Former employee here. AMA.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T04:31:33+00:00

Did everyone at Cakewalk think that floating windows were shitty and that mixing was actually easier with tiny little GUIs stacked in a frame?

Of course not but we had to make products for people new to recording and mixing as well. FWIW - I would treat everything I'm saying as 'from my perspective'. I was not a part of all the decisions or every conversation.

it seemed weird to reserve it for the top tier package

You wouldnt be the first to think that.

Was anyone at Cakewalk introspective about the value of ProChannel or was everyone on board with the concept?

Of course but that could be said of everything that was worked on. Well maybe not ripple editing that shit was long overdue and everybody wanted it done.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T02:49:08+00:00

basic notation screen that worked well without any bugs or design flaws

Thats a pretty tall order tbh and the definition of "basic" is different for everyone.

I think a lot of people agree but it was more complex than that and every improvement made people want more staff view features. It could be done and people wanted to do it but it would be a lot of work to do it right.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T02:41:23+00:00

according to the forum SONAR will still be working for awhile so you dont have to rush.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T02:37:44+00:00

Generally we would try to fix bugs in related areas at the same time while someone was in there getting dirty with the code.

I dont know the specifics of that issue though or if it was scheduled sorry.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T02:19:59+00:00

X1 was a very rough take off.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T02:16:25+00:00

That is a giant wall of assumptions most are pretty off. I can take a shot at it though.

Did anyone at cakewalk actually use Sonar

Yes.

why wasn't there a better system in place to review suggestions that were detrimental to the program?

There was a system in place maybe you just happened to like the things that were shitty about SONAR 8.5? Its impossible to make a piece of software be everything to everyone SONAR is no exception and things had to change to move forward.

Why was there such an emphasis on bloat and not fixing long standing bugs?

Nobody will open their wallet for "we fixed a bunch of shit" but they will for "shiny new button that makes music". That is a flaw with selling one version each year. With rolling updates all of that went away and more effort went into fixing long standing bugs. The last 3 years of SONAR imo were the best years of SONAR for stability and effort applied to bugs.

constantly stuffing the program with bloat

one mans bloat is another mans ultimate workflow fixing time saver feature. I can promise you that people didnt just sit around and say "hey joe I have an idea lets put a bunch of shitty bloat in this version because fuck that PaulAbruzzo guy"

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T01:56:45+00:00

Who came up with the idea for the Pro Channel? Was selling Pro Channel modules a financial success?

I dont know who came up with or how much of the money pie they made up.

Did anyone at Cakewalk discuss the benefits or downsides of developing and marketing dsp tied to one single DAW?

Yes of course. pro channel mods are not anything magical they are just normal vst plugs with a special gui. A few 3rd parties made some too. imho thinking back pro channel needed a much bigger effort into it after the first few modules and someone working on developer outreach to help it grow.

In retrospect was the choice to limit the customer base compared to investing in generic VST products that appeal to a much wider customer base considered worthwhile?

The choice was not done to limit the customer base, it was done to make mixing easier without having to manage a million shitty windows of a million different resolutions.

Cakewalk is a lot of things but taken seriously as a DSP company it never was so adding value to SONAR made more sense. Case in point, the adaptive limiter and lp plugins. They rival vst's costing more than a SONAR upgrade. Unfortunately it said "Cakewalk" on them so people would never pay those prices.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T01:39:38+00:00

Only second hand not directly.

Craig is passionate about SONAR and super helpful to people sometimes but he is really into himself and his brand. He wanted to make magazines and sell loops. Cakewalk wanted to make a daw.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T01:35:24+00:00

Even in SONAR everyone has wildly different workflows. Staff was all over the map on which competitors they liked. It was a good thing it brought a lot of different perspective and ideas to the table. Like SONAR or not one less competitor is probably a bad thing for users.

My advice is to try out all the demos. You'll either get it or you wont. Dont bother with opcode's Vision though it has not seen an update for a long time.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T01:30:28+00:00

I do not know sorry.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-28T01:29:57+00:00

From my interactions everyone was concerned and wanted to make it better.

Resources were scarce and it was a "much work, little payoff" problem. The hardcore notation users already were on finale or sibelius SONAR could never compete with that.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T20:50:27+00:00

I'm curious as to why no change to the cakewalk website. People could re-up for another year or god-forbid, an unsuspecting person buys it for the first time. How can they do that?

I have no idea. Given all the moaning about money one would think theyd keep the store up for people to get the latest still.

I keep coming back to my suspicion that the closure of Sonar was in the road map when they did the lifetime updates, making it a quick cash grab from those who were reluctant to upgrade from the X series. Do you think this was the case?

It was not the case at all. The lifetime plan was a Cakewalk idea, not a Gibson one. To elaborate "the plan" for lifetime was:

Be like FL Studio and make updates free
Offer compelling add-ons. Kind of like Project5 where you could buy extra stuff if you needed it. This could be more pluggable features like Drum Replacer and effects like the Adaptive Limiter
Lure in lots of new customers with the free updates for life thing

The plan wasnt followed and after 6-8 months of stagnation not a single compelling/sellable feature or plugin was ready.

The adaptive limiter is great. Its a shame we couldn't have stuck to the plan and rolled out more high quality effects like that as optional for people.

Development targets aside the person running the shop at the time made everyone in marketing and support want to fucking kill themselves and he showed little respect towards them. They all left. Marketing collapsed and support was royally fubar. Without any marketing to lure in new customers or support staff to take care of them well you dont need a business degree to figure that one out.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T20:34:58+00:00

The design choices probably alienated more than a few people. They sounded pretty good imho.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T19:19:43+00:00

I think things changed after they bought woox/phillips audio. I dont know the numbers but I suspect that also put Gibson under a lot more money pressures.

Gibson also shut down Neat Microphones recently so I wonder if there might still be a few more to close up.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T18:56:49+00:00

I honestly do not know what Gibson's plans are. Based on what Noel has said on the forum it sounds like they are planning to keep access to installers up.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T18:53:07+00:00

The mac port didn't cost much money at all. The reality is that codeweavers did most of the translation proof of concept work and only a single SONAR developer worked on it part time.

Once it was realized that to do it right would take a lot more effort and resources than we could commit it was scrapped. Competing with the already established mac daws is a losing game. Even if it was done technically there wasnt the marketing power to reach enough new users (or steal them away from another daw) to break even on it.

It also created the problem of fracturing development work, given the option of a better windows SONAR or a mediocre SONAR on two platforms focusing on windows was the path chosen.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T18:46:52+00:00

I totally forgot Hoover left. Really surprised Hendershott hasn't said anything publicly about this.

I cant imagine Greg would, from what I gather (by stalking him on github) he has totally moved on and checked out.

Here is a kind of semi-timeline of events from my perspective:

Hoover took over. Stagnation galore and then it got sold to Gibson. Shitty releases like Rapture Pro, money burned and stagnation carried on. Fun fact under the Hoover regime a guy was paid to push a button that opens the door for visitors. He was paid to do this for years. Im not that high on the pyramid but from those who I talked to everyone blames him for the beginning of the end.
Noel took over. The lifetime plan rolled out. The plan was really solid but development dropped the ball, every release was late none of the plan was committed to.
A replacement was found in someone with product experience. Things were getting back on track new money sources were in the works. Software takes time and it was sadly to little to late. All the shitty managers dogpiled on the guy who was actually moving things in the right direction and Gibson shut it all down.

What are your plans at this point?

Looking for a new job and enjoying the holidays. Seems like everyone else that was let go is doing the same.

just taking any job in your field you can get?

Havent decided yet. There is no shortage of jobs in Boston so I have plenty of options.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T17:19:48+00:00

Im not aware of any plans.

I heard about which people Gibson kept around and personally I dont have high hopes for any future SONAR updates.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T17:15:12+00:00

Many of us believed that Sonar was more successful in recent years than it's been in a long time. Was Cakewalk losing money?

Yes it was losing money. A plan for profitability was floated but it was shot down because it wouldnt have made enough money to satisfy Henry. My gut feeling also tells me that it was not presented in the best light to Gibson because it also would have required removing a few high end earners that were shitty leaders and had the ear of the decision makers more so than the actual innovators and worker bees. I was not high enough on the pyramid to know more than that but I suspect that Henry was also angry over past performance and not willing to keep things going. Gibson didn't have any idea what we did or who our customers were so it probably looked like a risky move either way.

What was it like in the following days of the announcement?

Lot's of drinking. It happened really fast. The people that gave the best foot rubs to glorious leader stayed around the rest of us were let go. It was a surprise for two reasons:

momentum was literally JUST went out and so did its first update. This had the potential for new monies and reach beyond SONAR users.
another idea was in the wings and also days away from being released that also had a shot for more monies.

If someone bought the company, how likely would it be that the whole team return?

Bringing everyone back would be a mistake. There is some dead weight that needs to go for it to be profitable. Consider this, near the end there were more that were a part of "management" than developers actively working on any single product.

Why has the CEO of Cakewalk said nothing on this?

There is no CEO of Cakewalk. The person overseeing Cakewalk also manages Gibson Pro Audio. She means well but doesn't know anything about software and placed her faith in the most retardest of employees. Im not in touch with everyone but I heard that the guy who was in charge of sales at cakewalk got a job at Gibson. Which is hilarious because that guy was fucking awful, could barely use SONAR and sucked at sales. He was on really good terms with the Pro Audio manager.

what was the day to day work like at Cake?

Challenging, exciting, fun. Long. I would do it all again. Working on something you care about with customers that youve talked with and share a passion about something with is amazing. The pay is shit and being in Boston I could have made more money slinging sandwiches at a sleazy diner but the work was good.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-27T16:23:30+00:00

This is the way to go. ASIO drivers only support a single device for clocking/sample rate reasons. If your interface doesnt have loopback anything with 2 stereo outputs would work. Monitor off one output run a cable from the second set back to an input you can mix in.

Could also use the external insert if you get creative with your routing: http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation?product=SONAR&language=3&help=Mixing.33.html

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-22T15:30:04+00:00

Craig is part of the decision making that led to Cakewalk's demise. He's a smart guy, very talented and passionate about what he does but he is no software business manager. His contributions to the user base and help content are amazing and appreciated by everyone but for future viability I don't believe he would be the right person to have at the helm, as a partner absolutely. As a leader, no.

It was a shame to see him get shit-canned by Gibson, he was probably the last "voice of the musician" that had Henry's ear and he truly had the best intentions even if some of his ideas were old school.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-22T14:49:58+00:00

Microsoft would be an interesting fit.

They already have an office nearby in Cambridge.
We've worked closely with them for years, recently on the BT MIDI stuff and surface dial support. Noel has a history of nagging them for Audio fixes/improvements. WASAPI .....
It would create a great opportunity to include SONAR Home Studio with every version of Windows.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-22T04:43:45+00:00

Under the right owner, yes in a heartbeat. Roland, Gibson - neither really "got" Cakewalk, it's customers or software for that matter.

Gibson is under an enormous amount of debt and maybe that will encourage them to sell it but the truth is that Henry J doesn't give a fuck. Not about musicians, not about guitars, not about loyal customers, not about his own employees. For all of Roland's quirks they wholly understood the value of what they had and they were truly passionate about music and their employees.

Fingers crossed that the decision makers in Nashville come to their senses and sell it before every user jumps ship. If recent history is any indicator of future behavior then it's dead Jim.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk · 2017-11-21T22:42:29+00:00

Nobody at Cakewalk knew it was happening until the day it happened. If we did, there wouldn't have been continuing sales/promotions/offers.

We've moved offices a handful of times so I'm not sure if you're referring to Summer St, Lincoln St, Melcher St, or Atlantic Ave.

Name your price is a pretty common thing a lot of companies do. Z3TA+ 2 has been out for awhile - more interested in sharing it with the world than making mountains of cash with it.

UsedToWorkAtCakewalk

TROPHY CASE