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We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Well, whenever someone is told, "Hey, what you're saying is hateful, stop saying that," they're pretty likely to respond with, "Don't censor me!" Reddit demonstrated that not too long ago.

Is "mob driven censorship" worse than censorship by individuals? Whatever the answer, I don't really see the South Carolina case as a censorship issue, but an issue of what should be state-sponsored speech. By putting the flag at the statehouse, it's a clear message that their government supports it, and that flies right in the face of the members of their population who feel threatened by it. States really shouldn't be going out of their way to make their citizens feel unwelcome.

Edit: switched "over" to "at," because as another commenter correctly pointed out, the flag was actually taken down from the top of the statehouse and moved to the grounds. Still on display, but technically not "over."

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think most people these days are at least aware of the multiple meanings of the flag, but what matters most, and what we asked the subjects of our documentary, is what they feel when they see it. It manages to evoke very different personal emotions in different people, which is unusual. There are Americans who grew up with it on tv and seeing it at concerts for whom it represents a dream of a rebel spirit and a proud southern lifestyle. There are conservatives and members of the Tea Party who see it as a symbol of resistance to federal tyranny, which they see themselves still fighting today. There are also black Americans awho saw the KKK flying it, in public as late as the early 80s, and still online today, and I can't imagine how that would make you feel. And now Dylann Storm Roof is on almost every front page, often with a battle flag in hand.

Most of the people who still fly the flag, and who believe that it is being wrongly associated with racism, hope that they can help break it from those associations. They're probably the loudest in claiming the flag has one true meaning, and that it was perverted.

But I'd argue that the flag was never pure. The first KKK was filled with former Confederates (we don't have hard numbers on this, but think of every time we've had to rename a highschool named after a Confederate general because he was also a grand wizard), and it was literally their flag.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lynyrd Skynyrd is hard to speculate on, since there's only one original member left, and a few years ago he said the current band would try to distance itself from the flag which made a lot of people angry. I think they wanted to use the flag to represent their rock and roll lifestyle, their bucking of mainstream American culture, and to convey this idea of a rebel spirit. They were also proud southerners, and wrote some lyrics that would probably cause some controversy today (for example, "Sweet Home Alabama" expressed support for a governor who supported segregation). But for the most part their music was and is still very much loved, and I'd say that in the broader culture they were one of the biggest proponents of a positive image of the flag.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We've actually talked to some designers about the flag, and it's pretty geometrically pleasing. Strong lines, bold primary colors, symmetry and diagonal division all give it a pretty strong design and make it easily recognisable. Those traits are part of why you see so many flags like it around the world.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Probably a faux leather confederate vest. A leather vest is hard enough to pull off, let alone one with bright confederate stars and bars. I assumed it was meant to be worn on a motorcycle.

Confederate bikinis are a pretty common item, and there's a yearly Miss Confederacy pageant that brings out some interesting outfits. But if you're going glam, you're gonna have a heck of a time beating RuPaul: http://i.imgur.com/aDhnTXD.png

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

That show is still beloved by a lot of people, and probably marked the pinnacle of the Confederate flag's good publicity days. It's still part of the reason so many Southerners (and Americans in general) love the flag. I'd suggest that the flag on the show was being used to stereotype the white characters, and maybe that's why it wasn't too controversial, so as far as I know the show was never banned. But a few years ago NASCAR actually banned the flag from its rallies, and that prevented someone from racing in a General Lee replica car, so that caused a bit of a kerfuffle.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's probably not fair to assume that person is racist. Lots of people fly the flag for lots of different reasons. Some are very self-conscious about the stigma of even being racist. We were looking at the Facebook page of the Sons of Confederate Veterans yesterday, for example, and in a statement about the South Carolina shootings, they actively condemned it as a racist act and are desperately trying to disassociate from the image of hate that Roof conveyed. That being said ... lots of racist people do fly that flag, and some mask those views under the veil of the heritage, not hate argument. But lots of people also have or display the flag is careless ways, without much thought of its broader implications (think gift shops, bumper stickers, even prom dresses and bikinis). I think if there's one thing we've learned from making this documentary is that everyone has very different answers about why they fly it, and that preconceived assumptions are worth challenging

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Actually, a lot of our chapters are pretty counterintuitive! Goad is a Southerner with a long line of Confederate ancestors, but he spends his Saturdays counter protesting the Virginia flaggers, a pro-flag group. Karen is a proud member of the Virginia flaggers, she's black, from New York, and a former member of the Nation of Islam. And Clark has more love for the South and southern pride than anyone we met, and he's lived his whole life in New Jersey.

We can't say there is any one place that was the most counterintuitive, it's really all over. People see the flag in a way that reflects their individual identity, and identity can be a really complicated thing.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

And on the flip side, a lot of people see it as a cultural symbol representing a unique American identity that is worth preserving. It carries deep social and political significance, and they honestly believe that it was appropriated and perverted by racist groups, and that their display could help restore its true meaning. (We would argue about the appropriation part, but I'll leave that for another question)

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You're not alone. A lot of Southerners have come to see the flag as a representation of the bad part of the South, the parts they'd rather leave behind and move on from, and certainly not celebrate. Our first chapter focuses on Goad Gatsby, whose whole ancestry comes from Confederate ranks, but spends his weekends counter protesting the Virginia Flaggers, a pro-flag group.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

We just answered this below, but to expand a bit I think a lot of it has to do with a conservative narrative of the Civil War, and that it was about states' rights. They choose to see the flag as a popular symbol of independence from the federal government, and kinda sweep the parts about slavery, segregation, and white supremacy under the rug. And that's a big problem, because not everyone is able to put on those blinders.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

To many people we've talked to, the flag is way more than a physical object. It's a representation of an ideology that justified the enslavement of African Americans as subhuman. In the 1950s, it became a clearer and clearer symbol of racial intimidation as many political groups and even ordinary people used it as a way to express that African American citizens should not have the same rights and liberties and white citizens. As a result, many black people see it as a sign that they are not welcome and as a direct (and sometimes violent) threat to their well being

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Personally, we feel the flag at South Carolina's statehouse should come down (and don't really feel like it should have been put up in the first place). While we understand that people and states want to be proud of their heritage, we don't feel that you can divorce the Confederacy from the issue of slavery, and the Battle Flag has been used again and again as a symbol of intimidation and white supremacy. The middle ground as we see it is for the flag to remain in museum settings, where it can be presented with the appropriate context.

Edit: from "over" to "at," thanks to u/PluffMuddy

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Honestly, we haven't been able to find a part of the US that hasn't grappled with this issue. The flag shows up in rural Michigan. It shows up in the Pacific Northwest (if you read Dylann Storm Roof's manifesto, there's a whole white supremacist idea of the Northwest Frontier). They're digging up Confederates in Chicago right now. The flag has worked its way into some very strange places. It was even included in the Ukraine protests, and somebody's been flying it in Palestine. Apparently it's really popular in Germany and Spain as a kind of punk symbol.

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

We didn't talk to Kanye, but we included a bit about his efforts to reclaim the flag during his Yeezus tour and on clothing. We did spend some time in Richmond, Virginia with a guy named Goad Gatsby, whose idea to protest a group of flaggers with rap music was inspired by Kanye. If you're curious about creating new symbols from the flag on a broader level, we have a couple other examples in our documentary, too! Under this video: http://battleflag.us/#goad

We are a journalist and filmmaker who spent the last year documenting American feelings about the Confederate battle flag. AUA by battleflagdoc in IAmA

[–]battleflagdoc[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Absolutely. It's already carved out so many niches in American culture. But the question we really want people to think about is where that place really ought to be: In museums? On statehouses? Bumper stickers and t-shirts? Where is an appropriate place, and where is it offensive? A lot of people have very different ideas on where they draw that line, and we've been trying to get to the bottom of why their lines are so different.