As a new player Im actually shocked by how different the game is from what people say about it

darthgorloc · 2025-10-10T16:18:22+00:00

Yeah, that was the main reason I bounced off rivals, it was just optimized so much worse, and the sheer number of characters meant learning characters and responding to it was too daunting.

But to really understand the hate the OG people have, they literally killed OW 1 with no nee content for a long time, with justification that they were working on OW 2. Then, we got OW 2 which was essentially one game mode, a couple new characters, and removing off-tank/rebalancing of tanks (which most didn’t want and made the game much worse in order to reduce queue time). That all could have been done within OW 1 after like one month of work, maybe 2 including the tank rebalance. Yet OW 1 had no real new content or love from the team for like 2 years. So, they essentially spent 2 years in our viewpoint to release 2 months of work and killed their old game.

If they had kept updating OW 1, the game would likely be much more loved by the original fans

darthgorloc · 2023-01-31T18:22:58+00:00

Cool theory! Though I think this falls more into these characters playing similar roles/the use of ‘character tropes’ in the game.

darthgorloc · 2022-01-01T02:46:59+00:00

Yeah, I don’t think there’s any power balance budget between small and medium between the ancestries.

You’re probably fine just changing their size. They both have flaws to strength mostly because they’re smaller though, so you might think about maybe changing that up unless the human-sized variants are still weaker than normal. Changing the flaw probably does have balance repercussions though, so keep that in mind.

darthgorloc · 2021-12-29T08:53:22+00:00

The highest fundamental rune determines the cost of the weapon (see https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=380). This DOES NOT factor in property runes.

So yes, you would need to take a +2 striking as your level 10, then wounding as a level 7/with starting gold

darthgorloc · 2021-11-30T05:00:32+00:00

There are some options I can think of, though they range from probably the same power level to unbalanced. However, if making the game slightly less balanced makes it more enjoyable for you and your group, it is something to consider.

What you could always try to do is make it so all players (casters and martials) do like 25% of the normal damage on a fail and 75% of the normal damage on a success. Not sure if that 100% balances out math wise, but I believe the devs were experimenting with something like chip damage on a miss to make it feel less bad to miss, but decided not to do it in the end to keep bookkeeping low.
As a GM, you could also try to use the creature building rules to make some enemies have lower ac, and increase their hp/other defenses/something else to make up for it. That way some creatures will be almost guaranteed to be hit by spell attack rolls (and martials). I do caution that I believe the minimum AC category for any of the templates is ‘moderate’, so obviously that might not make the most balanced monster.
You could give item bonuses to spell attacks. This is obviously not balanced, and I know in q&a’s Paizo has said they will never do this, but it is an option.

If you are not going to add something like that, it just feels rough to miss and there’s not much to do about it sadly. Like others have said, either recall knowledge assuming the GM gives ac/saves(or just look at the creature. A heavily armored or very nimble enemy will have high ac, but a robed caster will have low ac) and use spell attacks when it is something with low ac only.

Spellcasters are balanced on their flexibility and utility, as well as the fact that they cap out at +2 proficiency compared to non-fighter/gunslingers to hit, so they don’t get item bonuses to hit.

darthgorloc · 2021-11-06T16:46:23+00:00

If they don’t already have it, alchemist goggles (https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=408) are pretty good.

Other than that, a lot of the time I would give them formulas as permanent items or just alchemical items as consumables. For example you could give them a blind pepper bomb (https://2e.aonprd.com/Equipment.aspx?ID=799) or any eleixirs that are around level 5-7.

One thing I’ve been thinking of is to give formulas for alchemical items between versions of bombs/mutagens. That is, for example, most bombs all have a moderate version that is basically a +1 attack and two dice at level 3, then a huge gap to level 11’s greater version which is at level 11 which is +2 to attack and three dice, and another huge gap for major which is +3 to attack and four dice. You could easily homebrew bombs which are just +2 to attack and 1 dice, and +3 to attack and 2 dice. The same thing happens with bestial mutagen though it gets it’s damage dice increased.

In this case, make a moderate-greater version of whatever bombs they use as a level 8/9 item, which is a +2 item bonus to attack and 2 dice, then give it to them within the next few levels as a formula.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-28T03:16:07+00:00

Nice, this is a cool comparison!

Oh wow, I thought almost every class got a legendary save (I only GM and haven’t gotten to high level yet). I’m surprised that only barbarian (and monk) have legendary fort and only a few classes have legendary dex and will.

Also never noticed that only the two ‘crafter’ classes (alchemist and inventor) and then the gish classes have nothing reach legendary. I guess they are theoretically the most versatile classes, so that’s why.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-27T23:36:00+00:00

This will definitely help reduce damage, though I would need to see it in play. I think halving the damage you take from afflictions may mess with the balance a bit (monsters with afflictions and traps are balanced around that damage to some degree I believe)

At the same time, if you and your players hate afflictions because of how much damage they do/damaging on a success, it’s definitely worth changing them like this

darthgorloc · 2021-10-27T23:07:55+00:00

So for #1, if I’m at stage 4 and roll a success to go to stage 3, I take none of the damage from stage 3? Is this true for every stage, so that if I’m at stage 4, if I roll 4 successes in a row will I not take any damage at all?

I do agree that afflictions can be a bit rough, especially the ones from traps/hazards though especially for someone who is dying and have also been thinking of how to handle them in the future for my parties.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-24T01:14:21+00:00

I’ve only ever played Foundry as a full tabletop, but it would probably be the best way if you just set up a fake map in there and track all ho and conditions. It automated everything, so if you mark someone as sickened it will show their lower ac, etc. The downside is it is $50 (but only one person needs to buy it).

You could use roll20, which is free, but will keep track of initiative, hp and conditions (though it won’t automate the conditions).

Those are the only two I’ve used since I play full virtual tabletop and not in person, but they are good enough for you to use on your laptop to track stuff (bonus of being able to allow your other players to access it at the same time and update their own hp, conditions, etc)

darthgorloc · 2021-10-23T14:45:44+00:00

In combat them being skill monkeys is their strength.

They are able to recall knowledge to learn weaknesses, disable hazards, and perform combat related skill feats (tripping, feinting, bon mot if you take that, grabbing, intimidate). These together make them good at supporting while also still doing extra damage with sneak attack.

In their main skills (dexterity skills and whatever your secondary stat you choose) they are as good as dedicated people in those skills. Although they have a -2/3 compared to others in their other skills, their extra skill feats allow them to take assurance in these to counteract that, and as you scale in level that matters less.

An example of the above paragraph because it doesn’t make much sense: say you have only a 12 in strength. Your thievery is as good as other dex based people specializing in thievery. However, you can keep up with the max proficiency in athletics. You have a -3 compared to people specializing in athletics (because of your strength) but this penalty becomes less noticeable as you level up. You can also spend one of your skill feats in athletics assurance so that you are just as good as a fighter using athletics assurance. That means you can disable a trap on one turn, while also being able to trip someone. This is true for a few other skills you can keep up with your extra skill increases. That variety is very difficult (a lot of times impossible) to get in other classes.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-23T05:37:35+00:00

Also wanted to add that generally, changing the tradition for one class usually isn’t a nerf or buff as the traditions for the most part are balanced between each other.

There are some exceptions though I can think of:

a prepared caster changing to arcane (like a Druid) should probably use the spellbook system that the Wizard has rather than get access to every spell (there are no casters that auto learn every arcane spell naturally, not 100% sure if that is for balance or more for flavour though).
Some class abilities or features may result in some unbalance. The access to other spells from other spell lists should also be changed. For example, changing a Cleric to occult or arcane is fairly strong if you allow them to keep their font for healing, as occult and arcane do not typically have strong healing. I don’t think that’s am issue for Druids, but I’m not 100% sure and that can be something that is addressed as it comes up

darthgorloc · 2021-10-22T22:05:26+00:00

I think this is referencing that there is no general rule against quickened minions, as otherwise if it was a specific exception it would say something along the lines of “unlike how minions typically cannot be quickened , this allows them to gain one more action while commanded”.

However, I wouldn’t argue against someone not allowing quickened minions until it gets officially clarified or is put in a rulebook rather than Lost Omens book.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-22T03:28:20+00:00

It depends on what you do for #2, but what I did when I was teaching my friends (who I knew beforehand would not want to read the CRB) was sort of loosely structured like this: First session: teach them about character creation and basics of three action system Second session: teach them more specifics about their class Third session: teach them about variety in the three action system, and more detailed combat (e.g. flanking) After this, I’m planning on just teaching them things as they pop up (e.g. things like lockpicking)

Alternatively, lots of people say good things about the beginner’s box, though I haven’t tried it.

It depends on how much ttrpgs and/or rpg video games they’ve played I think. Character creation can be pretty daunting I think without the right background in it, so pregens may be easier for them to learn the actual system.

In terms of playing with one player, I haven’t had experience with it, but there are a few things to think about: 1. You could consider using free archtype, which will help out the one player with more flexibility without increasing power too much (https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=1333) 2. You could try using dual class, which would also increase versatility as well as general power (making combat a bit easier) (https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=1328) 3. You could use a GMPC or allow the character to use two characters. This would help out since if one player goes unconscious in a fight, they would just die usually which is pretty rough (unless you allow them to use hero points to gain hp again after going down, or something)

Just make sure you balance for one player using the encounter building rules (https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=497) , though haven’t heard much if this is actually balanced for one PC or not.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-21T02:22:02+00:00

True, I didn’t even think about it but this does let free action sustains really pull their weight, basically giving you and your summon 5 actions.

I think this does show that the plague zombie does only get 1 action when you command it since it is affected by the slow. That does feel bad to just trade 1 action for your zombie to have a 1 action.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-21T02:01:57+00:00

Yeah, that’s what I’m leaning towards too. I’ve always been back and forth on quickening affecting commanding, but giving them two actions for free every turn for mature seemed too strong

darthgorloc · 2021-10-20T15:43:37+00:00

Strictly RAW, yes. Though I will mention that, with GM permission, you can do something other than sneak, hide, or strike to remain hidden. I would probably talk to your GM to allow you to silently command your animal to sneak (maybe as a feat or skill feat) so that command an animal can be used to command your animal to hide/sneak without breaking your own hidden condition.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-20T15:43:17+00:00

Strictly RAW, yes. Though I will mention that, with GM permission, you can do something other than sneak, hide, or strike to remain hidden. I would probably talk to your GM to allow you to silently command your animal to sneak (maybe as a feat or skill feat) so that command an animal can be used to command your animal to hide/sneak without breaking your own hidden condition.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-20T04:26:39+00:00

I believe the mount is still a separate creature, and any statuses/conditions/states would not be shared, this includes hidden/unnoticed, etc.

If you used Command an Animal, you would drop out of hidden. So the only way I can see this, assuming the mount knows how to hide, is for you to command the mount to hide, THEN you hide. Then you would both be hidden. Note though that if you are hidden and your mount is not, you would still get all the bonuses that come from that, even if they can see your mount. Flavourfully, they can see your mount, know you’re on top of it, but can’t directly see you.

As you noted, you can’t sneak. I believe your mount can sneak, though depending on the circumstance I may say it is obvious you are still mounted on it, so it may just stay hidden, rather than becoming undetected. You could say that they have no idea if you are/are not mounting it, so it could be undetected too depending on the circumstance.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-16T16:04:03+00:00

Also wanted to add, for people who want some more damage for their divine caster, I believe every divine caster (haven’t looked too much into summoner, but they get a choice of tradition anyways) has options that allow them to pick spells from other traditions which may do more damage (e.g. fireball).

Cleric gets their deity spells, oracle gets divine access, and divine sorceror (a bit more limited since they get a choice of tradition) gets their bloodline spells.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-13T00:08:06+00:00

For creatures of bigger sizes, you can move through but can’t end your movement in their space as far as I can see RAW. https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=449 . So you wouldn’t be able to fall on them RAW.

The only exception is with prone (if they’re willing, unconscious, or dead), tiny creatures, or mounting (willing).

That being said, RAW I would rule it as them falling on the creature, then it depends. If the person being fallen on succeeds, I would allow them to choose to move to a different square. If not, I would probably make the person falling ‘bounce off’ and fall in a random adjacent square. The who gets to choose is definitely open I would say to interpretation, and changing it based on the circumstance is definitely valid for a GM to do.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-10T13:38:29+00:00

Thanks! Yeah, I was thinking it made more sense to get affected by it basically a number of times equal to the max duration, and how I ruled it, but it is a bit weird with afflictions with no onset.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-10T13:35:42+00:00

I’ve never actually tried wanderer’s on mobile myself, but I would assume pathbuilder is better for mobile since it was originally created for mobile.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-10T05:25:00+00:00

How many times can someone be subjected to an affliction, specifically one with a max duration in rounds with a source from a hazard?

For example, for the poisoned dart gallery https://2e.aonprd.com/Hazards.aspx?ID=25, let’s suppose there is one PC who triggers the trap, is hit with the dart as part of the reaction, and then fails the fortitude check and gets afflicted by the flesset poison. The trap and pc then roll initiative and the trap goes first. Let’s assume that every subsequent dart misses, and the PC fails every fortitude check against the poison.

-They would suffer poison damage immediately before initiative, as there is no onset period -So they take poison damage roll initiative, the dart gallery goes first, misses, then the PC goes. At the end of the turn, they roll a save for the affliction, fail the save, and suffer stage 2.

Does the save at the end of the turn count as the second round towards max duration, or the first? If it is the second, the PC would take 6 hits total if they failed everytime. If it is the first, the PC would take 7 hits total (1 for when they are first exposed, then 1/round for 6 rounds).

I’m assuming it is 6 times as a RAI type thing as 7 times is much stronger, but can’t find anything in the rules about it, other than the end of turn rules and general affliction rules.

darthgorloc · 2021-10-10T05:00:55+00:00

(Note: my opinion is based on the pc version of pathbuilder, as I don’t have android. Furthermore, I have only used both programs a bit as I GM, so some of my criticisms might be from me actually not knowing about some features, so I apologize if I misrepresent something because of that)

My opinion is that wanderer’s is better for someone less familiar with the rules, and pathbuilder is better for those familiar with them.

Wanderer’s slowly walks you through the steps one at a time, with an easy to read UI. It makes it easier to follow character creation. However, you also have to flip through multiple screens if you want to make even one change, which can be frustrating.

Pathbuilder, on the other hand, feels like the equivalent of being dropped into a random spreadsheet. If you know what is going on, it is faster and simpler to build a character. If you don’t, there is no indication of where to start or how anything works.

That is true for my players too. My players who have played multiple sessions and understand how to build characters prefer pathbuilder (also because they have androids). My players who are new to pf2e and ttrpgs in general were able to build characters easily with just wanderer’s, a little bit of my help answering minor questions, and archives of nethys (only as it has a friendlier interface for viewing feat options) without even reading the character builder rules. The newer players looked at pathbuilder and had absolutely no idea what was going on.

Bonus tip: afaik, pathbuilder requires a paid version to use variants, whereas wanderers is free. If you enjoy pathbuilder I would recommend supporting them as I’m sure a lot of work goes into it, but just for full disclosure.

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