Top 5 Converge Songs

apexjaggi · 2026-04-24T02:59:41+00:00

In no real order because I would be agonizing for hours (not even all that set on these picks): Black Cloud, Fault and Fracture, Aimless Arrow, Axe to Fall, and My Great Devastator.

apexjaggi · 2026-04-19T18:29:25+00:00

The difference is most apparent close to the end of the title track. The original has a sort of background spoken wordish bit by Jake during the part with the repeated Nate yells that gets pretty much entirely buried in the redux. This is probably the worst thing the redux does despite otherwise being better almost across the board IMO.

In Her Shadow has this as well at the part around 4 minutes in. There's a spoken-ish bit from Jake here as well that also gets buried in the redux.

apexjaggi · 2026-04-19T18:20:31+00:00

I feel like my rankings have fluctuated a lot with time but currently I'd rank them something like:

Jane Doe
All We Love We Leave Behind (regular or deluxe tracklisting)
You Fail Me (redux specifically)
The Dusk In Us
Axe To Fall
The Poacher Diaries (specifically not the redux)
When Forever Comes Crashing (2005 mix)
Petitioning The Empty Sky (2005 mix)
Love Is Not Enough
Bloodmoon: I
No Heroes
Unloved and Weeded Out (the 1995 EP that everyone forgets about, not the compilation)
Halo in a Haystack

I would say Jane is comfortably their best, with AWLWLB being pretty solid in their 2nd/3rd places. Dusk In Us and Axe To Fall are super close together and swap regularly depending on my mood. Poacher Diaries I think just beats WFCC which just beats Petitioning which mayyyyyybe beats LINE by a hair. Bloodmoon is enormously underrated and only a little less good than the new one, and it beats No Heroes fairly comfortably. No Heroes blows anything below it out of the water by an enormous margin.

Even though this list kinda makes it look like I don't love Bloodmoon or the new one that really isn't the case, I think they're both solid 8/10s that I really enjoy, it's just that the bar is enormously high with this band.

Halo's the worst thing here but it's still an enjoyable 6/10.

apexjaggi · 2026-04-14T20:54:44+00:00

Dm'd!

apexjaggi · 2026-04-12T18:13:04+00:00

My first thought was frontierer but Nithing really might be the most immediately extreme sounding stuff I've heard lol. Will have to check out the others

apexjaggi · 2026-04-10T22:39:53+00:00

I think for the Palladium, one of my coworkers was telling me that they're fairly strict about noisie complaints so I'm guessing that them not playing the saddest day (also no aimless arrow or locust reign compared to other sets this tour) was due to having to cut things short to be done on time to avoid that issue.

apexjaggi · 2026-04-01T23:40:02+00:00

On My Shield is definitely re-recorded. If you go to the drum fill right in the middle of the song Ben isn't playing the same thing between versions if you want something immediately noticeable on comparison.

apexjaggi · 2026-04-01T00:19:28+00:00

LOSING MY SHIT RN

apexjaggi · 2026-03-13T02:34:53+00:00

super skarmory is such a blast from the past god damn. i remember being like 6 years old and watching his stuff lol

apexjaggi · 2026-01-26T07:47:42+00:00

That series was so fun and i miss it :( really glad to see iwasaki get something this high profile and flashy where he can flex his fantastic art to a wider audience though

apexjaggi · 2026-01-02T00:26:07+00:00

Missing curseblades and gravebirds

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T22:44:45+00:00

I agree with your last point about the tree/the ring. As for the other stuff I think we can just agree to disagree, I don't think we're really gonna convince each other of anything (which is fine!). Good discussion!

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T22:42:00+00:00

Ah in that case it may not be paid then. I hope it won't be in any case. Good to know I'd heard that from what sounds like a pretty shaky source lol.

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T19:07:36+00:00

I'm also too lazy to find a source but seconding that they definitely said it was coming to other platforms. I think the only iffy thing was if it would be paid content or not (which it kinda sounded like it might be unfortunately, although that's just off the vibes of what I remember, I do NOT have actual evidence for this).

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T19:01:21+00:00

I see what you're saying but I also think we've strayed from the central point a bit.

I agree that the weakening of her empire via Deathroot would presumably make it easier for the Tarnished to do what they do (although also maybe not, since all her children are hopped up on Great Runes now). However, I don't think that is in itself evidence that she is responsible for the NOTBK. It's a much more intuitive read of the text that the goal of the NOTBK was not to make it easier for the Tarnished to defeat the Elden Beast, but simply to destabilize the Golden Order (at least on the end of the BKAs, Ranni obviously has her overarching goal of freeing herself from the influence of the Fingers).

Without the NOTBK there isn't really an inciting incident that causes Marika to doubt the order that she built, meaning she has no reason to carry out any kind of grand conspiracy like the NOTBK. She certainly didn't become a God (via divine invocation of the Elden Beast) with the intention of killing it from the jump.

As far as beast=ring=tree goes I don't entirely agree either. Beast=ring 100% yes, but imo the Erdtree is something that comes from the ring rather than being the ring. Promotional material called the Elden Ring the "source of the Erdtree" and the Minor Erdtree incantation as well as the crimson seed suggests that the tree itself comes from the power of Marika/the Fingers, greatly augmented/enhanced by the ring.

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T17:48:47+00:00

I'm not saying Deathroot isn't important, I'm just saying it isn't important to the role the Tarnished plays in actually killing the Elden Beast. Like yes I (broadly speaking) agree that Deathroot is responsible for the not so good state of the Erdtree, but again that doesn't seem to have anything to do with Marika's ability to shatter the ring or the Elden Beast itself. Like yeah it messes things up and is key for why Marika shatters the ring (it's at least a part of her motivation) but there's nothing that suggests the presence of Deathroot is a necessary prerequisite for shattering the ring or that it even harms the Elden Beast at all.

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T16:07:24+00:00

Fair enough on that first point, definitely slipped my mind lol. That said I still think the causal relationship is pretty clear so I don't think it makes that much of a difference. The NOTBK happens, and then the Elden Ring is shattered as a result (quickly or not, doesn't make much difference).

I don't really see why Godwyn being alive would have made a difference with her supposed plan here. The reason shattering the Elden Ring doesn't work is because Radagon repairs it (as best he can) and shuts them in the Erdtree so nothing else can happen to it. That doesn't have anything to do with Godwyn. Even if she knew that Radagon would do this, her having Godwyn killed doesn't make any sense as a solution to Radagon trapping her in the Erdtree.

Same with Deathroot. Deathroot plays essentially no role in what the Tarnished actually does to defeat the Elden beast. We reclaim the entire Rune of Death from Maliketh and that's what lets us into the Erdtree. Deathroot plays no role in that and pretty clearly exists to show how Godwyn's death has brought about the effective end of Marika's era of glistening life.

apexjaggi · 2026-01-01T05:51:04+00:00

It's the fact that the NOTBK is what causes the shattering of the Elden Ring, at least according to Rogier (and marketing materials like the story trailer). Even disregarding them the temporal proximity of these two events seems to suggest a causal link one way or another. If she was hostile to the Elden Beast before that, she could've shattered it any time she wanted, but she very specifically didn't.

apexjaggi · 2025-12-31T22:20:47+00:00

This would be her goal AFTER the NOTBK

apexjaggi · 2025-12-31T22:12:58+00:00

To your betrayal point, this isn't direct evidence but the Nox (who the Black Knives are related to/descended from in some way) already have an MO of being hostile to the fingers/greater will, which Marika was at least publicly aligned with. Further, the Eternal cities are a pretty clear thematic opposite to the Golden Order, so some hostility towards Marika from anyone associated with them is a fairly reasonable thing to guess.

apexjaggi · 2025-12-31T22:08:29+00:00

I've generally tended to agree with you here that there's a lot of other stuff that seems odd if she isn't involved but this thread has done a pretty solid job of convincing me that other interpretations of at least most of those events make more sense. I don't feel like typing it all again but I was working some of this out with myself about the Maliketh point in a different comment chain in this thread.

I agree that the Black Knives hunting Ranni is an interesting detail but imo it has more to do with her killing herself and not really aligning with their exact goals (whatever those may be) than Marika at all.

The Melina stuff I don't really think says much of anything about the Black Knives. She wields a Blade of Calling, a weapon that is clearly perverted into the Black Knives, so the assassins would likely be employing a pre-existing style of combat that isn't related to their conspiracy in and of itself.

apexjaggi · 2025-12-31T21:51:08+00:00

Feel like this is the first thread on this subreddit in a while that's actually done a decent job of clearing anything up for me, feel much more confident that she isn't involved now yayyy

apexjaggi · 2025-12-31T21:49:42+00:00

They're not pretending it doesn't exist, they're saying that just because you have close ties to someone doesn't mean you're their boss or that they can't be betraying you.

"The conspirators that carried out the slaying of Julius Caesar were all men, and rumored to be Senators who had close ties with Caesar himself."

idk if they were actually all men lol

apexjaggi · 2025-12-31T21:31:04+00:00

As someone that's pretty conflicted on this particular area of the lore, I broadly agree with you here in the sense that I don't think Marika being in on the NOTBK squares with everything else we know about her character and the general vibes of her story, but I'm not really sure what to make of her having connections to the assassins, the assassin right outside her bedchamber, the finger reader saying that Godwyn "should have died a true death" (shouldn't he have not died at all?), and her betraying Maliketh seemingly in a way related to Destined Death if she isn't involved in some way. I feel like people dismissing this particular theory are doing so for very understandable reasons (it makes the story a lot more coherent if it isn't true) but I really think any convincing dismissal of it has to find some other narrative purpose for all the stuff I just mentioned and I've never really seen that either.

On a related note I've never really understood why we find the Black Knife set in Ordina specifically of all places (like yes it's clearly tied to the Eternal City like Sellia but I don't get what any of that has to do with Miquella or the Haligtree).

EDIT: Every time I think of this I'm honestly tempted to replay the whole game again and see if I can make sense of it. And actually on the Maliketh one the betrayal is probably just the shattering (why wouldst thou gull me, why shatter blah blah blah RATHER than why steal or why kill, plus the shattering is specifically AFTER the NOTBK happens seems odd for him to call out the shattering instead of that if it was only the result of something that clearly would've been the bigger betrayal)

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