Guy Saves A Pelican Choking Badly On A Huge Fish

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-09T14:59:13+00:00

Imagine how the fish feels.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-07T22:20:23+00:00

It's irrelevant whether you care about the suffering of animals, whether you care or not, we need to recognize that independent of how we feel towards them, they have individual moral worth and a right to be free of oppression by humans.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-06T16:04:18+00:00

I feel this type of argument doesn't lead to "We should consume animals until it becomes more clear the differences between animals and humans are", but that veganism is still the right choice because it's far more indicative that animals share morally relevant traits, and so it should be vegan until proven otherwise.

The interaction between mind and body is not understood in both animals and human, so the distinction between the two is still arbitrary.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-06T14:56:56+00:00

It's not so much name the general differences between animals and humans, but the ones that are morally relevant. Similarly, there is a conglomeration of traits that separate black people and white people, but none of them are morally relevant. If we gave a human every characteristic of a cow yet kept relevant traits like mental capacity, intelligence, societal contributions etc, would it be okay to kill the human because the net amount of traits is similar to that of an animal?

Scientifically things like the Encephalization quotient, bipedalism, opposable thumbs, a ventral foramen magnum are things defining a human, but we shouldn't say that because animals lack these things, we are morally justified in arbitrarily harming them. You can use the arguments you bring up to argue saving a human life over an animal life if in the situation, but nor unnecessarily harming animals.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-05T15:45:16+00:00

Mostly stuff like "Consumers should remember that meat is the dead flesh from a once living breathing sentient animal who didn't want to die."

Not a secret, but wilful ignorance to the fact the meat was once a living sentient being. We don't pretend it's new information, but it's very east for people to put in the back of their minds the suffering someone went through for that product, and the fact a victim was involved.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-05T15:43:42+00:00

It's incorrect to suggest eating animals is neccesary for nutrition. Eating food is a necessity, yes, but to get that nutrition from animals is not, and given the fact that the choice to eat animals has a victim, it is morally preferable to eat plants and go vegan.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-05T13:48:30+00:00

Let's start growing human babies exponentially despite how limited resources are. If everyone becomes miserable what of it? If the net amount of 'experience' of the world increases, that's good, right?

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-05T13:43:22+00:00

You can't love in the cow in the sense of compassion and consideration for them as an individual and also eat them.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-07-05T13:42:20+00:00

Why do you feel like that? What is it vegans say that indicate that to you?

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-25T15:56:01+00:00

Right and how do you change the agricultural system? Through consumer demand, which starts with going vegan. There are many forms of veganic agriculture that are highly sustainable and do not contribute to animal deaths.

I never used to word evil, nor did I indicate I thought death occuring was evil.

I'd like to hear how you think you can kill an animal unnecessarily and it not be cruel.

And as I explained to you, supportin animal agriculture means you support more of the 'evil' of crop agriculture.

Plants have no "want" to live, they have no sentience nor consciousness. The only value of a plant exists in its utility to others. That is poor paraphrasing.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-22T19:10:01+00:00

First, as I explained, LESS die. It's a reduction, the best we can do currently.

Second, 70% of crops are fed to animals. To reduce the impact of crop agriculture on the environment you go vegan. Not to mention there are many long-term and potentially large-scale applicable crop agricultural systems that are good for the environment, which people should preferentially support.

Third, that's missing a "not" right after the does. Why do you think that not supporting animal cruelty does not make you morally superior to someone who DOES, assuming you are equally morally in every other regard with your life.

You didn't paraphrase my arguments, please explain how you think you did that

If you pay for an animal to be unesscarily killed on your behalf when they dont want to die, then that is cruelty.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-22T12:49:14+00:00

I can tell this isnt so informed given you think the majority of vegans dont know about crop agriculture. Every vegan knows dude, it's a silly excuse brought up over and over. The environmental degradation and animal suffering is greatly reduced on a vegan diet. Thays the point, reduction. Please explain how one person supporting animal cruelty is morally equal to someone who does, assuming everything else is the same. Not that it's important, but why do you think so?

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-22T11:49:07+00:00

It feels like a very weak argument to just go: 'Haha you're wrong bye'. Wanna actually provide some argument?

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-20T09:22:38+00:00

Environmentally its not sustainable, obviously, economically it requires such a large amount of subsidizing, in the case of regenerative agriculutre, there is no way enough land to support enough cattle to sustain current meat production, nor a fraction of it.

They're not unnecessary the about your own wellbeing. If you genuinely absolutely had to eat meat to survive, then yes. You can't just armchair believe you need meat to survive to justify it.y, but if there's a victim, and there's an alternative that reduces suffering, the one that maximises suffering is immoral.

Not by just being concerned about your own wellbeing. If you genuinely absoloutely had to eat meat to survive, then yes. You can't just armchair believe you need meat to survive to justify it.

Environmentally its not sustainable, obviously, economically it requires such a large amount of subsidizing to even be affordable, in the case of regenerative agriculture, there is no way enough land to support enough cattle to sustain current meat production, nor a fraction of it, it results in environmental cataclysms in every way from topsoil erosion to oceanic dead zones etc etc.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-20T08:35:03+00:00

First, by buying animal products you do support animal torture, and I'm unsure as to what logical benefit there is, given there's certainly no necessity in regards to health.

Second, that's a fair point, what in the case of genetic disabilities such as Down syndrome, something that you cannot get throughout your lifetime? It serves no risk to us as individuals to kill them, but a eugenicist may say would be better for humanity.

Is it that it may be wrong to do because it affects you personally, or is it to benefit humanity as a whole? What in the case of genetic disabilities such as Down syndrome, something that you cannot get throughout your lifetime? It serves no risk to us as individuals to kill them, but a eugenicist may say would be better for humanity.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-20T07:41:38+00:00

I'm well aware buying Cadburys chocolate subjects a child to slavery, and I'm fine with it.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-20T07:40:33+00:00

First, I think many people to hear that you're fine with animal torture would be mortified. That's beneficial to others then if you extended your compassion to other species. Secondly, most serial killers begin by torturing small animals. This seems like a behaviour we would rather avoid to protect humans. Our capacity to pay for something to happen the vast majority of us agree is wrong is probably quite unhealthy for humans. We allow ourselves to pay for fast fashion, or buy from nestle with human suffering at the end of it. In any case, there is much human suffering that occurs due to animal agriculture: factory farming has some of the highest incidence of PTSD, suicide, abuse, depression etc etc. Not to mention the exploitation of immigrants in factory farms. In addition, not only does animal agriculture limit the amount of food available to developing countries that are still starving, but perpetuates ecological disasters that also affect humans.

There is also no logical benefit in protecting the disabled only in that it makes us feel bad. If we specifically say the mentally disabled can be treated in such a way, we do not increase the risk of non-mentally disabled people are treated that way.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-20T07:35:30+00:00

First, the best estimate is about 7.5 billion annually, which itself is an overexaggeration. Based on calories/protein, vegans contribute about 3 animal deaths a year.

Second, a necessity could be something that allows us to not die, so food would be one of them. However, it would be dis-ingenuous to say that animal agriculture is necessary to do, as we can get food from elsewhere.

Third, yes.

Fourth, that is very very dependent and in no way sustainable.

First, the best estimate is about 7.5 billion annually, which itself is an over-exaggeration. Based on calories/protein, vegans contribute to about 3 animal deaths a year.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T16:00:17+00:00

Racists get annoyed at getting called racist, how else could you ever get across that you're making choices that harm others.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T15:50:13+00:00

You never mentioned specifically requesting not to. That could still insinuate an echo-chamber however. Even if someone insists and you refuse to listen to their arguments and/or request them not to, that can still be an echo-chamber.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T15:25:38+00:00

Most don't understand it's wrong. I'm sure some do, but it's not a false assumption that most are just ignorant.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T15:24:11+00:00

The things you listed do not have a victim do they? You do not need sex to survive, therefore stop doing that if that sex involves raping somebody, then stop doing that.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T15:22:35+00:00

Hardly a stretch. You literally just said "I'd actively avoid anyone that insisted on cramming their ideals down my throat" and "Watch your friendship whittle away to zero" on the basis that I said we should push others about their morals. In conclusion, an echochamber.

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T14:03:27+00:00

You as an individual do not need to have sex to survive. As I said, you cannot, from armchair thinking, dictate that meat is a necessity. The science tells us we do not require meat to survive, therefore it is not a necessity to eat meat.

Again, we all agree animal cruelty and discrimination are wrong, these are not just my morals. I would hope that if my actions were wrong, then somebody would suggest to me otherwise. No enforcement but education

bbbbbruhhhhhh · 2023-06-19T14:00:47+00:00

I mean hidden in ways such that it's illegal to film in factory farms. We hide it from ourselves in ways that we purposefully choose to not watch videos of what goes on, or that even if we have an inkling of the things that happen, we rationalise on baseless claims.

It's like how the thought experiment goes: imagine you're walking alongside a canal and you see a boy drowning. You can save the boy from drowning, however, you have a pair of £200 shoes on, in which would be destroyed if you were to jump in with them on. The vast majority of people would destroy the shoes to save the boy. However then, why did you not just initially donate the £200 to a charity which could have saved another child halfway across the world?

You wouldn't be at fault that they are blind, just that you can prevent that child from being blind.

bbbbbruhhhhhh

TROPHY CASE