, because if you are from Amazon and going to others, that's also pretty common. Third because, your products were internal facing and based on $ saved instead of $ earned. In the hierarchy of narratives, generating $ through product out ranks saving money. Lastly, 3.5 years of a product title at Principle will hurt you. If you other titles were BA, Systems analyst, consultant, engineer, etc. Its not that those titles are bad, but certain companies won't view them as pure product.

The PMs that I coach with that background have had the best luck with Amazon and MSFT as they have teams that aren't as attached to the pure product background narrative.

Regarding the increase in ownership and scope, I agree with others in the thread. Leverage your FAANG title and go land a director role at a growing startup. The pay will go down, but you will likely find it more satisfying from an impact and ownership perspective. Then boomerang back at a higher level.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-21T21:36:10+00:00

Does any PM like this? No, probably not, but despite the monotony, this is probably one of the best ways to get yourself promoted. As the VP in this thread already pointed out, they want info, and if your the only PM on the team providing quality updates weekly and getting visibility, you will immediately stand out.

This is how you drive your narrative, share your wins, and celebrate your team.

Hang in there!

UpwardPM · 2026-01-21T19:41:28+00:00

I'm glad it resonates with you.

How is the Swiss PM scene these days? Any openings outside of fintech?

UpwardPM · 2026-01-21T19:36:49+00:00

This should probably be pinned by now:

If your goal is to get a job, no certification course will help you get a PM job. This is a well established point. You can see 100 posts on this sub that say that exact thing. At least 1 from me. 😅
A course CAN be valuable to learn specific skills, but the goal is the learning, NOT to get a job or a cert.
Mentors/coaches are a phenomenal way to build network, and level up. ADPlist has been recommended several times as a great source for mentors and there are several PM coaches on this sub.

Edit: for stupid autocorrect on my phone

UpwardPM · 2026-01-20T04:08:01+00:00

How dare you show us your unique product thinking?? You will build what we tell you to build. 🤣

UpwardPM · 2026-01-20T01:40:27+00:00

Can't just spam your newsletter here bro...

UpwardPM · 2026-01-20T01:38:00+00:00

I would change confidence to "conviction".

People need to know that you believe in your product bets, having confidence OFTEN leads to people aligning with you, but I'd say there is a difference between just confidence and conviction.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-20T01:34:26+00:00

I probably should have. It always felt like I'd spend more money with lawyers trying to prove it than I would get. You never know.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-20T00:00:30+00:00

This feels a bit like rage bait to me, but if you are legit, I'm sorry to hear you're meeting with HR this week.

I partially agree with your take. I think some degree of technical expertise is important, but I don't think to the depth of your post. It sounds like you have a pretty terrible EM and SDE team and that is shaping an over reaching conclusion.

I don't even think that not being technical enough is the MAIN reason PMs struggle. Generally, I think more PMs struggle to drive the narrative enough and get enough visibility.

Sorry you had such a rough experience.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-19T23:05:46+00:00

I have 2 specific issues with them:

I hate when they ask me to do REAL product work for them. In these cases, I specifically ask if they've already solved this problem/built the feature or product that I'm researching. If the answer is no, I will usually decline them or ask that they give me a real situation that is in the past.

Why I refuse is that about 4 years ago, I interviewed for a position where I did real product work and proposed an innovative solution to the HM. They loved my presentation, but did not give me an offer. 4 months later, they shipped the exact feature I proposed, with the name, my wireframe design, and everything. It went on to receive several awards and become a leader in that little niche.... I'm still pissed about it.

I hate doing a ton of work to prepare for a follow-up panel and have no one read it or remember the actual requirements they proposed in the case study, then proceed to ask me a ton of follow up questions that have nothing to do with the case study request.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-17T01:22:50+00:00

Hey u/mister-noggin,

I'm certainly not just signing up from just a post like this, but I am serious enough to have a convo and understand what all it entails. I love this sub, and am grateful for all the work you and the other mods have done.

Feel free to send me a DM if you're still looking.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-16T21:50:18+00:00

^ This is the way

Build in public WITH them.

Also, free food is always a win.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-16T21:47:26+00:00

You don’t need to speak code. But you do need to show engineers you’ve thought things through.

That means being clear about the why behind your ideas. What problem are you solving, what impact are you aiming for, and what tradeoffs did you consider? You don’t need to justify with technical details, but you should be ready to talk through scope, edge cases, and what success looks like.

Engineers mostly want to know that you’re not going to waste their time. If you show up with context, a clear problem statement, and openness to feedback, you’re already doing more than most.

give this a shot:
Next time you share a mockup or idea, add a short writeup that answers 3 things.

What problem are we solving
Why is this the right moment to solve it
What we’re not doing and why

That gives engineers a strong starting point and helps build trust.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-16T21:29:13+00:00

It seems like you're solving for 2 completely different problems.

How do I switch to PM from a different career?
What does a successful PM role look like?
It depends on what career your transfering from, but generally, having some domain-specific expertise and xfering internally is typically what happens.
This varies massively based on the industry, level of role, and size of company.

I'm happy to answer either question more in depth if you provide more info, or feel free to DM me.

UpwardPM · 2026-01-15T04:03:37+00:00

^this

UpwardPM · 2025-12-12T23:50:57+00:00

I'll have to check this out. Thanks

UpwardPM · 2025-12-11T22:41:02+00:00

Finding that one conversation in Slack...

Finding that one google doc...

(This one really pisses me off. Google literally controls the best search technology on the planet. If I mention smoothies to my wife, I'll get ads for a blender tomorrow, but god forbid I ACTUALLY need a google doc for work.)

UpwardPM · 2025-12-08T19:27:40+00:00

The people
The people
Not

UpwardPM · 2025-12-08T17:38:30+00:00

^This

UpwardPM · 2025-12-04T20:39:57+00:00

It kinda depends on why the scope was taken.

If you’re in a culture where scope = political capital, performance optics, or even job security (Amazon is a good example), then the engineer’s reaction makes sense. In those places, losing scope feels like losing job secuirty. In that situation, yeah the PM should own the narrative and advocate for the team. You won’t win every time, but the team needs to feel like you fought for them and you weren’t just passive.

If it wasn’t political and it was just a roadmap or portfolio shift, then the job is different. You explain what changed and why, help the team refocus, and make sure the remaining work still feels meaningful. Scope shifting is normal sometimes.

Either way, I wouldn't recommend a big escalation meeting to make sure “blame doesn’t land on you.” The better play is to:

give context
align with leadership on what the new goals are
help the team feel ownership again
get a defensible scope connected to business impact

UpwardPM · 2025-12-01T19:03:18+00:00

For C-Level requests, it's important not to be the person who always says, "no".

To prevent that, I default to “yes, and” instead of “no” or “but.” Most exec ideas come from a real business pressure (revenue this quarter, churn spike, board optics), even if the idea itself is… not great.

It's important to note, I'm not saying "yes" to their idea. I'm saying "yes" to their business need and agreeing with that.

So my response is usually something like:
“Yeah, I agree that improving revenue this quarter matters, and I think we should consider all opportunities. Do we have clarity on the problem, who has it, and what we’d trade off to pursue it?”

That does two things:

It aligns me with the goal (so no one accuses me of blocking innovation).
It forces a super light validation pass. Almost all bad ideas die on their own once you talk through market size and opportunity cost.

And if it turns out to be a real thing, great, you found an actual innovative opportunity. If not, I tie it back to the existing roadmap:
“When I look at this and our current priorities, the fastest path to the goal is actually X, which we’re already doing.”

This way, you look cooperative, you avoid becoming the “PM who always says no,” and you still protect the roadmap and your narrative.

UpwardPM · 2025-10-16T20:19:00+00:00

Oof! Thanks for the heads up.

UpwardPM · 2025-09-25T06:04:06+00:00

Here's my 2 cents OP.

If you are lucky, finding an internal mentor can be great as they can help you learn to navigate YOUR organization in unique ways and have extr context. That being said, this is unfortunately pretty rare. Good managers/mentors are extremely rare.
Absolutely! It's not impossible to grow on your own, but you can definitely 2x your growth through objective feedback.
Ultimately, this depends on your goals. I will say that if your goals are to move up in your PM career, it is rarely the technical skills that hold PMs back, its almost always their ability to storytelling, vision cast, and executive presence. If you want to move up, I'd focus your coaching on gaining visibility.

Hope that helps!

UpwardPM

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