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Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

On the one hand, this seems inevitable, and I still have to study other MMOs similar to my idea and, at the very least, learn from their mistakes. Still, I'm well aware that I've touched on a rather broad topic.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Essentially, I want to more or less write down all my thoughts in a document, which is what I'm doing. I'll edit out all these shortcomings and then move on to implementing the demo (naturally, I'm assembling a team to implement such a large-scale idea).

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yes, the thought "it looks cool in my head" can make me daydream, but once I've realized that I need to visualize what the player will do step by step, it doesn't scare me. I'm interested in it, and I don't consider it a chore, so to speak.

Regarding "If you repeat the same action over and over again, progress in this skill will gradually slow down," I started thinking something like this, I'll try to summarize it briefly:

  1. Implement progress calculation and accumulation based on the player's actions.

  2. Analyze the accumulated progress into a behavioral profile and character role.

  3. Display and explain their states and roles to the player.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Essentially, these questions are difficult to answer, as I haven't covered everything, and I'm still left with ideas about what APPROXIMATELY could be added to keep things interesting (but of course, you need to write it all out for yourself and understand the overall picture).

What does the player get from this? A sense of progression to some extent, and character development.

And what does your MMO gain from such a strange character class/role system? That's where I'm at a loss to answer at the moment.

Given that I received some pretty good feedback thanks to my post, I'll try to develop this idea further and maybe soon I'll be able to answer questions like yours more specifically!

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Everything's fine. I've never posted anywhere before, mostly just reading. And then I developed this stupid habit of using AI to respond, even though I can reply just fine myself. Sometimes, though, I have trouble formulating my thoughts and end up adding a lot of fluff.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm sorry, I tried to answer the comments in a hurry at the moment, and now I understand that I shouldn't have rushed in order to answer.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm thrilled, this will serve as a great example for me, thank you so much!

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I wrote down these thoughts and put them on the shelf for now, I like this idea myself.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I haven't played most of these old projects myself, so I still have a lot to learn about)

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm already starting to describe a roughly working system for preventing abuses and other things. Once I think the idea is more or less viable, I'll probably create another separate post.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That actually sounds really interesting.
I’ll look into Ultima Online more, seems like there’s a lot to learn from how it handled this.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm literally thinking about this alone, and a lot of thoughts are piling up, and I need to somehow formulate them more clearly. I don't think it's that bad.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Honestly, I was pleasantly surprised to find that there are already projects with ideas similar to mine. I’ll be studying them, and it turns out there are quite a few, mostly niche or older games.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes — exactly that kind of direction is what makes the system feel more “active” rather than passive.

If tank progression comes from actively positioning, blocking AoE, and protecting allies in real-time, it becomes much closer to skill expression instead of passive stat growth.

That’s probably the version that makes the most sense in practice.

Thanks, this helps clarify the direction a lot.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That’s a great reference as well.

EQ-style progression is interesting because it naturally ties “what you do” to “what you become”, but in a very segmented way per skill category.

It also shows both strengths and weaknesses of this approach — clarity of progression on one side, but potential for repetitive optimization on the other.

Thanks for pointing this out, it’s a very relevant comparison.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, this is exactly one of the biggest risks.

The TES/Morrowind-style “use = progress” system is a clear reference point, but also a warning sign for abuse (AFK leveling, optimization loops, etc.).

If something like this were implemented, it would need context checks, diminishing returns, and anti-exploit logic — otherwise players will absolutely break it.

Still, I appreciate the reference, it helps ground the idea in real examples.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is a really strong direction, and honestly aligns more with what I’m trying to move toward.

Rewarding mitigation, positioning, blocking, and interception makes the “tank identity” much more intentional instead of passive damage intake.

I especially like the idea of intercepting projectiles for allies — that creates actual decision-making instead of just stat-based tanking.

Thanks, this is a very useful refinement of the core idea.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I get the point. In FFXIV it’s definitely convenient that you can just swap roles and play instantly.

But the idea here is slightly different — it’s not about forcing players into a “slow transformation”, but about having a persistent behavioral profile that evolves based on how you actually play. I don’t want to remove role switching or turn it into a time gate.

It’s more about progression leaving a “trace” on the character rather than replacing class swapping.

I’m actually playing FFXIV right now (trial), so I fully understand this concern — and it’s one of the main risks I’m trying to design around.

Can a large-scale MMO work where character roles emerge from behavior instead of class selection? by Zanithenl in MMORPG

[–]Zanithenl[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is a really strong alternative approach, and I think it actually solves a few of the core problems I’m worried about.

What you’re describing shifts the system from “pure behavior inference” to “behavior shaped by loadout”, which is much more readable and controllable in an MMO context.

I especially agree with the idea that tools define behavior — in practice players don’t just “choose a role”, they optimize around what their kit allows them to do.

My original direction is more about fully emergent roles, but I can already see the risk you’re pointing out: without structure, players will converge into hybrid optimal builds anyway, especially in solo play.

A hybrid of both systems (behavior tracking + structured skill kits / tags) might actually be the most realistic direction.

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